UnderGround Forums
 

BJJGround Forum >> White knighting on the atama forum


8/1/14 3:22 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
checkuroil
266 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/28/03
Posts: 39263
Black Belt, Los Angeles, CA
Why couldn't vinny get someone on btt who was ranked higher than him to sign off on your promotion. Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 3:27 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
JoejitsuMD
75 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 2727
os3y3ris -
Why don't you just find another instructor to train under and get your black belt promotion under?


They were right the first time. That's why I was promoted in the first place. I demonstrated my skill as a black belt and was in fact regional champion at the time. The fact that someone saw this as an opportunity to steal from me saddens me, but I'm not dropping a level to appease criminals.
This is the whole crux of the problem is that YOU are trying to be the judge of whether you are a black belt or not. Second, they didn't promote you, a person who isn't capable of promoting to black belt said he was GOING to promote you. YOU are the one that bought your own belt and tied it around your own waist after the promotion didn't happen. Why do you keep ignoring this?

If I tell someone "I'm going to kick your ass" does that mean thy can give themself a black eye and say "he kicked my ass"? No, YOU WERE NEVER PROMOTED, YOU PROMOTED YOURSELF! Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 3:36 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
LittleWing
6 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/16/08
Posts: 244
Yikes this is painful to watch.

I think the question u need to ask urself is "will somebody at a BB level testify that they promoted me to BB rank." If answer is yes then great, send them a message and post it.

If answer is no, followed by any stories true or not about visas, fees whatever, then u need to find a legit source to promote u. That's the bottom line

U will be stubborn no doubt and say "u won't give in" or it's "against ur code" but u need to put that shit behind u and accept u got screwed

Find urself a legit source and train hard for a yr. doesn't sound like anyone doubts ur skills so it shouldn't take too long. Things will be much better and u can take pride in wearing the belt
8/1/14 3:37 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
creekwarrior2
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 252
Wutang -
os3y3ris - 
Doesn't look to me like there's any mention of a black belt promotion. In fact, it looks like Vinny doesn't even know what application you're talking about


Post the rest of the pages.

 

My bad. I didn't see the other page. Let me post em.

Page 3

Page 4

Reading the FB post, to me it sounds like your conversation with Vinny is the 2k fee is to affiliate with BTT. Vinny basically says the IBJJF is another fee. Again there Is no mention of a BB promotion.

The IBJJF membership fee for Brown Belt is $35. After you fill out the membership application and your belt promotion records signed by instructor who is authorized to promote.

Jordan you have these two confused. Two separate things. Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 3:38 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
BTTMike
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/25/09
Posts: 2406
os3y3ris -
Why don't you just find another instructor to train under and get your black belt promotion under?


They were right the first time. That's why I was promoted in the first place. I demonstrated my skill as a black belt and was in fact regional champion at the time. The fact that someone saw this as an opportunity to steal from me saddens me, but I'm not dropping a level to appease criminals.
First of all, you won a regional NAGA bro. You're not impressing anybody here with your belt from there. There are a ton of black belts and other legit practitioners here who have all competed in, and won little tournaments.

I remember another thread you posted a picture have your belt from that tournament, seeing you close to Division instead of beating some guys. The guy you closed it with is a purple belt. Lol Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 3:42 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
TexDeuce
106 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/15/04
Posts: 27124
Does Osyris have mental issues? Or maybe his story is true and factual and makes sense.

If it were me I would find another instructor and have them promote me. Some goofy shit here. Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 4:05 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
checkuroil
266 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/28/03
Posts: 39266
Black Belt, Los Angeles, CA
I started over at blue belt in the gi two and a half years ago. I am about 8 months from my black belt. Just suck it up and put in the work Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 4:28 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Meatgrinder
120 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/10/05
Posts: 4302
Black Belt, Newton, MA
BTTMike - 
os3y3ris -
Why don't you just find another instructor to train under and get your black belt promotion under?


They were right the first time. That's why I was promoted in the first place. I demonstrated my skill as a black belt and was in fact regional champion at the time. The fact that someone saw this as an opportunity to steal from me saddens me, but I'm not dropping a level to appease criminals.
First of all, you won a regional NAGA bro. You're not impressing anybody here with your belt from there. There are a ton of black belts and other legit practitioners here who have all competed in, and won little tournaments.

I remember another thread you posted a picture have your belt from that tournament, seeing you close to Division instead of beating some guys. The guy you closed it with is a purple belt. Lol Phone Post 3.0

1) Those fb posts don't mention anything about promotion...just talking about affiliation for your school.

regional champ?.... so you're at red line in the Boston area. So am I...I saw Roberto's name mentioned. I train under him. You know how many killers don't give a sh!t about Naga let alone competitions in general? I competed once a couple years ago and won the adult brown <140lb...and stayed at brown. You're leaving regional champ dangling out there like you're the cat's @ss of the region or something and there's nothing left for you at the brown belt level.

Roberto's had guys train under him while owning their own school...(eg. Danny Morrera at North Shore BJJ, Julio Binda's school in Andover, Truimph under John Fain in Nashua. I think John Conners started his school before he was a BB, Bruno Souza at Franklin Martial Arts, Roman DeSousa just got his Brown has a place in Framingham)....  Just ran their own school while doing training under Roberto.... Juliano Coutinho teaches bjj at SYT and Tyson Chartier is a brown belt who just opened a school in Manchester, NH while still training at SYT. 

8/1/14 4:55 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
MickColins
150 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/14/08
Posts: 15501
os3y3ris - Yep. I said that. And I meant it. I won't spend money on companies that profit from harassing outsiders. I don't like that behavior and I won't spend money to finance it.
You reek of douchiness. Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 4:56 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
checkuroil
266 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 2/28/03
Posts: 39271
Black Belt, Los Angeles, CA
Meatgrinder -
BTTMike - 
os3y3ris -
Why don't you just find another instructor to train under and get your black belt promotion under?


They were right the first time. That's why I was promoted in the first place. I demonstrated my skill as a black belt and was in fact regional champion at the time. The fact that someone saw this as an opportunity to steal from me saddens me, but I'm not dropping a level to appease criminals.
First of all, you won a regional NAGA bro. You're not impressing anybody here with your belt from there. There are a ton of black belts and other legit practitioners here who have all competed in, and won little tournaments.

I remember another thread you posted a picture have your belt from that tournament, seeing you close to Division instead of beating some guys. The guy you closed it with is a purple belt. Lol Phone Post 3.0

1) Those fb posts don't mention anything about promotion...just talking about affiliation for your school.

regional champ?.... so you're at red line in the Boston area. So am I...I saw Roberto's name mentioned. I train under him. You know how many killers don't give a sh!t about Naga let alone competitions in general? I competed once a couple years ago and won the adult brown <140lb...and stayed at brown. You're leaving regional champ dangling out there like you're the cat's @ss of the region or something and there's nothing left for you at the brown belt level.

Roberto's had guys train under him while owning their own school...(eg. Danny Morrera at North Shore BJJ, Julio Binda's school in Andover, Truimph under John Fain in Nashua. I think John Conners started his school before he was a BB, Bruno Souza at Franklin Martial Arts, Roman DeSousa just got his Brown has a place in Framingham)....  Just ran their own school while doing training under Roberto.... Juliano Coutinho teaches bjj at SYT and Tyson Chartier is a brown belt who just opened a school in Manchester, NH while still training at SYT. 

And shit got real. Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 6:35 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
krept
87 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 10155
Widdomaker - 
Meatgrinder - 
os3y3ris - 
Maybe you would view it differently if Toby started selling his "black belt" services in your area?


I'm actually open to competitors in the market. Had a guy applying for the exact same job as I. He needed testing for his purple. I agreed to do so, at no cost to him of course, and he passed. He got the promotion and the job. That's my whole point. Let's keep it square across the board, leaving our business dealings out of our evaluations. My student failed to subdue him and so he advanced. That's the jiujitsu standard. Evil, I know.

You are known for being a high level competitor, and have the results to back it up. If you've seen his instructionals or matches it is obvious that his skill level in BJJ is around blue belt. There is no way that he would pass any decent test for a black belt without money being exchanged. So it is obvious that he has cheated his way through the ranks.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6lAJTwif-qY

yup... His grappling sucks. Got mounted with ease a couple of times... could've easily been choked out a couple of times too if Bobby Green knew what he was doing. Green's defense to a mediocre triangle was awful as he had plenty of time to posture out... Was this really an attempt to demonstrate BB level?

I've seen his grappling match videos as well... Nothing I can see leads me to believe that he's beyond a blue belt. Explosive, athlete tough kid though.

 

You're story is that you were training under someone who can't promote you to black... Oh well... Someone who runs a school as a purple belt can't promote his students to black either no matter how long they train under him. Imagine that! You and he tried to figure out a way to get it done but you needed to make your school an affiliate member of the school system that you were going to get promoted under....There are fees with the affiliation, not with the promotion. In a couple of years, your instructor would've been ranked high enough to promote you, but I guess you didn't want to wait that long??? 

..And now you're just pulling these affiliation documents out as examples of an entirely corrupt system (that no one else besides you and Toby really have any trouble with.... and some frauds). So exactly which affiliation were you having trouble with? Because I heard nothing but slander of Carlos and the IBBJF until now?... The IBJJF doesn't even promote. That's for BB school owners who want to be recognized members of the IBJJF in order for their schools to compete in their tournaments at those recognized belt levels. 

 

 


Toby ended up losing that fight anyway. Dont know why the video description says he won. You can clearly hear the bell/horn before Green taps, then Green went on to win by TKO in Rd 2.

I just want to point this out in case this was missed by most.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Green_(fighter)

Check out Bobby's record. He did indeed beat Toby on July 12, 2008, which was the ONLY time they fought per the records on multiple sites of web.

Why does the video description say Toby won? Because that's Toby's Youtube channel. The video was manipulated to look like that was the end of the fight, comments were disabled so nobody could mention what happened.

Man... really?? This almost reminds me of the Stolen Valor stuff when some guy who otherwise honorably served and should be proud of his service, what he really did, instead decides to lie and say he was a Navy SEAL. No shame at ALL in losing a scrap like that in my opinion but taking that route ^ is just plain bad. If he said he lost but should have won it would be much more respectable.

What an irony in linking that fight given the subject. The obfuscation just will not stop.
8/1/14 6:52 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
os3y3ris
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 5/31/03
Posts: 382
You either believe me or you don't, but those are the premises that I act on when I say what I say and take the stances that I take.

You're leaving regional champ dangling out there like you're the cat's @ss of the region or something and there's nothing left for you at the brown belt level.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0LnUCcBYdk

You'll be hard pressed to find a guy that can stop me. If you have someone though, let me know and we can set it up.
8/1/14 6:56 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
krept
87 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 10157
^os3y3ris' vid:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0LnUCcBYdk

8/1/14 6:56 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
os3y3ris
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 5/31/03
Posts: 383
It should also be noted that I didn't take the championship at brown, but at black. BTT asked me to step out of the brown belt division, which landed me in the black belt division, which I won. Also, the close out with with a brown belt, now a black belt, not the purple belt.
8/1/14 7:02 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Wutang
26 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/18/05
Posts: 6458
Black Belt, Los Angeles, CA
krept - ^os3y3ris' vid:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0LnUCcBYdk


Did you just win by heelhook? Is this a NAGA event? It's been a long time since I've seen heelhooks legal in the gi.

8/1/14 7:05 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
os3y3ris
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 08/01/14 7:05 PM
Member Since: 5/31/03
Posts: 384
No, it's The Good Fight Boston Open. They just went sub only. The qualifier rounds are 15 min and the last rounds are no time limit.
8/1/14 7:41 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
FingerorMoon
105 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 10/27/03
Posts: 10519
Personally I think Osiris is in the right here but is pushing shirts up hill.
What is the end game here?

Better off finding an instructor that will promote quickly based on skill and then continuing your crusade Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 8:16 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
BTTMike
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/25/09
Posts: 2407
os3y3ris - You either believe me or you don't, but those are the premises that I act on when I say what I say and take the stances that I take.

You're leaving regional champ dangling out there like you're the cat's @ss of the region or something and there's nothing left for you at the brown belt level.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0LnUCcBYdk

You'll be hard pressed to find a guy that can stop me. If you have someone though, let me know and we can set it up.
Dude, are you serious right now? That's her claim to fame getting a heel hook in a gi tournament against black belt. I didn't realize that submitting a black belt, means are a black belt.

And when I look you up on YouTube, the majority of your matches you lost so I can think of plenty of guys who can stop you. Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 8:27 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
Meatgrinder
120 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/10/05
Posts: 4304
Black Belt, Newton, MA

1) good job on the match... but all that really was was catching someone with a heelhook in a match that didn't really display much good bjj at all...There was 0 guard play. Maybe your weren't struggling for position due to the format, but I don't think side mounted is a place you really wanted to be. Both arms looked in terrible position in side control defensively. You did a good job of getting a leg in when your opponent rushed to mount and he didn't even bother walking your far side elbow and keeping his foot on your hip until dominated and his knee came to the other side. Maybe he was being positionally sloppy due to the sub only format too...IDK. I wouldn't be sloppy no matter what but that's just me and I don't know how tired you guys were.

2) catching someone in a gi match in a sub only format where you reap the knee and get a heel hook might catch someone esp if they don't do much no-gi. I try for kneebars and foot locks against guys that are better than me pretty often when I can't beat them positionally... but you got him so I don't want to demean that. You won the match. Good for you.

3) The fact that you even refer to competition just shows that you totally miss the point of what you think it takes to earn a BB. There are brown belts students who can beat me. They still come to my classes and pay close attention to what I say and they ask my advice all the time...sh!t that I might not even familiar with or isn't part of my game, they ask me for my thoughts on it.

4) who knows...maybe outside of the fact that you don't seem to understand what differentiates a brown from a BB.... Maybe you should get one. No one's saying that your bjj is a fraud... You're just going about sh!t all the wrong way and not earning your BB from someone who has been deemed an authority to do that.... Jimmy Quinlan was a great brown belt. He stayed there for a good long while after kicking everyone's @ss in big tournaments....Sean Fisher from boston just placed at brown in mundials... he did get promoted just last week. There's a lot of guys who could lay out their competition resume and argue that they should become a BB... You F^cking miss the point.... They're not paying 2K fees, etc... I got my BB.. when I thought I wanted to compete at BB  in ibjjf, I got Roberto to sign my form and I sent $35 to ibbjf

5) Let's take away the debate about whether you should/could be at BB skill level... The fact that your promotion has drawn such UNIVERSAL criticism from this bjj community composed of people from all walks of life all over the world....says something. And it doesn't say something good about you. I would personally much rather train under a brown belt who's reputation AND CHARACTER is well respected throughout the bjj world, than someone who is a BB under controversial (AT BEST) circumstances. I just don't think you're doing yourself any favors here over the long term. And it's really a shame because I think you've gone so far on your journey legitimately.

8/1/14 8:36 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
shen
894 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 08/02/14 1:51 AM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 22238
Black Belt, Torrance, CA

There are people who got their BBs 20 years ago and whenever their name comes up, to this day, people will say, "You know there's some debate as to whether that guy is really a black belt". It never goes away. People will not forget and for as long as you do BJJ it will come back to haunt you. 

Sooo... IMO, do it as legitimately as you can. Find a REAL, very legit instructor, spend time with him and let him promote you at his discretion. If you go the Toby route or something similar, you will seriously regret it.

 

 

8/1/14 8:40 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
TexDeuce
106 The total sum of your votes up and votes down Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 7/15/04
Posts: 27127
Meatgrinder talking truth. Just reading Osyris posts makes me think the dude isn't playing with a full deck. Why not get promoted under legit circumstances? Some people are self destructive and don't have the mental faculties to realize it. Phone Post 3.0
8/1/14 8:40 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
raleigh
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 11/13/08
Posts: 20632
Let's put a fucking end to this

Become a Certified Black Belt:

The athletes and professors certified by IBJJF will have their belt rank recognized by an official sport organization. To be certified as a black belt by IBJJF, the athlete or professor must complete the necessary requirements.

The steps to apply for a Black Belt Certificate:

First, you need to provide us the following documents:

- Black Belt Certificate Application form

- Must be signed by the black belt instructor you graduated from
- Professor must have 2 degrees or more

- Membership Application Form
- Certificate of a CPR course
- IBJJF Rules Seminar Certificate of Completion (completed in the last 12 months)
- Copy of a valid photo ID (Driver License, Passport etc.. );
The documentation must be sent to:

United States Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu Federation/IBJJF
17955 Sky Park Cir. Ste. C & D
Irvine, CA, 92614

or by e-mail to: membership@ibjjf.com

Do not send the payment. Once the Application for Black Belt Certificate is approved, we will send an invoice via PayPal. The cost for the first certificate is $400 USD and $150 for each subsequent renewal. The paperwork will be processed after the invoice payment is received.
8/1/14 8:43 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
raleigh
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Edited: 08/02/14 8:32 PM
Member Since: 11/13/08
Posts: 20633
http://ibjjf.org/athletes/black-belt-certification/
8/1/14 8:48 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
os3y3ris
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 5/31/03
Posts: 385
Dude, are you serious right now? That's her claim to fame getting a heel hook in a gi tournament against black belt. I didn't realize that submitting a black belt, means are a black belt


Not A heel hook, lots of heel hooks. Anyways, they told management that I needed to see them to advance, I did and they decided to promote me to black belt. I didn't tell them to do it. I kicked ass, did the team a solid and they recognized it. All this other foolishness about the two grand shouldn't even be a factor.

You F^cking miss the point.... They're not paying 2K fees, etc... I got my BB.. when I thought I wanted to compete at BB in ibjjf, I got Roberto to sign my form and I sent $35 to ibbjf


That's my whole point. They're NOT paying these fees, so on what basis am I being charged, and what does that have to do with my belt rank? Because it looks like the head wanted a bribe to square away the four or five pages of paper work that came with the black belt.
8/1/14 8:50 PM
Ignore | Quote | Vote Down | Vote Up
os3y3ris
Send Private Message Add Comment To Profile

Member Since: 5/31/03
Posts: 386
It's $400 to register with the iibjjf, you need a 2nd deg signature.


On sale for two thousand dollars.

Reply Post

You must log in to post a reply. Click here to login.