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UnderGround Forums >> Anyone Here Rolled With Ken?


5/4/04 12:48 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Mo said Ken is "the strongest guy I've ever rolled with including Mark Coleman". I find this intriguing. Assuming Ken is at his strongest weight, say 220, how is his strength and technique?
5/4/04 1:09 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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TTT
5/4/04 1:24 PM
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jason hornbuckle
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Edited: 04-May-04
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he's obviously very strong. i'd say he strength's his technique a little too much, but what do I know?
5/4/04 1:29 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Interesting, Jason - do you mean exactly by "strength's his technique"? Sounds like very few people have rolled with Ken. Anyone?
5/4/04 1:33 PM
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jaseprobst
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Tony Galindo - who's about 5'6, 200 lbs....told me that rolling with Ken was like rolling with a wild animal because he was so strong. At some point, super strength fuses with technique. Plus, look at how Ken matched up with Severn, a 260-lb wrestler, in their first fight. He blunted Dan's takedown attempts. He's a pretty strong dude.
5/4/04 1:51 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Jaseprobst - thanks for the data. For me, Ken looked as strong as I've seen him in Severn-Shamrock I. He stuffed Fujita's takedown's and looked super strong in that fight too. I'm curious how Kimo's strength (and technique) will compare to Ken TODAY. On a side note, remember when Ken was in Coleman's corner? Did Coleman ever comment on Ken's abilities?
5/4/04 1:55 PM
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jason hornbuckle
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Edited: 04-May-04
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i was thinking specifically of his leglocks on Frye. They weren't technically the best, but that may not be fair for 2 reasons: #1 Ken was very tired, and #2 he broke Don's leg, which is the whole point of the leglock
5/4/04 2:01 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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"and #2 he broke Don's leg" You cracked us up with this line!! It came out of nowhere. Ken did look slower here but as you've said his technique apparently still worked because he broke Frye's leg. We thought the fight was a draw. And Frye seems to agree.
5/4/04 2:06 PM
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jason hornbuckle
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Frye also agreed that he had a hairline fracture in his leg.
5/4/04 2:19 PM
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jaseprobst
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Jason, if you watch the Ken-Fujita fight, you can see Coleman rooting/cornering Ken on from ringside from the main camera angle. i think he was cornering but not sure. Still bummed they missed one another at UU 96. That woulda been sweet. Size and weight don't always mean strength advantage. Ken is only like 220 vs guys like Fujita and Severn, but he has good takedown defense. However good technique, like Tito's, can obviously overcome that. But Ken is amazingly strong for a 220-lb guy.
5/4/04 2:24 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Jason - yes, Frye admitted this and also a tear in the miniscus of his right knee. Ken's subs still work. Jaseprobst - I remember Coleman rooting for Ken against Fujita, but which fight did Ken corner Coleman in UFC? I think it was Rizzo. How do you think Ken's grappling will fare against Kimo?
5/4/04 2:26 PM
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jason hornbuckle
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Edited: 04-May-04
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IF Ken is healthy, he will crush Kimo. He's a better stand up fighter, better wrestler, and better sub guy, and he has better cardio. That's the big IF though, cause Ken always seems to have some kind of injury
5/4/04 2:35 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Jason - I'm rooting for Ken and giving him a slight edge but after watching Kimo drop Sapp with a jab I'm not sure if Ken's standup is better than Kimo's. As for the injury status, I tend to agree, although Ken is rumoured to be in top shape and healthy after the knee operation. However, I'm surprised Ken fought Barnett in pro wrestling last night when there's a reasonable risk of injury there.
5/4/04 4:16 PM
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BZLJJ
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Edited: 04-May-04 06:11 PM
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I rolled w/ Ken when i was 18 yrs old and about 210 lbs....he had just left the UFC and went to the WWF..he was weighing like 235. I was in awe of his strength, it was definitely something i will not forget...he tapped me a few times w/ leg locks, a crucifix and a rear choke. MC *edit- Mike Ciesnolevicz posted this under my (BZLJJ) name.
5/4/04 4:19 PM
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jason hornbuckle
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Edited: 04-May-04
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"I'm rooting for Ken and giving him a slight edge but after watching Kimo drop Sapp with a jab I'm not sure if Ken's standup is better than Kimo's." The thing about the jab is, even a smaller person can drop a bigger person who walks into one. Kimo is strong, no doubt, but Ken is the better stand up fighter, and more importantly, Kimo has never been worth anything past the first round, in MMA or kickboxing
5/4/04 4:24 PM
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waller
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Edited: 04-May-04
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I rolled with Ken pre WWE and this guy has freak strength. I think one thing that made Ken so strong then was that he has incredible tendin strength. I dont know about now though
5/4/04 4:33 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Jason - good observation on the punch. I think the Nick Diaz vs. Lawler fight was another example of this. BZLJJ - Rolled with Ken at 18? You lucky SOB :-) I'd give anything to have done that back then. Good job. Waller - Tendon strength is clearly different than pure muscle strength. Hughes for example also has great tendon strength. Good analysis. How do you think Ken will fare against Kimo's grappling and strength? I find this matchup very interesting.
5/4/04 4:36 PM
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jason hornbuckle
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Edited: 04-May-04
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nah, Diaz vs Lawler was just a clear case of Diaz hitting Lawler and hurting him over and over. He almost dropped Lawler twice before he actually KO'd him Another thing about Sapp is, his chin sucks. You never really notice that cause half his fights are fake and the other half are against 175 lb guys. But Mino was hurting him with punches, Cro Cop hit him and Sapp wouldn't get back up, etc.
5/4/04 5:39 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Hypnos - impressive, that's old school. Where was this, in Lodi? Are you still training? Jason - I agree about Sapp. Bonjaski was tooling him.
5/4/04 5:41 PM
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Lorenthz
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Kimo is a BJJ blackbelt... and Ken is a better grappler? I think not.
5/4/04 5:41 PM
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Fernandez
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ttt
5/4/04 5:43 PM
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orcus
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Edited: 04-May-04
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I thought Kimo would take this until I saw the rest of his K-1 fights, in which he falls down every time his opponent breathes on him. I don't know if it's horrible conditioning, a truly glass jaw, or just awful balance, but the guy gets knocked down by anything.
5/4/04 5:51 PM
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jason hornbuckle
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Edited: 04-May-04
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"Kimo is a BJJ blackbelt... and Ken is a better grappler? I think not" Lord, where do i start with that one? Conan Silvera is a BJJ BB and Dan Severn tapped him. What a proud day for BJJ! Royce Gracie is a BJJ BB and Ken looked fine against him the second time. Plenty of wrestlers have done well against top BJJers (Hughes destroyed one of Rickson's BBs just as 1 example), and Judo players do well against BJJ too. Ken is a better wrestler than Kimo for sure, and that has to figure into overall grappling ability. And even IF NOT, I'd say Ken is more tahn the equivalent of a BJJ Black Belt in terms of pure submission ability
5/4/04 6:03 PM
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HarlanEllison
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Edited: 04-May-04
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Jason - yes. Submission grappling (as used in NHB) in Japan is at the level of BJJ in Brazil and the top guys in each country are comparable. Ken' submission skills rival the top BJJ blackbelts.
5/4/04 6:08 PM
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jason hornbuckle
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Edited: 04-May-04
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ptm, I thought it was Jorge Periera, but its been awhile since i watched that one, so i could be wrong. maybe someone with a better memory can help me out

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