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UnderGround Forums >> Weidman proves what Ive been saying for years

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1/6/14 7:17 PM
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FETT_GayFerPayNINJA
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iwatchsomemma - Silva is a stand-up striker who counters exceptionally.

He minimizes ground work which is where I think he's most vulnerable at.

Those mind games and antics were to keep the fight on the feet where he excels.

Weidman got Silva all figured out.

Vitor would beat Silva now. Maybe a few others Silva has beaten can do the same.


Riiiiight, becuse back when Vitor and those guys fought Andy they had no clue that the ground was where he was most vulnerable. Chris was the first to bring this shocking revalation to the masses. They were all in the dark and never even tried to get Andy to the ground...lol.

1/6/14 8:22 PM
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ISawSilva'sBONEr
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Everyone whose anyone knows silva is the goat.

Your all irrelevant and no body cares about your opinion. Phone Post 3.0
1/6/14 9:10 PM
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mmamonstar
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If you ain't got Fedor ,wand or chuck as 1 of your favorites then this thread is shit and I don't believe anything you say Phone Post 3.0
1/6/14 11:27 PM
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1a1
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Anderson lost to Chris both times is the stand up portion of the fight. He fought better wrestlers then Chris, he lost cuz Chris brought everything together and prolly also cuz Anderson is old. Hypothetically saying he would have lost to a Jon Fitch type fighter is silly. How do you know? Cuz of one fight with Chael when he was juiced and Anderson was injured? Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 10:31 AM
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MasterofMartialArts
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Wally Saves -
MasterofMartialArts - 
kevsh - "But if you had put three or 4 division 1 national champions in his division we would never be talking about him as the GOAT."

This is what bothers me when people talk about who is the GOAT, or this guy would beat that guy. You are making the mistake of stating an opinion as fact.

We will never know how Anderson would've done against elite wrestlers unfortunately, but claiming he would've lost to these hypothetical fighters is nonsense. What we do know is Silva dominated his division unchallenged for longer than anyone has, at any weight.
Great point.

You can't take away from a fighters accomplishments by using hypotheticals. Phone Post 3.0

This type of logic does not compute here.
I hope you are being sarcastic. Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 11:10 AM
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Hawthorne
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"Imagine if his first or second fight would have been against a 6' 2" 210 John Fitch who cut to 185. He would have been grinded on for 3 rounds."

*Unzips*
1/7/14 11:13 AM
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Lite
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Fade7 - Frankly, you're not the first to suggest such things and for a long time you would have been wrong, esp when he beat Sonnen twice.

Pretty much this. Silva took out his share of wrestlers. Nonetheless, he was the last of the "style" champion who wasn't that well-rounded.
1/7/14 11:40 AM
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eljamaiquino
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Lite -
Fade7 - Frankly, you're not the first to suggest such things and for a long time you would have been wrong, esp when he beat Sonnen twice.

Pretty much this. Silva took out his share of wrestlers. Nonetheless, he was the last of the "style" champion who wasn't that well-rounded.
Ihear this, but I always think, how many other champions have defended titles. Now how many have decisions, sub wins, and kos among their defenses? I can only think of Mighty Mouse and Bones. If a guy isn't good enough to sub, ko, and decision challengers, how can he ve well rounded? Phone Post 3.0
1/7/14 11:42 AM
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ausgepicht
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FETT_GayFerPayNINJA - 

Yes totally. Henderson Sonnen Okami and Marquart are terrible grapplers...

What an idiotic thread. 


Man, it pains me to agree with GayFerPay, but he's fucking right. Facts are facts.

While you could debate that those guys - excepting Sonnen who almost won using it - didn't really utilize their wrestling that well in their fights with him, to say you never considered PFP is just madness.

The only debate when it comes to Silva relating to PFP talk is whether he is the PFP best ever or he's the 2nd best.

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1/7/14 11:52 AM
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Lite
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eljamaiquino - 
Lite -
Fade7 - Frankly, you're not the first to suggest such things and for a long time you would have been wrong, esp when he beat Sonnen twice.

Pretty much this. Silva took out his share of wrestlers. Nonetheless, he was the last of the "style" champion who wasn't that well-rounded.
Ihear this, but I always think, how many other champions have defended titles. Now how many have decisions, sub wins, and kos among their defenses? I can only think of Mighty Mouse and Bones. If a guy isn't good enough to sub, ko, and decision challengers, how can he ve well rounded? Phone Post 3.0

I would say what Silva had, in addition to amazing striking, was a champion's composure. You could wrestlefuck him as Sonnen did in their first fight, but it only takes one mistake, and there's five rounds. Silva was a defensive fighter who waited for his chance.
1/7/14 12:01 PM
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nowaydo
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Agree, been saying it for years too!

I don't know if Anderson could of beaten GSP's opponents.

Still...most skilled fighter of all times.
1/9/14 5:21 PM
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garfner
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crazydave - 

Henderson

Sonnen

Okami

Marquart


Okami and Marquart are not division 1 champion wrestlers. and I dont think Okami even attempted a take down anyway.

Henderson won the first round using his wrestling, Then comes out like his usual brawling showman self throwing haymakers.

Sonnen took him down at will in the first fight and got caught in the fifth round. In his second fight it was more of the first fight in the first round and then sonnen decided to do a spinning elbow for some insane reason.

But had the first been a non championship then sonnen wins via decision.

If Silva had to climb the ranks against ground and pound elite wrestlers like Kos Hughes and Fitch I dont believe he would have made it to the championship.

I dont believe you can say this about the other pfp canadates.
1/9/14 6:30 PM
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Zachlibs
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garfner - Chris basically proves what Ive been saying about anderson for years. I've never considered Anderson a pfp guy because of the division that he is in. If 185 was stocked full of elite wrestlers like Matt Hughes, John Fitch, Josh Kos, Hendriks and GSP I really dont think he would have ever made it to the title match. One of those guys would have layed and preyed him for 3 rounds. Imagine if his first or second fight would have been against a 6' 2" 210 John Fitch who cut to 185. He would have been grinded on for 3 rounds. Chris is basically a big version of these guys. The only other guys in 185 that fit this bill is accident prone older Sonnen and wild swinging old Henderson who fights like a brawler not a wrestler.
Instead 185 was full of brawlers. even when they moved him up to 205 they put him against brawlers(Irvin, Griffin, Bonnar). This guy is a brawlers worst nightmare. He decisioned in lack luster fights against good bjj guys like Maia and Leites who would not brawl and swing wildly with him.
I dont care what division you put Jones or GSP in. or Cain. Their styles and skillset would have made them champions at any wieght no matter who was in the division. I dont think you can say the same for Anderson. ANDERSON IS MMAS BEST STRIKER OF ALL TIME. But if you had put three or 4 division 1 national champions in his division we would never be talking about him as the GOAT.
BTW my two favorite fighters are Brazilian. Vitor and Murilo Bustamante just in case you think I have red white and blue colored glasses on. My other 3 all time favorites would be Carlos Newton, Evan Tanner and Sak. And I dont even like Jones or Cain but I do recognize their talent as pfp guys. Anderson is an amazing fighter and I would agree that he is MMAs striking GOAT but not the all around GOAT.
100% OP. I've said this for the longest god damn time ever Phone Post 3.0
1/9/14 7:02 PM
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eljamaiquino
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Zachlibs -
garfner - Chris basically proves what Ive been saying about anderson for years. I've never considered Anderson a pfp guy because of the division that he is in. If 185 was stocked full of elite wrestlers like Matt Hughes, John Fitch, Josh Kos, Hendriks and GSP I really dont think he would have ever made it to the title match. One of those guys would have layed and preyed him for 3 rounds. Imagine if his first or second fight would have been against a 6' 2" 210 John Fitch who cut to 185. He would have been grinded on for 3 rounds. Chris is basically a big version of these guys. The only other guys in 185 that fit this bill is accident prone older Sonnen and wild swinging old Henderson who fights like a brawler not a wrestler.
Instead 185 was full of brawlers. even when they moved him up to 205 they put him against brawlers(Irvin, Griffin, Bonnar). This guy is a brawlers worst nightmare. He decisioned in lack luster fights against good bjj guys like Maia and Leites who would not brawl and swing wildly with him.
I dont care what division you put Jones or GSP in. or Cain. Their styles and skillset would have made them champions at any wieght no matter who was in the division. I dont think you can say the same for Anderson. ANDERSON IS MMAS BEST STRIKER OF ALL TIME. But if you had put three or 4 division 1 national champions in his division we would never be talking about him as the GOAT.
BTW my two favorite fighters are Brazilian. Vitor and Murilo Bustamante just in case you think I have red white and blue colored glasses on. My other 3 all time favorites would be Carlos Newton, Evan Tanner and Sak. And I dont even like Jones or Cain but I do recognize their talent as pfp guys. Anderson is an amazing fighter and I would agree that he is MMAs striking GOAT but not the all around GOAT.
100% OP. I've said this for the longest god damn time ever Phone Post 3.0
Why doesn't anyone say the inverse? All the demon strikers are at 185. Silva, machida, vitor, mousasi. Gsp has never fought a ko artist other than Hendricks. And that was his worst win. Hendricks, penn, and serra are Power strikers and Gso had trouble with them. Every one of the divisions above 155 are tilted one way or another. If you say Silva had trouble with wrestlers, so did Fedor. Gsp and Cain had trouble with strikers, but no-one shits on them because they had a grapple heavy division... Phone Post 3.0
1/9/14 7:10 PM
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Lick Boners
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Silva fought Belfort, GSP fought Alves, Diaz, Hendricks, Condit :)
1/9/14 8:25 PM
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FETT_GayFerPayNINJA
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garfner -
crazydave - 

Henderson

Sonnen

Okami

Marquart


Okami and Marquart are not division 1 champion wrestlers. and I dont think Okami even attempted a take down anyway.

Henderson won the first round using his wrestling, Then comes out like his usual brawling showman self throwing haymakers.

Sonnen took him down at will in the first fight and got caught in the fifth round. In his second fight it was more of the first fight in the first round and then sonnen decided to do a spinning elbow for some insane reason.

But had the first been a non championship then sonnen wins via decision.

If Silva had to climb the ranks against ground and pound elite wrestlers like Kos Hughes and Fitch I dont believe he would have made it to the championship.

I dont believe you can say this about the other pfp canadates.
You need to rewatch the Okami and Henderson fights.

Okami tried, and failed.

Henderson in the second round tried multiple times to get back on the ground and FAILED. Phone Post 3.0
1/9/14 8:54 PM
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UGCTT_Nightkap
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DakenTattoo - So if I start bashing Weidman now about his weakness to guys who hit and run and he eventually loses years from now to a Machidaesque fighter does that make me a fucking prophet?

OP is retarded.

Also amazing how you remove Anderson and now MW is fresh and exciting. Sure. That's what happens when the Champ is so dominant.

ANDY=GOAT
Bam Phone Post 3.0
1/9/14 8:59 PM
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UGCTT_Nightkap
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Also Silva had the 2nd best tdd in mw history iirc. .. (according to Goldy) Phone Post 3.0
1/9/14 9:03 PM
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Jons Forsberg
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FullyLoadedFists - Anytime Silva had a sketchy performance it was against a wrestler. Had he never moved up from 170 to 185, and faced the gauntlet of high-level wrestlers at WW while having less of a speed advantage, he would have run into a lot of problems. Especially before the later period in his career where he made improvement on his tdd. Andy might've still managed to get to the top eventually, although its hard to deny that his run would have most likely looked far less impressive. Phone Post

people were in denial of this for years while Anderson was champ.
1/9/14 9:07 PM
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Jons Forsberg
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"? MW had a better wrestler than all the guys you mentioned. They had Dan Henderson."

I can't think of a wrestler who's been outwrestled more than Dan Henderson in MMA. And when he did wrestle in RD1 against Silva he won the round convincingly.
1/9/14 9:12 PM
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Jons Forsberg
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"And then Chael Sonnen. Their credentials dwarf those of Hughes"

Chael's credentials didn't stop him from getting wrestle fucked against Rashad and Sobral. "credentials" don't mean anything, GSP was the best p4p wrestler with no credentials.
1/9/14 9:14 PM
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BeatonHauff
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I'm sure his last couple fights had nothing to do with him getting older, or starting to lose his chin at all. Phone Post 3.0
1/9/14 9:15 PM
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Jons Forsberg
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he was known as decision Dan for winning close decisions. NOT for outwrestling people.
1/9/14 9:20 PM
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Jons Forsberg
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Sobral took Chael down 5 times. Chael took him down 0 times.

Dan would steal decisions for landing the H bomb as in the Murilo Ninja fight, you couldn't steal rounds in PRIDE with takedowns.
1/9/14 9:27 PM
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MagSlim
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I'm pretty sure all the P4P threads are made or encouraged by Zuffa trolls.

There is no right answer. The arguing will never end. You just end up talking about their stars more.








Anderson out-grappled Chael. Fact. Phone Post 3.0

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