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UnderGround Forums >> NSAC doctor will advise against Belfort TUE


1/29/14 11:59 AM
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Underground Blog
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MixedMartialArts.com
 

Chris Weidman fights Vitor Belfort on Memorial Day or July 4th in Las Vegas. If Belfort wants a Therapeutic Use Exemption for his Testosterone Replacement Therapy, he will need to apply to the Nevada State Athletic Commission.

However, Dr. Timothy Trainor, consulting physician to the NSAC, told "Outside the Lines" Tuesday he would advise the five-member commission against granting any fighter a TUE who previously tested positive for PEDs. In 2006, Belfort tested positive for the anabolic steroid 4-Hydroxytestosertone.

"If we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that someone has used PEDs in the past, they will not get an exemption,'' said Dr. Trainor. "No, no way.''

Dr. Trainor was asked specifically about Belfort.

"Well, it is going to get denied then," he said flatly. "If we know for sure he has used steroids in the past, it is going to get denied. ... We're not going to give people a free pass because they admitted they used steroids in the past.''

However, Dr. Trainor is not a voting member of the commission.

NSAC chairman Francisco Aguilar said that a prior failed drug test is not an immediate disqualifier and that any request from Belfort would be heard and decided upon by the full five-member commission, with input from Trainor.

Aguilar said he would rely on information provided by the commission's medical doctor, but that he would enter any discussions with an open mind and also cognizant of the title fight's importance to Nevada and the reluctance to lose the potential payday to another state. "The economic development impact to the state could be huge,'' he said.

As point of fact, Aguilar said the UFC transferred to the state general fund almost $500,000 just in ticket sales and pay-per-view taxes from the Dec. 28 Weidman-Anderson Silva title fight. The tax figure from all fight cards last year was more than $5 million, he said. The estimated non-gaming impact to the venue hosting a boxing title fight (no figures are known for MMA) exceeds $11 million, according to Las Vegas convention officials.

"There are always people with an interest from the economic perspective, but we also have the obligation and duty to be regulators,'' Aguilar said.

Read entire article...


1/29/14 12:07 PM
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THERE WAS A GLITCH IN THE MATRiX
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Pitbull3744 - 

Wow so forget whats right or the rules whatever gets Nevada a big pay day? 

 


lol, you know they didnt legalize marijuana in 2 states so far out of the kindness of their hearts too right?

Theres only one thing more addictive than drugs: tax revenue!
1/29/14 12:11 PM
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quick
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So they'll grant it to Chael, but not Vitor. How they pick and choose to regulate this stuff is completely retarded.
1/29/14 12:17 PM
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Brabo Ben
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He'll get it, the doctor for the commission has to say things like this. Nothing here suggests anything otherwise to me, doctor says he doesn't like it, has no say, voting member says 'all things in to cobsideration', yep - got it Phone Post 3.0
1/29/14 12:19 PM
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gokudamus
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nice..i dont like the "beyond a shadow of a doubt" qualification, but it sounds like this doc has some integrity

1/29/14 12:20 PM
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DaddyRich
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At least they're honest about it. Straight cash homie!
1/29/14 12:20 PM
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gokudamus
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""There are always people with an interest from the economic perspective, but we also have the obligation and duty to be regulators,'' Aguilar said."

 

wtf does this mean? he takes $$ into account when determining whether or not to license a fighter for safety reasons? 

1/29/14 12:26 PM
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rockwell
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Lol at this athletic commission talking about the influence of money.

Great integrity there boys! Phone Post 3.0
1/29/14 12:31 PM
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OnlyTheStrongSurvive
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gokudamus -

""There are always people with an interest from the economic perspective, but we also have the obligation and duty to be regulators,'' Aguilar said."

 

wtf does this mean? he takes $$ into account when determining whether or not to license a fighter for safety reasons? 

Hopefully the integrity of the sport they are regulating comes into play some. They want people to respect the NSAC? Giving past steroid users a free pass to use more steroids isn't going to do it. Phone Post 3.0
1/29/14 12:32 PM
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brahmabull81
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The fact that this is such a hot button issue on here and that there are hords of pro-cheating (but only if Vitor does it, and if anybody is against it theyre a crybaby) mongoloids VS the hords of haters of ANYTHING scientifically created to enhance and prolong the careers/lives of athletes fighting like its xbox 1 vs PS4 is indicitave that its time o sort this out once and for all.


I dont at all like the fact that Vitor has been fighting only in Brazil, which has added fuel to the steroid cheat rumors, but the comparison to Chael's situation is a valid one. Although, the fact that Chael only got popped for apparently using TRT (but not reporting it to the commission) is slightly different than straight up getting popped for completely illegal steroids.

The problem lies in the fact that steroids were created to help people live more productively and enhance the quality of life. You get an injury, you take a steroid to aid you in its healing, etc.... Yet the few people in the world who would actually need this help are banned from using it (athletes). I think its lame that Ol Granny Fanny can take whatever steroids she wants to heal or enhance anything but high performance athletes who are breaking down their bodies a thousand times worse for YEARS just have to stick it out and suffer, in comparison.

In car racing, they arent using run of the mill regular sports cars. Theyre using souped up supercars. It should be the same in human competition. Its kind of a bad comparison, I know, but its not like you see a car pulling up to the pitstop for a tire replacement mid race and the mechanic yells "Sorry! No can do! Its a performance enhancer to get a new tire youre going to have to just tough it out." (again, bad comparison but you get the point)

Shit in all action videogames you play as a character who gets hurt. You take some "miracle" substance or use some tool that magically heals you up. So even video game characters are roiding! Haha My point is actually that in REAL LIFE in all other situations, performance enhancement and the ability to have a higher quality of life outside of what your body is naturally capable of is highly encouraged... But NOT for athletes. So of course these guys are broken down, broke as fuck and depressed later in life. /rantcomplete
1/29/14 12:35 PM
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VTCO
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Good. He shouldn't get it. Not only is Belfort a known cheater, but he also disrespected the NSAC by fighting outside the US when he was suspended.
1/29/14 12:38 PM
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rockwell
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Yeah but using juice to improve your ability to harm another human isn't ok. Phone Post 3.0
1/29/14 12:54 PM
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brahmabull81
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Using steroids doesnt turn you into the Terminator. You still have to be a top top top shelf fighter to be that good.

Besides, if were going to get this ethical, why is it EVER ok to harm another human for sport, enhanced by science or not?

How about the fact that some people are naturally stronger and faster than other people. They are enhanced, in comparison. How is that fair then? Shouldnt they be banned from fighting because they are have an enhanced ability to harm another human? Or is it different because God gave it to them and not a doctor? This whole subject is grey area and would be better presented with actual physician chiming in tbh but lets stop acting like taking steroids basically puts a bazooka in your hand in fights against guys with water pistols.

Is it only acceptable if theyre roid-less (and ironically not able to receive the often-times recommended medical care due to a lot of prescriptions advocating steroids in recovery)?

(btw to any people frothing at the mouth reading this just waiting to hate on me, all Im doing is trying to put forth an open conversation and dialog, rather than a fanboy side taking session)
1/29/14 12:56 PM
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Kim Jong Uno
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BuckyGoldstein - 
rockwell - Yeah but using juice to improve your ability to harm another human isn't ok. Phone Post 3.0

knowledge is what improves your ability to harm another human, not juice

Bullshit excuse to allow cheating in the sport.


If you need TRT to fight, then you shouldn't be allowed to fight. Lots of people have to quit the sport because their bodies don't work right anymore. In a sport where brain trauma is premium, people should not be allowed to artificially enhance their strength, end of story.
1/29/14 12:57 PM
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Kerouac
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lol...he fights, loses and pops.
1/29/14 12:57 PM
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FETT_GayFerPayNINJA
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BuckyGoldstein -
quick - So they'll grant it to Chael, but not Vitor. How they pick and choose to regulate this stuff is completely retarded.

pure racism.
You really are as dumb as i thought (if serious).

Chael tested positive in a different state, and claimed and had supporting docs that he was on TRT not just taking a random banned steroid like Vitor. Phone Post 3.0
1/29/14 1:01 PM
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brahmabull81
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BuckyGoldstein - "I dont at all like the fact that Vitor has been fighting only in Brazil, which has added fuel to the steroid cheat rumors, but the comparison to Chael's situation is a valid one. Although, the fact that Chael only got popped for apparently using TRT (but not reporting it to the commission) is slightly different than straight up getting popped for completely illegal steroids"

Vitor does not choose to fight in Brazil and I seriously doubt that the UFC would have him fight there so he can juice. I can't see ZUFFA putting their reputation on the line for Vitor Belfort. CABMMA is a part of the IMMAF so I doubt that the A.C. is hiding anything. Vitor also uses a physician in Nevada and is tested all the time." Sonnen had an unallowably high testosterone/epitestosterone (T/E) ratio of 16.9:1 at the time of the fight ". So how is that different then getting caught on the juice?

Oh I dont think its any different in terms of how it should be perceived. Its just the finer details that make them very different. Vitor got popped for an actual steroid and was suspended. Then he chose to fight outside the country while on suspension.

Chael got popped for a very high ratio and had synthetic test in his body while claiming he had "slipped his mind" or something and not informed the commission. Then he served out his time on the sidelines.

Im not saying one is "worse" than the other, but they are different situations. In an ethical sense, what Chael did was worse. He tried to be sneaky and never fully admitted his wrong-doing in the end. In fact, what worries me more is that hes probably one of MANY guys that are doing the same thing even now. Because, as it was mentioned already in this thread, an admitted TUE fighter will get tested a lot even between fights, whereas fighters who dont report anything to the commision have a lot lower chance of being randomly tested between fights, and can therefore juice up and taper off the levels by fight time, because its in camp and in training that you need TRT and most of the benefits of steroids, not during the actual fight.
1/29/14 1:01 PM
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rockwell
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BuckyGoldstein -
rockwell - Yeah but using juice to improve your ability to harm another human isn't ok. Phone Post 3.0

knowledge is what improves your ability to harm another human, not juice
If you think juice has no effect on athletic performance you know nothing. Phone Post 3.0
1/29/14 1:03 PM
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StrikingMMA
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quick - So they'll grant it to Chael, but not Vitor. How they pick and choose to regulate this stuff is completely retarded.

Chael has a documented medical condition that leads to low testosterone. Vitor has low testosterone from prior steroid usage for which he was caught for. It's not really the same thing.
1/29/14 1:12 PM
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brahmabull81
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Does anyone know if it is true that the UFC doesnt test for HGH and EPO? If true I think that blood doping is a lot more worrisome than anything like TRT. (can anyone with any knowledge in blood doping chime in here?)
1/29/14 1:31 PM
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bruised
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gokudamus -

""There are always people with an interest from the economic perspective, but we also have the obligation and duty to be regulators,'' Aguilar said."

 

wtf does this mean? he takes $$ into account when determining whether or not to license a fighter for safety reasons? 

Yeah, that's completely ridiculous. Phone Post 3.0
1/29/14 1:35 PM
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MattyECB
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brahmabull81 - Does anyone know if it is true that the UFC doesnt test for HGH and EPO? If true I think that blood doping is a lot more worrisome than anything like TRT. (can anyone with any knowledge in blood doping chime in here?)

It's true, this was the GSP sticking point...

 

You have to either pay out of pocket, no GSP was not sponsored, and either opt-in for the NSAC's advanced WADA protocol or go outside of the NSAC to another WADA certified program, such as VADA

1/29/14 1:39 PM
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quick
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StrikingMMA - 
quick - So they'll grant it to Chael, but not Vitor. How they pick and choose to regulate this stuff is completely retarded.

Chael has a documented medical condition that leads to low testosterone. Vitor has low testosterone from prior steroid usage for which he was caught for. It's not really the same thing.

http://mmajunkie.com/2013/12/endocrinologist-chael-sonnens-initial-diagnosis-of-hypogonadism-not-definitive/

The ink isn't even dry on that report. Furthermore he was well outside the limits and so any argument about whether he was allowed to or not is rather moot. So let's not sit here and act like Chael's "legal" roids aren't shady as hell.
1/29/14 1:45 PM
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MattyECB
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Edited: 01/29/14 1:45 PM
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MattyECB - 
brahmabull81 - Does anyone know if it is true that the UFC doesnt test for HGH and EPO? If true I think that blood doping is a lot more worrisome than anything like TRT. (can anyone with any knowledge in blood doping chime in here?)

It's true, this was the GSP sticking point...

 

You have to either pay out of pocket, no GSP was not sponsored, and either opt-in for the NSAC's advanced WADA protocol or go outside of the NSAC to another WADA certified program, such as VADA

 

And just to add, while blood doping is more worriesome, the TRT thing is disgusting because it's sponsored and is wasting money for cheating. Not to mention it's unrealistic to expect the UFC to shell out cash on MORE testing lol. I don't like how biased the UGBlog's exposition on TRT is because, while there are valid points, they fail to capture the scope of how many times it's been allowed. Unless I'm mistaken, Couture, Griffin, Hendo, Quinton Jackson, Nate Marquardt, Shane Roller, Duffee, Antonio Silva, Mir, Belfort and Sonnen have all used it...

 

Which is a fuck ton and it's not really fair to compare the sample size against the full population of MMA fighters since not everyone has the means and connections to get an easy TUE hookup, certainly not a broke ass fighter in a regional show lol

 

And while they cite an important study relating to head trauma, that doesn't address the fact that fighters in their 20s have fucking reported hypogonadism for a TUE lol Or the issue that maybe we shouldn't be letting people who've been beaten so badly their endocrine functions have completely dysregulated, compete and get MORE head trauma lol

1/29/14 1:47 PM
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orcus
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"people should not be allowed to artificially enhance their strength, end of story."

Lifting barbells in a gym isn't an artifical enhancement? How about when aided by (legal) supplements coming out of a pill bottle?

What about oxygen chambers? Should that be banned?

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