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BJJGround Forum >> SI joint pain?


7/24/14 5:06 PM
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Kway
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Anyone have to deal with SI joint pain from BJJ?

If so, what did you do to deal with it?

I've been doing acupuncture and have some success with it. What I want to do is weighttraining to fix it though.
7/24/14 6:25 PM
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omoplautistic
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A lot of hip/SI/low back pain especially in bjj comes from the fact that we're always balling up, and contracting inward (sitting in an office chair all day has a similar effect actually) and our hip flexors and psoas get adaptively short.

So you gotta stretch out the front to take the stress of the back. Phone Post 3.0
7/24/14 6:39 PM
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dignan
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If there is physical displacement/shifting of the sacrum, or possibly anterior or posterior locking of the pelvis they should be put back in place.  You can see a chiropractor to get evaluated for this.

While it isn't a bad idea to stretch as things can have some relief, it likely will not correct the rotation or anterior/posterior positioning to make things as symmetrical as possible.  In addition, the mucles and tendon attachments will have stress taken off of the by a. nerve conduction improvement sending the right signals and b. physically allowing the muscles to no longer be stretched.

 

Best of luck.

7/24/14 6:48 PM
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Kway
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I have had it put back into place. I actually had a shelf once, and that was very painful. Now it seems that it swells/inflames too easily at times.

Omo, what do you mean by stretching the front? Phone Post 3.0
7/24/14 9:45 PM
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judoblackbelt
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I always believe in PT to learn the basic exercises to strengthen the muscles of the hip/lower back/glutes/IT band. In conjunction with this my chiropractor adjustments since usually one leg is longer than the other. I only believe in NUCCA or QSM3(progressive NUCCA) chiropractors. They have fixed my SI joint issues 100%. But I have to go back every 2-3 weeks to keep my adjustment. So rehab and chiropractic care is my answer.
7/24/14 11:36 PM
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omoplautistic
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Kway - I have had it put back into place. I actually had a shelf once, and that was very painful. Now it seems that it swells/inflames too easily at times.

Omo, what do you mean by stretching the front? Phone Post 3.0
I just mean stretching your quads, hip flexors and psoas. Anything that feels like it's opening up the front of your hips.

Kelly starretts (mobilitywod.com) super couch stretch works really nicely.

I also try and hit my glutes and stretch the hips in the back as well. (You know like the lay on your back, one knee up, other ankle across your knee, pull gently on your hamstring type)

Or like a pigeon stretch from yoga Phone Post 3.0
7/25/14 2:12 AM
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FatBuddha
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prolotherapy + PT did wonders for me
7/25/14 2:20 AM
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dignan
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judoblackbelt - I always believe in PT to learn the basic exercises to strengthen the muscles of the hip/lower back/glutes/IT band. In conjunction with this my chiropractor adjustments since usually one leg is longer than the other. I only believe in NUCCA or QSM3(progressive NUCCA) chiropractors. They have fixed my SI joint issues 100%. But I have to go back every 2-3 weeks to keep my adjustment. So rehab and chiropractic care is my answer.

I'm glad NUCCA works for you.  I think it's a great technique, but I know plenty of people who haven't responded to it...either way the upper cervical spine shouldn't be ignored as it can play a vital role in unlocking the rest of the spinal column.

 

Good suggestion.

7/25/14 3:59 AM
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lach
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How do you know its SIJ pain?

A lot of people think they have SIJ pain because the pain is located around the SIJ, but except for post partum women whose SIJ ligements get loose, its usually the lower back that is the source. There are a series of 5 tests that a good doc/physio can do that can help to rule in or out SIJ pain, but no point explaining them over the net.

In regards to whether there is a physical displacement of the sacrum, subluxation, or anterior rotation of the sacrum, have you been in a car accident? The forces of daily living, or jiu jitsu are in no way surmountable to sublux the SIJ. The SIJ moves only a few millimeters so anyone who really thinks they can feel a subluxed SIJ is either lying to themselves, or to you.

Here is a nice summary, written by a physio, on how to assess the SIJ. http://thesportsphysio.wordpress.com/2013/04/14/whats-the-best-way-to-reliably-assess-the-sacroiliac-joint/

7/25/14 10:25 AM
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krept
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^ yes, I was going to mention the possibility of it being something impacted upstream (spine) as that's what happened with me (herniated disc). Sure felt like the SI joint area, though.

Additionally, I recommend a PT for the same reason Omo mentioned.
7/25/14 11:34 AM
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kill joy
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omoplautistic - A lot of hip/SI/low back pain especially in bjj comes from the fact that we're always balling up, and contracting inward (sitting in an office chair all day has a similar effect actually) and our hip flexors and psoas get adaptively short.

So you gotta stretch out the front to take the stress of the back. Phone Post 3.0

correct! i just spent 5 months on the bench with a disc issue (s1-l5 so same area).

 

now i unwind, lengthen, mobilize and strengthen my spine everyday with kettlebell swings, yoga, deadlifts etc and feel better then before i got hurt.

 

gotta gotta do conditioning if you want your body to last training 5 days a week

7/25/14 11:34 AM
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kill joy
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go get some sports physio and yoga.  practice proper posture constantly

7/25/14 11:42 AM
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JuDoK@
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I hate to tell you but getting thrown or taking a big fall at JJ/Judo, can feel like a car accident, and yes, I have had SIJ pain for years. Sometimes it feels like my hip is out of joint and it takes 3-4 days and my hip will magically pop back into place, which feels delightful.

I think I have an irritated prirformis muscle as well. I know that all of these things seem to be interrelated most of the time.
7/25/14 11:44 AM
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dignan
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lach - How do you know its SIJ pain?

A lot of people think they have SIJ pain because the pain is located around the SIJ, but except for post partum women whose SIJ ligements get loose, its usually the lower back that is the source. There are a series of 5 tests that a good doc/physio can do that can help to rule in or out SIJ pain, but no point explaining them over the net.

In regards to whether there is a physical displacement of the sacrum, subluxation, or anterior rotation of the sacrum, have you been in a car accident? The forces of daily living, or jiu jitsu are in no way surmountable to sublux the SIJ. The SIJ moves only a few millimeters so anyone who really thinks they can feel a subluxed SIJ is either lying to themselves, or to you.

Here is a nice summary, written by a physio, on how to assess the SIJ. http://thesportsphysio.wordpress.com/2013/04/14/whats-the-best-way-to-reliably-assess-the-sacroiliac-joint/


While I agree with you on getting it properly evaluated to determine the source, I disagree with the opinion of that physiotherapist entirely.

BJJ absolutely has the potential of subluxating the SI joint.  While it would likely be from a serious takedown(e.g. judo throw), there are many positions and submissions that could stress the joint to the point it stays out.

Not trying to be a dick, just pointing out the real life possibility of this occuring,

 

7/25/14 12:12 PM
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BJJER
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In addition to the forces produced in one event that could possibly cause a dislocation it has been proven through research by Dr Stuart McGill that the back can be affected by multiple low impact events over time. I would suggest getting Stuart McGills book "Ultimate Back Fitness and Performance."

just think of the amount of time you spend in the crunch position plus how many times you roll over forwards and backwards and how much you have to do lying leg lifts while doing BJJ.

On top of that I see many BJJ morons always doing a bunch of crunches,situps,and lying straight leg lifts for their abs.

BJJ players should be focusing on the major lifts and for the abs any exercises that strengthen the abs through isometric contractions i.e, planks, windmills, thrusters, glute bridges, swings. And bjj players should always be working on stretching the abs in cobra, stretching your psoas by doing the couch strech and using the supernova ball to massage the piriformis and psoas.
7/25/14 1:29 PM
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Kway
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FatBuddha - prolotherapy + PT did wonders for me

Two questions. How did you even get prolotherapy? What kind of doctor does it?

Also, PT is for Physical Training? Or something else?
7/25/14 3:54 PM
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Kway
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Nevermind, I now realize you mean Physical Therapy.
8/6/14 4:34 PM
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Kway
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Hey guys I wanted to give an update.

I got an MRI done with my regular Doctor. He looked at the results and saw that I do have disc problems. He recommended me to do Spinal Decompression Therapy.

So I found a different chiropractor (then my usual) who has a SDT machine.

This is where I'd like to add that this new chiropractor is amazing. First off I did do the SDT and it instantly made my back better. By the next day I was pain free.

But along with that this new Chiropractor adjusted me as well by using a version of Chiropractic called ART.

WOW!

It is amazing and I would recommend it to anyone. It was something I had never had done to me and the results are fantastic. I did SPT three times, but now am just getting adjusted by the doctor to keep me pain free.

If you get a chance try the ART method, it is great.
8/6/14 4:44 PM
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omoplautistic
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Nice! I've been going to an ART guy for about fifteen years. He's a magician.
Never done the SDT though. Is it super expensive?

Glad you're feeling better! Phone Post 3.0
8/6/14 6:55 PM
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Kway
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Thanks omo! It is expensive. If you buy a set of it, 20 uses, it cost about $1800. Instead I just buy the per session. The best part was that my first two sessions were free, so my third/last one was the only one I bought. That cost $150.

TOTALLY WORTH IT!

I'm thinking of doing it once a month but honestly I'm feeling so much better right now that it may not be necessary.

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