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7/20/14 8:06 PM
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Jesus Quintana
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Jambo888 - 

heavy losses? children have been taking heavy losses


What do you expect when Hamas uses children as human shields for their rocket launching?
7/20/14 8:19 PM
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al neri
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Jesus Quintana -
Jambo888 - 

heavy losses? children have been taking heavy losses


What do you expect when Hamas uses children as human shields for their rocket launching?
Totally off subject but didn't you say you had a cousin named Chris Gill who was from the Bay Area in another thread? Shoot me a PM my best friend all through HS is named Chris Gill. Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 8:48 PM
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voodoo child
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Jesus Quintana -
thesleeper - 
Moke - 
thesleeper - 
Moke - 
thesleeper - Well, they wanted war and so they have it. Kiss your US tax dollars goodbye...

lol, I'm gonna stand in front of your house and throw rocks at it 24 hours a day. And when you come outside to confront me I'm going to shoot you dead. And then I'm going to say, "He wanted war!"

Lol, a more accurate analogy is the following, yours is using a very narrow historical timeframe.

I am going to come to your house and start camping on the front lawn. Then when all my friends show up with guns and lawyers, you are going to hide and plink at me with a .22. Then I invade your house and blow it up repeatedly because I want to take over the land and build a condo.

Well if we're going to ignore boundaries drawn by the UN then I'll just call my local Indian reservation and say there's a bunch of squatters on your land and they'll take care of you and take your lawyer's scalp.

Oh wow. I knew you were clueless Mope, but this is ignorance of immense proportions.

You do realize that the UN has nothing do with the US colonizing the Indians, don't you? And that the US repeatedly ignores mandates by the UN and would never recognize boundaries drawn by the UN?

An army of jewish settlers and colonizers made the boundaries of Israel, not the UN. The UN just gave it some faux legitimacy...

Jews are the majority in Israel. What is more legitimate than that? don't they have a right to rule themselves and to protect themselves? I also find it interesting that your previous post conveniently omitted the fact that about 50% of jews in Israel trace all or some of their ancestry to arab lands. The narrative of jews as european colonizers just doesnt work.
It is true the approx half or more Jews in Israel are Mizrahi. However, the mass migration of Mizrahi Jews did not occur until after 1948. Before then, the overwhelming numbers of Jewish migrants into the land of Palestine came from Europe and Russia. While there were some Sephardic and Mizrahi that migrated along with their European counterparts, these number were minute in comparison to the Ashkenazi. Infact, to reiterate this point, modern Zionism was born in Germany. And all 4 Aliyahs prior to 1948 came almost exclusively from the European continent. Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 8:49 PM
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thesleeper
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Jesus Quintana - 
thesleeper - 
Moke - 
thesleeper - 
Moke - 
thesleeper - Well, they wanted war and so they have it. Kiss your US tax dollars goodbye...

lol, I'm gonna stand in front of your house and throw rocks at it 24 hours a day. And when you come outside to confront me I'm going to shoot you dead. And then I'm going to say, "He wanted war!"

Lol, a more accurate analogy is the following, yours is using a very narrow historical timeframe.

I am going to come to your house and start camping on the front lawn. Then when all my friends show up with guns and lawyers, you are going to hide and plink at me with a .22. Then I invade your house and blow it up repeatedly because I want to take over the land and build a condo.

Well if we're going to ignore boundaries drawn by the UN then I'll just call my local Indian reservation and say there's a bunch of squatters on your land and they'll take care of you and take your lawyer's scalp.

Oh wow. I knew you were clueless Mope, but this is ignorance of immense proportions.

You do realize that the UN has nothing do with the US colonizing the Indians, don't you? And that the US repeatedly ignores mandates by the UN and would never recognize boundaries drawn by the UN?

An army of jewish settlers and colonizers made the boundaries of Israel, not the UN. The UN just gave it some faux legitimacy...

Jews are the majority in Israel. What is more legitimate than that? don't they have a right to rule themselves and to protect themselves? I also find it interesting that your previous post conveniently omitted the fact that about 50% of jews in Israel trace all or some of their ancestry to arab lands. The narrative of jews as european colonizers just doesnt work.

The argument of ancestry doesn't work. Nice try. Not biting.

Most Jews were not in Palestine at 1900. They were not a majority in Palestine in 1900.


They colonized Palestine and that is how they became a majority in Israel. They colonized Palestine with help from the US and Britain.

Does that mean the Palestinians should just give up on it, considering that the jews took it by force, multiplying and attrition?
7/20/14 8:51 PM
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thesleeper
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I just found a link to download the pdf for Perceptions of Palestine, in case anyone is REALLY curious about a less than biased historical account. It may take several tries to download the PDF, its a big file.

http://bookzz.org/md5/AD7C6F74ABF851648017027A93146B5F
7/20/14 9:02 PM
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thesleeper
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Excerpt from the book:

Wilson himself may never have confronted the inconsistency, but his
secretary of state, Robert Lansing, clearly recognized the problem, and Wilson’s
legal counselor advised him that true self-determination would prevent
establishment of a Jewish state in Palestine.11 When Brandeis, in a notable
conversation with British Foreign Secretary Arthur Balfour in Paris
during the peace conference in 1919, was asked how Wilson could reconcile
support for Zionism with the principle of self-determination, Brandeis
observed that Zionism proposed to deal with a “world problem”—the fate
of worldwide Jewry—that transcended the interests of any existing local
community.12 Balfour had already concluded that commitment to Zionism
obviated any possibility of achieving numerical self-determination in
30 / Woodrow Wilson
Palestine—that is, allowing Palestine’s Arab majority to exercise selfgovernment
13—and he was undoubtedly relieved that Wilson was also
willing to disregard his commitment where Palestine and its Arab inhabitants
were concerned.
Three months after this conversation, Balfour wrote a memorandum
frankly acknowledging that “in Palestine we do not propose even to go
through the form of consulting the wishes of the present inhabitants of the
country.” The Allies were already committed to Zionism, he wrote. “And
Zionism, be it right or wrong, good or bad, is rooted in age-long traditions,
in present needs, in future hopes, of far profounder import than the desires
and prejudices of the 700,000 Arabs who now inhabit that ancient land.”
Balfour forthrightly acknowledged that “so far as Palestine is concerned,
the Powers have made no statement of fact which is not admittedly wrong,
and no declaration of policy which, at least in the letter, they have not always
intended to violate.”14
7/20/14 9:04 PM
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thesleeper
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Britain had backed away from a promise to the Arabs once before. In
1914, in an effort to enlist the aid of Sherif Hussein of Mecca in leading an
Arab revolt against Turkish rule, Britain formally instructed its high commissioner
in Egypt, Henry McMahon, to promise Hussein that Britain
would support Arab independence after the war in a large area encompassing
parts of Greater Syria and what are today Jordan, Iraq, and Saudi Arabia,
excluding only the coastal area of Lebanon, which was to be under
French influence. The exchange of letters in which this promise was contained
became known as the McMahon correspondence. The Arabs, including
leaders of the Palestinian Arabs, believed they had reason to expect that
Palestine was included in the area to be granted independence since the
only areas specifically excluded were all located north of Beirut and well
outside Palestine, but the British immediately hedged and ever afterward
maintained that they had never intended to include Palestine within the future
Arab state.15
In a colonialist era in which native peoples were believed to have no capability
for governing themselves and not even much interest in self-rule,
failure to live up to political promises made to them was not seen to be out
of order. Even as Wilson championed self-determination, he qualified the
principle by noting that “undeveloped peoples” were not yet ready to take
on “the full responsibilities of statehood” and should be given friendly
“guidance” in the form, for instance, of the British and French mandates
imposed on Palestine, Iraq, Lebanon, and Syria.16 In regard to Palestine, the
colonial powers considered neither Jews nor Arabs to be ready for the “full
responsibilities of statehood,” but Jews, being European, were regarded as
Woodrow Wilson / 31
educable, whereas Arabs—dull and inarticulate as they were thought to
be—were not so perceived; they were not, in fact, considered even to want
self-rule. The overriding of Arab interests was thus done carelessly, without
thought.
Indeed, it has become so much a part of the conventional wisdom that
the Arabs of Palestine were neither ready for nor even aware of the possibility
of independence in the early 1920s that popular historians molding
and reinforcing the Palestinian-Israeli frame of reference more than half a
century later accepted as a matter of course colonialism’s disregard for Arab
interests. Historian Peter Grose, for instance, after citing Balfour’s memorandum,
frankly praises the British foreign secretary for being “willing to
rise above” the principle of self-determination.17
Wilson found it easy to ignore Palestinian interests, even when presented
with clear evidence of Palestinian opposition to the Zionist program.
In 1919, at the behest of his missionary friends, Wilson dispatched a commission
to investigate the views of the inhabitants of the former Ottoman
Empire, including Palestine. Led by a college president, Henry King, and
a businessman and former Wilson campaign contributor, Charles Crane,
who both began with what they called a “predisposition” in favor of Zionism,
and staffed by several others with connections to themissionary effort
in Turkey, the King-Crane Commission spent two weeks in Palestine interviewing
over two hundred Muslim, Christian, and Jewish individuals and
groups. The commission concluded that the full Zionist program would be
a “gross violation” of the principle of self-determination, as well as of the
Palestinian people’s rights, and should be modified.18
7/20/14 9:08 PM
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thesleeper
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By 1920, the frame of reference in which the Arabs of Palestine were
viewed was already firmly set. Palestine had begun to be considered a Jewish
land, the Arabs of Palestine had all along been ignored or disdained, and
the United States was committed, in the absence of any pressing interest to
the contrary, to supporting Zionism. Wilson’s public statements on behalf
of the Zionist program took on a new and more enthusiastic tone, as he began
to pledge U.S. support not simply for a Jewish homeland in Palestine
but for a Jewish commonwealth.24 U.S. Zionists began insisting that the
Balfour Declaration was committed to making all of Palestine a Jewish national
home rather than simply, as the declaration actually stated, to forming
a Jewish national home in Palestine. During his 1919 Paris meeting
with British Foreign Secretary Balfour, Justice Brandeis spelled out the distinction,
pointing out that if the Zionist program were to be successful, all
Palestine would have to be the Jewish homeland.25 It was another three
years before Britain issued a white paper clarifying its position that the declaration
had not been intended to grant the entirety of Palestine to the
Jews.26 Wilson himself did not use the broader formulation, but other officials
and the media tended to use it interchangeably with the more restrictive
language of the declaration. This interpretation and Wilson’s own care-
Woodrow Wilson / 33
lessness with the terms homeland and commonwealth indicated at least a
casual disregard for how much of Palestine the Jews might receive and in
what form, and how much the Arabs might lose.
Wilson’s successors were equally committed to the Zionist program. By
1922, the year the League of Nations confirmed the British Mandate for
Palestine, United States policy was firmly pro-Zionist. President Warren
Harding’s secretary of state, Charles Hughes, told Balfour early in the year
that the United States interpreted the idea of a homeland for the Jews in
Palestine to mean establishment of a Jewish state.27 In 1924, Britain and the
United States concluded the Anglo-American Convention, which regulated
U.S. trade with Palestine and guaranteed the protection of U.S. citizens
there. The convention formalizedU.S. endorsement of Britain’s control over
Palestine and, by reiterating provisions of the Balfour Declaration and of
the British Mandate instrument, formally accepted Zionism in Palestine.28

Lansingwas not the only official whose opposition to aspects of the Zionist
program went unheeded. More than one U.S. official on the scene in
the Middle East warned over the years that Arab opposition to the Zionist
program was widespread and would ultimately lead to bloodshed between
Arabs and Jews, but the warnings were ignored.31 In 1922, during the administration
of President Warren Harding, Allen Dulles, then head of the
State Department’s Division of Near Eastern Affairs, later to become the
director of the Central Intelligence Agency in the Eisenhower administration,
and not a Middle East expert except by avocation, wrote a memorandum
to an assistant secretary of state expressing his “strong” feeling that
the State Department should not officially support the positions of either
Zionists, anti-Zionists, or Arabs. Zionism, he observed, had “a certain sentimental
appeal,” but this appeal had to be measured against “the cold fact”
that Jews made up only 10 percent of Palestine’s population. Dulles’s call for
political neutrality fell on deaf ears.32
7/20/14 9:11 PM
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thesleeper
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Key takeaway- in 1922 less than 10% of Palestine's population was Jewish.
7/20/14 9:15 PM
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Gymrat209
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NORESPECT - 
Gymrat209 - I have no dog in this fight and frankly don't give 2 shits for either of these barbarian's fighting over religion. But to call Israeli Soldiers and glorify them and call Palistanian's Terrorists is like Calling American Soldiers (calvary) and Native American Indians Terrorists.

The only reason The ragheads fight the way they do is because they are basically working with Bows and Arrows of today vs U.S. Calvary Gattling Guns...

Anyone with half a brain and see the difference and if the ragheads tried to meet the Israeli's on the battlefield they would be wiped out and not even given a reservation which consists of Desert shit lands that no food can grow on.
You are an idiot. This conflict has nothing to do with religion. Phone Post 3.0

Not sure if srs or trolling. They are fighting over the Land due to religion you fuckwit.
7/20/14 9:17 PM
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thesleeper
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LuqmanMehboob - Islamic scholarship divides the world into two spheres of influence, the House of Islam (dar al-Islam) and the House of War (dar al-harb). Islam means submission, and so the House of Islam includes those nations that have submitted to Islamic rule, which is to say those nations ruled by Sharia law. The rest of the world, which has not accepted Sharia law and so is not in a state of submission, exists in a state of rebellion or war with the will of Allah. It is incumbent on dar al-Islam to make war upon dar al-harb until such time that all nations submit to the will of Allah and accept Sharia law. Islam's message to the non-Muslim world is the same now as it was in the time of Muhammad and throughout history: submit or be conquered. The only times since Muhammad when dar al-Islam was not actively at war with dar al-harb were when the Muslim world was too weak or divided to make war effectively.

Muslim scholars have told me that division into House of Islam and the House of War is not really how Islam is divided.

Some Western scholar made that up.
7/20/14 9:19 PM
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thesleeper
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Also, you are confusing Jihad with Arab nationalism.
7/20/14 9:21 PM
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thesleeper
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Palestinians are among the most educated Arabs in the world.

They don't support Sharia law you dimwit.
7/20/14 9:25 PM
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thesleeper
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Higher education
Islamic University of Gaza

The university education consists of four years college education to obtain a bachelor’s degree and additional two years for a master’s degree. Some colleges provide two years of education for a diploma course.[36] During 2005 in the West Bank and Gaza, there were 10 universities, 1 distance education university (Al-Quds Open University), 13 university colleges, and 19 community colleges.[37] Most of these universities were established and developed mostly since the period of Israel occupation begun in 1967. Majority of the universities are non-profit institutions. They combine fund-raise with funding received from the Palestinian Authority.[38]

In Higher Education Institutions, 138,139 students were enrolled during the 2004/2005 academic year. Among them, 76,650 students (55% of total) were enrolled in universities, 46,453 students (34%) are enrolled in the distance education university, 6,034 students (4%) were enrolled in university colleges, and 9,002 students (7%) were enrolled in the community colleges. The male students share is greater than that of female students in the universities, open university and university colleges. On the other hand, the share of female students is greater in the community colleges.[39](MOEHE 2005a) Gross enrollment ratios for higher education were 46.2% for total, 41.6% for male, and 50.9% for female students in 2007.[40]

More students enrolled in certain academic programs such as social science, education, and humanities and arts in higher education, and the share of science and engineering is proportionately less.[41]

Demand for tertiary education has increased significantly in the past decade with students enrolled in tertiary education institutions more than tripling between 1995 and 2006. Some academics[who?] have suggested that Palestinian Authority higher education system needs to not only satisfy the increasing demand from the growing population of secondary education graduates, but also to maintain quality and relevance to meet the changing demands of the global economy. In addition, public financing for tertiary education is considered insufficient given Palestinian Authority financial circumstances. The system heavily depends on student fees, which represent 60% of universities’ operating costs.[42]

The MOEHE has developed a new student loan scheme for tertiary education. The objectives of this loan scheme are: 1) to create a sustainable resource that will assist students into the future, 2) to ensure that students understand their responsibility to share the cost of their education, 3) to provide a strong, streamlined repayment system that is easy and fair (repayments of loans must be collected from all students), and 4) to provide a collection mechanism that will ensure sustainability (a revolving fund) [43]

UNESCO states that because of "isolation, [the Universities] have suffered in particular from the absence of research departments."[citation needed]

"Inter-university co-operation programmes are underway, such as TOKTEN, PEACE and MEDCAMPUS. They are supported by partners such as the European Union, UNESCO and the UNDP. The PEACE programme (Palestinian-European Academic Co-operation in Education) involves 23 Palestinian Authority and European universities. It has been particularly noteworthy for having allowed students and teachers from the West Bank and Gaza to be admitted to European faculties at a time when the university establishments of Gaza and the West Bank were closed. In a second phase, it is to provide for the dispatch of missions of volunteer academics, on sabbatical, from Europe, North America and the rest of the world to the West Bank and Gaza."[44] "Palestinian students wishing to obtain a doctorate must study either in Israel, or overseas."[45]
7/20/14 9:26 PM
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thesleeper
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Key takeaway- in 1922 less than 10% of Palestine's population was Jewish.
7/20/14 9:27 PM
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Gymrat209
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Jesus Quintana - 
Gymrat209 - I have no dog in this fight and frankly don't give 2 shits for either of these barbarian's fighting over religion. But to call Israeli Soldiers and glorify them and call Palistanian's Terrorists is like Calling American Soldiers (calvary) and Native American Indians Terrorists.

The only reason The ragheads fight the way they do is because they are basically working with Bows and Arrows of today vs U.S. Calvary Gattling Guns...

Anyone with half a brain and see the difference and if the ragheads tried to meet the Israeli's on the battlefield they would be wiped out and not even given a reservation which consists of Desert shit lands that no food can grow on.

hamas is pretty much universally recognized as a terrorist group including by other muslim countries...

I don't think Native Americans ever used their own children as human shields or celebrated people who murder children as heroes, but I could be wrong.

Ya and look how that panned out for the Native Americans. I'll refer to that chris rock joke "Whens the last time you seen an Indian chillen up in Red Lobster".

I mean we almost wiped the Native Americans off the map but then decided to give them some shit lands. Israel day by day has been bulldozing there houses and not even giving them the shit lands...Yet somehow they are the good guys. Both are fucked up and the only reason Hamas fights the way they do is because they have a couple 1980 Russian Hand me down RPG's and couple AK47's Meanwhile Israel has U.S. up to date weaponry.

Im sorry i just can't fathom anybody wanting to use their own children as meat shields if they had another way to fight the war without some extreme desperation tactic. You guys make it sound like they do this shit so they can go see allah tommorrow if that was the case why aren't they all rushing the gates with IED's strapped to their bodies non stop.
7/20/14 9:30 PM
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HereWeAre
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I'm no Islamic sympathizer but the only thing I hate more than terrorists are people who spam massive walls of copy and paste text. Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 9:32 PM
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thesleeper
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Well, now instead of referring to that book, I can just point them to that page of the thread.
7/20/14 9:34 PM
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Gymrat209
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Especially from websites named ReligionofPeace... Isn't that what everyone on the forum says when some raghead blows themselves up for some silly cause.
7/20/14 9:36 PM
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DomenicVelluso
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thesleeper - Well, now instead of referring to that book, I can just point them to that page of the thread.
The sleeper....


More like sleeper cell you terrorist bastard Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 9:36 PM
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thesleeper
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I guess this is the best paragraph for fratters:

More than one U.S. official on the scene in
the Middle East warned over the years that Arab opposition to the Zionist
program was widespread and would ultimately lead to bloodshed between
Arabs and Jews, but the warnings were ignored.31 In 1922, during the administration
of President Warren Harding, Allen Dulles, then head of the
State Department’s Division of Near Eastern Affairs, later to become the
director of the Central Intelligence Agency in the Eisenhower administration,
and not a Middle East expert except by avocation, wrote a memorandum
to an assistant secretary of state expressing his “strong” feeling that
the State Department should not officially support the positions of either
Zionists, anti-Zionists, or Arabs. Zionism, he observed, had “a certain sentimental
appeal,” but this appeal had to be measured against “the cold fact”
that Jews made up only 10 percent of Palestine’s population. Dulles’s call for
political neutrality fell on deaf ears.
7/20/14 9:38 PM
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thesleeper
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DomenicVelluso - 
thesleeper - Well, now instead of referring to that book, I can just point them to that page of the thread.
The sleeper....


More like sleeper cell you terrorist bastard Phone Post 3.0

Yes, instead of blowing myself up I rear-naked people. Its quite the terrifying experience.
7/20/14 9:49 PM
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DomenicVelluso
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thesleeper -
DomenicVelluso - 
thesleeper - Well, now instead of referring to that book, I can just point them to that page of the thread.
The sleeper....


More like sleeper cell you terrorist bastard Phone Post 3.0

Yes, instead of blowing myself up I rear-naked people. Its quite the terrifying experience.
You choke dudes out and then blow them.... What??

That's pretty fucked up. I cannot approve.

Two real questions...

1. Are you Muslim

2. Did you go to University with a strong leftist presence.


Thank you. Phone Post 3.0
7/20/14 9:55 PM
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Gymrat209
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DomenicVelluso - 
thesleeper - Well, now instead of referring to that book, I can just point them to that page of the thread.
The sleeper....


More like sleeper cell you terrorist bastard Phone Post 3.0

That was pretty funny lol
7/20/14 9:57 PM
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thesleeper
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DomenicVelluso - 
thesleeper -
DomenicVelluso - 
thesleeper - Well, now instead of referring to that book, I can just point them to that page of the thread.
The sleeper....


More like sleeper cell you terrorist bastard Phone Post 3.0

Yes, instead of blowing myself up I rear-naked people. Its quite the terrifying experience.
You choke dudes out and then blow them.... What??

That's pretty fucked up. I cannot approve.

Two real questions...

1. Are you Muslim

2. Did you go to University with a strong leftist presence.


Thank you. Phone Post 3.0

I am not Muslim. My university was not necessarily leftist.

I just call things like they are and do my own research.



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