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Massachusetts Underground >> I'm new at this...


4/13/05 9:24 PM
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Kungfuviking
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Edited: 13-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/11/2005
Posts: 0
 
Hey people, Since this is my first post here, it's kinda clear that I'm pretty new to Mixed Martial Arts. I'm looking into getting involved, and learning as much as I can as quickly as I can. As for my previous experience, I have 6 years' training in Tang Soo Do, for which I have a rank of 1st Gup. I have almost seven years experience in Chung Moo Do, which is Kung Fu based, but combines many other styles, Chinese and Japanese. I've dabbled here and there with other styles and schools, like kickboxing. My question is, how do I get started competing? I know I need to train more, and spar more, but I don't know where I should go with my skills to compete. Does anyone have any advice for me?
4/14/05 1:07 AM
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Driscoll
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Edited: 14-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/29/2002
Posts: 3413
Step 1: Burn all of your Kung Fu and Tang Soo Do shit. Step 2: Find a school that teaches grappling. Step 3: Win.
4/14/05 10:29 PM
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Kungfuviking
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Edited: 14-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/11/2005
Posts: 1
Maybe I'm misunderstanding something. Mixed Martial Arts = Different styles of martial arts, blended together and used as a fighting system in a ring/cage. What you're telling me is that Mixed Martial Arts = Grappling, which I'm pretty sure isn't true at all. Yeah, grappling is a part of it, but it's not the whole thing. It's this simple: There is no one style of fighting that's "the best". Kickboxing is not better than Katate, and Karate is not better than Kickboxing. Grappling is not better than striking, and striking is not better than grappling. As far as I understand it, one chooses a style that best fits one's natural tendencies and body type. I plan on learning some grappling/wrestling skills, but probably only enough to help me escape from being pinned on the ground and getting hit there. I plan on using what I have and staying on my feet. As for your advice...thanks, but I was looking for something more along the lines of "where do I compete at an amateur level?" and "who can I contact?" Thanks.
4/15/05 3:50 AM
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Jim Clifford
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Edited: 15-Apr-05
Member Since: 09/29/2003
Posts: 200
You've been advised to drop all your kung fu and tradional martial arts training with good reasons. Mixed Martial Arts does indeed entail multiple arts being used together; however, we have found over the course of the last 10 or 11 years that certain "arts" work far better than others. Namely: Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu/ Grappling Wrestling Boxing Muy-Thai and maybe some Judo Please rent or purchase UFCs 1 through 5 if you wish to understand why most people here scoff at Kung Fu, Kempo, Karate and the like. I am suggesting this right off the bat because you will most likely not be swayed by text arguments. They do not work in real fighting. Your proof is in the video footage. It would be cruel of me to direct you to a promoter and have you set up for a fight at this point. You would probably be seriously injurred or hurt and I don't want that on my concious.
4/15/05 9:31 AM
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Kungfuviking
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Edited: 15-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/11/2005
Posts: 6
Thanks for explaining this to me like I'm not an idiot, Jim. I understand what you're saying, and I remember having seen a few of the early UFCs. I think it's difficult to develop a traditional martial art into a more modern fighting style, but i don't think it just flat-out "doesn't work". Have you ever heard of Sanshou? It's Chinese freestyle sparring. The idea is for practitioners of the Chinese martial arts to take their styles and develop a fighting system with them, and compete with one another. I'm looking into training Sanshou. I'm looking into training more kickboxing, and a little wrestling. Again, I understand your point of view, and I'm not saying you're totally wrong, but I think it's definately possible to do something in the cage that nobody else has done quite yet.
4/18/05 2:26 PM
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CR1chard
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Edited: 18-Apr-05
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 4825
how much live sparring have you done in your various TMA (traditional martial art) training? That is a major flaw in many of these arts, a lack of real sparring, utilizing the techniques necessary to win a fight. MMA schools offer one of the few training environments where you can train at nearly 100% - there is very little theory without physical evidence. The TMA thing has been done - it doesn't work in a sport-fighting environment. To think that your 6 years of TMA training will offer you some unique perspective and allow you to compete in a way that's never been done before is just plain delusional. To discredit the opinions of two people who have actually stepped into the ring is further evidence of your delusions. It's OK, I understand that it's hard to stumble upon the realization that over half a decade in martial arts training means dick in real-world and/or sportfighting applications. Denial is the first stage in breaking the chains of TMAs, and accepting real martial arts involve bloody noses, hyper-extended joints, cauliflower ears, and hours of training in the ring - not just a fancy kata. You tell us where you live, we'll be more than happy that to point you to a great MMA school in your area.
4/18/05 4:04 PM
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Kungfuviking
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Edited: 18-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/11/2005
Posts: 9
To answer your question, CR1, I've actually done a lot of sparring. I still do a lot of sparring. And I've been in a few real fights, and seen that the things I've learned do work. I have thirteen plus years of TMA trailing, not six. And I wasn't implying that I have a unique perspective on your sport that you or anyone else doesn't have. I'm not discrediting the oppinions of anyone here, or the validity of their fighting styles; but I fee like a lot of people are discrediting the possibility of someone stepping into the ring, doing something different, and doing it well enough to win. I'm not in denial, and I'm not delusional. I know that real fighting involves injury and hard work. I've been injured in my training, and I'm more than willing and capable of putting in the hours of work. As for "fancy kata", you'd be surprised what you could learn if you paid attention to what is going on with it. I didn't ask advice to start throwing insults back and forth, and I'm not here to prove the my style of martial art is the best. If I had posted a request for advice that said "I've been training MMA for alomst a year now", I betcha you guys would have had no problem roecommending a place for me to go fight. I live in Beverly, Mass.
4/18/05 4:04 PM
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Kungfuviking
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Edited: 18-Apr-05 04:04 PM
Member Since: 04/11/2005
Posts: 10
(double post)
4/19/05 12:20 AM
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Bill Mahoney
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Edited: 19-Apr-05 12:22 AM
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 2203
You tried guys, now just give him the emails of the local promoters.And know that it won't be your fault.
4/19/05 4:27 AM
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legalgrappler
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Edited: 19-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/07/2005
Posts: 0
kungfuviking - by a place to go fight do you mean a place to go and train - learn some new skills and eventually see how you can use your background in a MMA setting or do you mean where can you compete without having learnt any grappling skills? If it is the latter then no offence but you are going to get badly hurt, if the former then guys there is no need to respond to kungfuviknig the way you did. Let me give you my background so you understand. I trained in Karate for 18 years after about 9 years of karate training I thought I could take anyone so entered a kick boxing tourament AND .... got my head taken off (at the time I was captain of my state karate team and a member of my countries karate team - read kicked ass in karate) I learnt from this that I had better get some broader experience. So I started training in boxing and krav maga. 6 Months later I got back in the ring and kicked the crap out of the guy that knocked me out (fight went for less than 15 seconds). I learnt that my TMA training gave me an exceptional basis but had gaps that needed to be bridged. You would have thought that I learnt from that but no. Thinking no one could take me I went to a Jiu Jitsu academy with a friend of mine. The techniques were interesting but I though I could just use strength to get out of trouble. So I had the pleasure of fighting a 55kg girl - somehow she got to my back ... no big deal I thought - she got her arm around my neck but it didn't hurt - I was sure I could get out .... hmmm out is correct! She put me to sleep. I have been training in Gracie Jiu Jitsu ever since. In my 20 years of martial arts (both TMA and MMA) the one thing I have learnt is that no single art is the answer (hence the term MMA) you MUST stay open to the fact that you can learn from other arts. I am sure you could teach all of us something interesting from your Kung Fu - without grappling skills, however, you will always be a deficient fighter (and pure grapplers without any striking skills are equally deficient). I hope you take this in the spirit it was intended.
4/19/05 7:54 AM
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CR1chard
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Edited: 19-Apr-05 07:55 AM
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 4827
Joe Cuff, matchmaker of the Mass Destruction promotion, can be reached at jcuff@nagafighter.com Bruce Marshall of Combat Zone fame can be rached at You have ignored this user.
4/19/05 7:58 AM
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CR1chard
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Edited: 19-Apr-05
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 4828
that's weird, it won't let me edit my post... Bruce's email is ichiniban@aol.com both guys will be more than happy to throw you on a card, especially if you can sell tickets
4/19/05 9:55 AM
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Driscoll
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Edited: 19-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/29/2002
Posts: 3433
"Again, I understand your point of view, and I'm not saying you're totally wrong, but I think it's definately possible to do something in the cage that nobody else has done quite yet." "I'm not discrediting the oppinions of anyone here, or the validity of their fighting styles; but I fee like a lot of people are discrediting the possibility of someone stepping into the ring, doing something different, and doing it well enough to win." Tough guy, you wouldn't be the first to apply TMA into MMA. The most successful guy to do it is probably Shonie Carter. Then you have a huge drop-off to guys that end up on the wrong end of highlight videos. So don't think you're special because you want to put your Tang Soo Do to work in the ring. Hell, I saw Greg Mendes, one of the top Tang Soo Do guys in the area go into the ring and get tapped out by an 8-months-of-grappling-and-nothing-else Joey Lauzon. "I plan on learning some grappling/wrestling skills, but probably only enough to help me escape from being pinned on the ground and getting hit there. I plan on using what I have and staying on my feet." Do you honestly think that you're going to learn only how to escape and just get some guy off of you who's been training BJJ for years? If you fight a grappler, they are going to take you down and hold you down. End of story. And if all of this still isn't getting to you and you still wanna fight, please tell me that you're in the weight range of 150-160.
4/19/05 10:27 AM
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Kungfuviking
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Edited: 19-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/11/2005
Posts: 11
Thank you, legalgrappler, for understanding what I'm saying. Let me reapeat this again, for those who aren't getting what I'm saying: I am not out to prove that what I do is the best, or the only way to do things. I know that what I do makes me an underdog. I'll say it again: I have six years' training in Tang Soo Do, and Over seven years in Chung Moo Do. Chung Moo Do is an art composed of over eight other styles; which should give you the idea that I'm open to the idea of learning new styles and adding them to what I already know. I'm not too good to learn some more kickboxing or grappling. I expect to. That said, though, thank you, CR1 for those names. I'll e-mail them once I feel I'm ready. And Driscoll, I'm 180 lbs, but if you feel like I'm that handicapped, I'd be alright with giving you a chance to prove it.
4/19/05 1:36 PM
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CR1chard
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Edited: 19-Apr-05
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 4829
180? I know someone who'd be a good opponent for you...he has trained extensively in Uechi-Ryu karate, and might be a good first fight to highlight TMA skills
4/19/05 8:31 PM
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Driscoll
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Edited: 19-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/29/2002
Posts: 3435
"And Driscoll, I'm 180 lbs, but if you feel like I'm that handicapped, I'd be alright with giving you a chance to prove it." The boxing commission wouldn't allow it, but the doors of Reality Self-Defense are always open, and you're free to come any time you want. I'll be there in a couple of weeks when my ankle's better.
4/20/05 1:15 PM
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Kungfuviking
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Edited: 20-Apr-05
Member Since: 04/11/2005
Posts: 13
Driscoll, lemme know when your ankle's better, maybe we'll set something up. CR1, I'm interested in your guy, too. How would I go about sparring/fighting this guy?
4/20/05 4:28 PM
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bee rad
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Edited: 20-Apr-05
Member Since: 01/17/2005
Posts: 147

kungfuviking:  I really do suggest you learn some BJJ & grappling before you look to spar anyone here or in the area...let alone fight in a show.  I too practiced Chung Moo Do (OOm Yung Do) in Florida (years ago) for about 4 years.  Although it is touted to blend 7 matrial arts, the real practical training rec'd is far less than what you would need to compete in MMA in my opinion. Although forms such as Tang Na & Bagwa (spelling?) are great physical exercises, one is not going to use ANYTHING from it to help defend themselves.  I can speak from experience.

Get to a place that teaches grappling /bjj and boxing/kickboxing and get some real live exposure and then make the decision for yourself if this type of training will help you compete in MMA.

 

Good luck to you.

4/21/05 2:31 PM
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Dan Lauzon
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Edited: 21-Apr-05
Member Since: 11/13/2003
Posts: 983
ha
4/28/05 4:14 AM
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Jim Clifford
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Edited: 28-Apr-05
Member Since: 09/29/2003
Posts: 220
pure evil.
5/2/05 1:07 PM
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Rickmassmma
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Edited: 02-May-05
Member Since: 06/02/2004
Posts: 1911
so what happened to this guy? Is he still looking for a fight?
5/2/05 4:33 PM
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Driscoll
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Edited: 02-May-05
Member Since: 04/29/2002
Posts: 3503
I sure as hell hope so, Rick.
6/1/05 9:26 PM
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Kungfuviking
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Edited: 01-Jun-05
Member Since: 04/11/2005
Posts: 14
Yeah. Why?
6/1/05 10:43 PM
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Bill Mahoney
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Edited: 01-Jun-05
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 2269
I think driscoll vs kungfuviking in a friendly sparring match after a weekly tourney some saturday at RSD would be compelling veiwing.
6/2/05 2:13 PM
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Driscoll
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Edited: 02-Jun-05
Member Since: 04/29/2002
Posts: 3620
I'm down like Charlie Brown.

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