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7/20/14 2:44 PM
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KneeUpperCut Ios
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nobadanymore - Lol, how far back can we go with this line of stupidity. If he didn't sell cigarettes illegally, he wouldn't be dead. If he didn't go out that day, he wouldn't be dead. If he was never born, he wouldn't be dead.

Are you claiming that if he was handcuffed willingly but STILL put in a chokehold, taken to the ground in the exact same manner, he would still be alive?, and that it was pure and utterly the resisting arrest that was the cause of his heart attack?

The line of stupidity demonstrates that he played the major hand in his own death. Cops were doing their job.

If he was handcuffed willingly the cops wouldn't be required to pile on top of him on the ground.
7/20/14 2:49 PM
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KneeUpperCut Ios
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possum jitsu - 
Team GDP's cancerous testicle -
possum jitsu - 
Team GDP's cancerous testicle -
Nitecrawler - 
possum jitsu -
Team GDP's cancerous testicle - How many times prior was the guy arrested?
I don't really see how that would matter. Do police usually know ones record when they arrest them? Phone Post 3.0
When he's been arrested 31 times, 4 for the same offense around the same location I would say yes. Phone Post 3.0

and besides that, it's the same with most of these 'isolated incidents'. bums, multiple arrests, people on drugs. Fucks shouldn't be given so lightly.
Not much empathy huh? That's a shame and I feel bad for you. Phone Post 3.0

you want me to understand the feelings of a man whose been arrested 30 times? fuck him and fuck your fake feelings
Arrested for selling cigarettes... yeah fuck him. What a shame. Phone Post 3.0

Yea - this dude was obviously a good guy - only arrested 30+ times.
7/20/14 2:51 PM
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KneeUpperCut Ios
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Ghost of Corvelay - Person to person transactions of legal product between consenting adults should never result in police intervention.

Unless its not a legal product... and not done on private property in front of a business... and the person doing the selling is a known piece of dog shit.

Then I have no problem with police intervention.
7/20/14 2:56 PM
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KneeUpperCut Ios
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Vitor29 - 
thebronxbomber -
nobadanymore -
RubberFistofFury -
angryinch -

Again I ask, if the actions of the cops didn't kill him, then I presume that you are claiming that he would have died at the exact same time in the exact same manner had the cops not assaulted him, right?

 

His decision to resist, and therefore raise his heart rate to a dangerous level for his condition, most likely caused his heart attack. Phone Post 3.0
Yeah, definitely not the prohibited choke hold. Or the suffocation. Or the lack of cpr while officers stood around looking at his lifeless body for over 5 minutes.

None of that contributed in any way.

It was coz he was fat. Phone Post 3.0
How hard is it for some people to not take responsibility for your own actions? The guy resisted arrest. That's on him at that point. If he did not resist he would still be alive right now. That simple. Phone Post 3.0
So it's on him and the cops share no blame for the illegal choke hold since it happened while he was resisting. So it seems to me that you're saying that the cops aren't responsible for anything they do to you if you resist arrest, it's on you. Phone Post 3.0

Within reason.

If a cop takes out his gun and empties an entire clip into the back of your head while other cops hold you down that's one thing. If you get your orbital broken because you smashed your face into the curb while wrestling the cop - that's another.

There is no issue here imo. That POS got what was coming to him. Useless member of society. GOOD FUCKING RIDDANCE, imo :)

7/20/14 2:59 PM
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angryinch
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"That POS got what was coming to him. Useless member of society. GOOD FUCKING RIDDANCE, imo :)"

I'm all for getting rid of menaces to society but it seems to me that pretty much all his crimes were victimless crimes.   Selling untaxed cigarettes?  Seriously?  WTF?  

7/20/14 3:02 PM
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RockTheVote
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Imo:
The cop that did the choke hold gets fired. The guy who died, who had been arrested 30 other times, who had been arguing with the cops long before the video started, per the comments by the guy holding the camera, contributed more to his own death than anyone. Can we NOT give this guy the benefit of a doubt? Is it the cops job to know who can and who cannot handle forceful arrests? "Too fat to arrest" is not a condition. It's like everyone needs to pick one side in this... Cop who wrapped him up was bad. Guy was bad. Big deal. Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:05 PM
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Ebin214
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KneeUpperCut Ios - 
possum jitsu - 
Team GDP's cancerous testicle -
possum jitsu - 
Team GDP's cancerous testicle -
Nitecrawler - 
possum jitsu -
Team GDP's cancerous testicle - How many times prior was the guy arrested?
I don't really see how that would matter. Do police usually know ones record when they arrest them? Phone Post 3.0
When he's been arrested 31 times, 4 for the same offense around the same location I would say yes. Phone Post 3.0

and besides that, it's the same with most of these 'isolated incidents'. bums, multiple arrests, people on drugs. Fucks shouldn't be given so lightly.
Not much empathy huh? That's a shame and I feel bad for you. Phone Post 3.0

you want me to understand the feelings of a man whose been arrested 30 times? fuck him and fuck your fake feelings
Arrested for selling cigarettes... yeah fuck him. What a shame. Phone Post 3.0

Yea - this dude was obviously a good guy - only arrested 30+ times.

The argument isn't about this person's moral compass, so if y'all could all stop bringing that up, that'd be greaaaat.

It's about whether or not the cops excessively egged on this man's heart attack. to me, it's obvious have you even seen the video? If you have, how can you even argue that they didn't contribute to his death more than they needed to?
7/20/14 3:06 PM
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angryinch
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" The guy who died, who had been arrested 30 other times, who had been arguing with the cops long before the video started, per the comments by the guy holding the camera, contributed more to his own death than anyone. "

You're saying he choked himself?  Or maybe that he tried to kill one of the cops and left them no choice but to kill him?  

7/20/14 3:07 PM
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Stephen Eakin
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I don't understand the untaxed cigarettes part. What does that mean? Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:08 PM
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RockTheVote
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angryinch -

" The guy who died, who had been arrested 30 other times, who had been arguing with the cops long before the video started, per the comments by the guy holding the camera, contributed more to his own death than anyone. "

You're saying he choked himself?  Or maybe that he tried to kill one of the cops and left them no choice but to kill him?  

I'm saying his background leads me to believe he's not a good guy, for one. I'm also saying that he could have avoided that situation. Easily. Knowing he had asthma, why was he angrily arguing with cops about his arrest? Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:09 PM
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angryinch
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Stephen Eakin - I don't understand the untaxed cigarettes part. What does that mean? Phone Post 3.0

He didn't give the govt their cut, therefore they sent their hired thugs out to kill him.  No different than a mafia protection racket, imo.

7/20/14 3:10 PM
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angryinch
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"Knowing he had asthma, why was he angrily arguing with cops about his arrest?"

Because they were unustifiably fucking with him?

7/20/14 3:11 PM
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Dogo
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Stephen Eakin - I don't understand the untaxed cigarettes part. What does that mean? Phone Post 3.0

This should clear it up

http://nypost.com/2012/06/08/nyc-probe-finds-massive-number-of-illegal-untaxed-cigs/
7/20/14 3:12 PM
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RockTheVote
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angryinch -

"Knowing he had asthma, why was he angrily arguing with cops about his arrest?"

Because they were unustifiably fucking with him?

How do you know? I think untaxed cig sales are dumb. You could be totally right. Do you give everyone the benefit of a doubt? Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:12 PM
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Stephen Eakin
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angryinch -
Stephen Eakin - I don't understand the untaxed cigarettes part. What does that mean? Phone Post 3.0

He didn't give the govt their cut, therefore they sent their hired thugs out to kill him.  No different than a mafia protection racket, imo.

So he was manufacturing them? Or just reselling some he previously bought? Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:15 PM
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Stephen Eakin
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Dogo -
Stephen Eakin - I don't understand the untaxed cigarettes part. What does that mean? Phone Post 3.0

This should clear it up

http://nypost.com/2012/06/08/nyc-probe-finds-massive-number-of-illegal-untaxed-cigs/
Damn guess it makes more sense why people are selling them in the streets. 100% tax is crazy Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:23 PM
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Nitecrawler
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angryinch -

"Knowing he had asthma, why was he angrily arguing with cops about his arrest?"

Because they were unustifiably fucking with him?

They just observed him committing the same crime that he had been arrested for before. How is that not just to arrest him yet again? Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:27 PM
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Dogo
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Nitecrawler - 
angryinch -

"Knowing he had asthma, why was he angrily arguing with cops about his arrest?"

Because they were unustifiably fucking with him?

They just observed him committing the same crime that he had been arrested for before. How is that not just to arrest him yet again? Phone Post 3.0

They didn't observe him. They said some unnamed person 'over there' said he was selling them. They also, at least according to the one report I read, didn't find any cigarettes on him or in his car. Not sure what the source was for that though.
7/20/14 3:30 PM
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KneeUpperCut Ios
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angryinch -
Stephen Eakin - I don't understand the untaxed cigarettes part. What does that mean? Phone Post 3.0

He didn't give the govt their cut, therefore they sent their hired thugs out to kill him.  No different than a mafia protection racket, imo.

LOL Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:30 PM
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KneeUpperCut Ios
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angryinch -

"Knowing he had asthma, why was he angrily arguing with cops about his arrest?"

Because they were unustifiably fucking with him?

Just like the prior 30 times? Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:33 PM
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Dogo
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In those 30 prior arrests, how many times was he charged with resisting? Does anyone know?

Because maybe he was only resisting because he hadn't done anything this time.

You would think that after 30 arrests they'd all have it down to a science now. So what was different this time?
7/20/14 3:36 PM
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Nitecrawler
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Dogo -
Nitecrawler - 
angryinch -

"Knowing he had asthma, why was he angrily arguing with cops about his arrest?"

Because they were unustifiably fucking with him?

They just observed him committing the same crime that he had been arrested for before. How is that not just to arrest him yet again? Phone Post 3.0

They didn't observe him. They said some unnamed person 'over there' said he was selling them. They also, at least according to the one report I read, didn't find any cigarettes on him or in his car. Not sure what the source was for that though.
If you find that report is be interested to read it as I had read they found untaxed smokes on him.

Let me see if I can find that again. Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:47 PM
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Dogo
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I'll have to look through my browser history. I know I read that the didn't find anything, but I read a bunch of articles after it happened. I'll try to dig it up.
7/20/14 3:47 PM
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Nitecrawler
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Dogo - In those 30 prior arrests, how many times was he charged with resisting? Does anyone know?

Because maybe he was only resisting because he hadn't done anything this time.

You would think that after 30 arrests they'd all have it down to a science now. So what was different this time?
No idea what 22 of the other arrests were about but 8 were for selling the untaxed cigarettes.

Would be interested to see what the other charges were. Doesn't really have any bearing on this case but might shed some light on what type of person he was and whether or not he had a history of resisting. Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 3:49 PM
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Nitecrawler
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Dogo - I'll have to look through my browser history. I know I read that the didn't find anything, but I read a bunch of articles after it happened. I'll try to dig it up.
Cool.

I looked as well but the only thing I found was a statement from his family saying that he didn't have anything on him.

I would think there would be an inventory of all objects on him at the time of death that would be logged somewhere. Phone Post 3.0

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