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PhilosophyGround >> How is Christianity even possible?


5/6/05 1:48 AM
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ruthlesstoothles
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Edited: 06-May-05
Member Since: 09/23/2004
Posts: 234
are you kidding? if the matrix wasn't true, how would it exist? if pinocio wasn't true, how would it exist? if the odysey wasn't true, how would it exist? if gumby wasn't true how would it exist? if santa wasn't true how could he exist? you can't possible believe these were made up can you? (just in case anywone isn't paying attention... this is HEAVY sarcasm.) budy, there are a ton and a half of b.s. stories that are believed by someone... even if only kids, and they are totally made up. that's not to say that there is nothing to be learned from a story, just that it is what it is, A STORY!
5/6/05 10:07 PM
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bgyuk
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Edited: 06-May-05
Member Since: 12/28/2004
Posts: 99
OMG well i quized my dad today. He's a minister, and now i'm out the house. Dont know where you get all this from but i wish i never came on to this stupid fourm!
5/7/05 12:25 AM
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ruthlesstoothles
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Edited: 07-May-05
Member Since: 09/23/2004
Posts: 239
that's what forums are for, to discus subjects that might not be a good idea to family and friends that might freak out on you. why ask him and get his panties in a bunch when you can read the bible yourself online for free? http://www.biblegateway.com/ this website has multiple versions of the bible in an easy to research format. knock yourself out.
6/28/05 6:42 PM
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The Objectivist
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Edited: 28-Jun-05
Member Since: 06/25/2005
Posts: 2
All religions (Christianity, Islam, Judism, Buddism, Zen, etc.) are ways for men to manipulate other people. Even 99% of philosophy is no different. Kant attacked mens minds on every page. Ayn Rand is the only one you can trust.
7/1/05 4:12 AM
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kumikata
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Edited: 01/28/09 12:24 AM
Member Since: 1/1/01
Posts: 394

Kumikata said: I think a sold historical case for the truth of Christianity can be made. I believe this case can be built without assuming that the bible is the Word of God or that it is innerrant. There are a handful of facts that the majority of ancient historians and skeptical biblical scholars (both conservative and liberal, Christian and non-Christian) agree upon with regards to the historical Jesus and early Christianity.

1. Jesus of Nazareth was crucified in Jerusalem by the Roman authorities in roughly 30 A.D. This crucifixion resulted in his death.

2. The earliest disciples of Jesus at least BELIEVED that Jesus had appeared to them after his death. This includes Matthew, John, Peter, James, Paul, and the rest of the disciples.

3. On Easter morning, Jesus' tomb was found empty by a group of his women followers. It would have been almost impossible for the disciples to have proclaimed the resurrection of Jesus in Jerusalem, if his corpse had been lying in a tomb in that very city. All the opponents of Christianity would have had to do was simply pull Jesus' body out of the tomb and drag it through the streets of Jerusalem. The hoax would have been over. To the best of our knowledge, no such corpse was ever produced.

4. The Apostle Paul (formerly Saul of Tarsus) experienced a post-mortem appearance of Jesus that transformed his life so much that he went from being a zealous persecuter of Christians to becoming one of the Christian faiths' strongest proponents and missionaries. Historians tell us that Paul was martyred for his faith in the mid 60's A.D.

5. James, the brother of Jesus, was put to death in the 60's A.D. by the Jewish religious leaders for being a bishop of the early Christian Church. This is the same brother who apperently did not believe in Jesus during his earthly ministry. This information was obtained from Josephus the Roman historian (a non-Christian).

Christians believe that the best explanation of the disciples belief in the risen Jesus was that Jesus really did rise from the dead. I think that the "Apparent Death Theory", the "Hallunication Theory", "The Swoon Theory" (the idea Jesus was taken down from the cross alive) and others do not seem like reasonable explanations for the beginning of the early Christian Church. Anyway, I feel that those facts, coupled with the arguemnts for God's existence, make Christian faith at least rational. 

7/1/05 5:37 PM
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rolijuju
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Edited: 01-Jul-05
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 947
Kumikata How many of the apostles died because they were christians? Thanks. Roli Delgado
7/3/05 3:20 AM
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FiatLux
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Edited: 03-Jul-05
Member Since: 03/12/2002
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"If it wasn't true then how would the bible exist? You can't possible believe someone made it up?" Well it fits with a pattern of revisionist history. The collection of books in the bible is capricious at best: why not include the gnostic gospels? Christianity is very similar to Zoroastrianism in ways that make is seem possible that the later is a cheap copy of the former. The bible exists to control people. Its the same practice as converting old Pagan and Druid sites to being Christian ones. Its not unique, correct, or special, but if Christainity absorbs and replaces other things people once held to be true then it will be accepted despite logic due to tradition.
7/3/05 9:55 PM
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kumikata
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Edited: 03-Jul-05
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 399
10 of the original 12 Apostles were killed for being Christians. Judas killed himself after betraying Christ. John apparently died a natural death in his 90's after being exiled. James, the brother Jesus, was killed in roughly 64 A.D. according to Josephus. Peter and Paul were martyred in the early 60's under the reign of Nero according Clement of Rome (written about 96 A.D.)
7/4/05 11:59 AM
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Sun Wu Kung
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Edited: 04-Jul-05
Member Since: 02/21/2005
Posts: 58
Why pick on Christianity alone ruthless? What about all the other BS people buy into? Wives tales, superstitions, bad science, voodoo medicine, the government, top 40's music, etc? People believe all sorts of shit so they don't look stupid in front of a society that buys into the same horseshit. I think we ought to discuss man as a believer in bs.
7/18/05 11:31 PM
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gord96
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Edited: 18-Jul-05 11:31 PM
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ruthlesstootless, the NT is what you read if you want to understand Christianity.....don't take the OT so literally...crazy kid
10/12/05 4:42 AM
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Ashetarov
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Edited: 12-Oct-05
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 308
Perhaps some discussion of the Flying Spaghetti Monster is appropriate. It starts here: http://www.venganza.org/ For more sites and info, go here: http://search.yahoo.com/search?ei=utf-8&fr=slv1-&p=flying+spaghetti+monster Beer volcanoes and stripper factories in heaven, Fridays off work, excellent with parmesan... what more could you ask?
11/28/05 7:16 PM
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limpjena
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Edited: 28-Nov-05
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 159
FloorFighter, would you be willing to say that your belief in Christianity is a belief? That you wouldnt prove it on a board with a marker; It's something you dont doubt but cant prove, hence its faith? PVJ
1/21/06 1:21 AM
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ruthlesstoothles
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Edited: 21-Jan-06
Member Since: 09/23/2004
Posts: 314
i recently came accross a theory that brings more light to the mass following of xtianity. heaven vs hell. like pavlov's dog. in a sence, or animal training. link pain "hell" to unwanted activity and pleasure "heaven" to desired activity and you have a great plan for directing human conduct. you can die at ANY time, so you must follow the given criteria or you're doomed to suffer pain for ever. brilliant. i think it was fudo? who said something about evolution. that has some bearing. the society that is organized to follow a given criteria to benefit people NOT killing eachother would have the tendency to out-live a society that has no rules. does that mean there is no spirituality and that xtianity simply survived out of evolutionary chance?
1/30/06 11:19 PM
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kylethasnizake
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Edited: 30-Jan-06
Member Since: 01/07/2004
Posts: 591
rational thoughts or just people that agree with you
2/18/06 1:40 AM
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ScottMorrisRULES
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Edited: 18-Feb-06
Member Since: 07/01/2003
Posts: 242
Interesting thread.... How come Christianity exists? I believe you should break it down and attempt to discover possible fundamental connections to other structures of thought and activity. Like, for example, - Why does every cluster or grouping of man, at some stage of their cultural/social evolution, form hierarchial power structures that are almost always pyramidic? Why pyramidic? Why not, say, a completely decentralized and egalitarian Social Contract, or a pluralistic minority domination over the whole without any appreciable "firm center"? And why are they the most prevalent structure? - Why is the structure of "myth" used predominantly to explain natural phenomenon? And why are there eerie similarities in the associations and connotations given to certain phenomenon/concepts/objects by seemingly far flung tribes who could not have "polluted" the philosophical development of the other? - Why do almost all religions and quasi religious mythical theologies include reward/punishment philosophies associated with the afterlife? Again, cross-reference with the second question....WHY is it, that cultures with completely different value systems/collective experiences/etc. develop basically identical structures of paradise/hell into their religions? Forgive me if I'm being overly Socratic. I'm not being lazy and just asking questions because I have nothing to contribute. It's just that questions like these really confound me. I think if you can find some reasonable answers, then they may play into some possible underlying answers as to why Christianity and other complex philo-religious systems develop and persist like they do.
8/4/06 4:42 AM
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DivideByZero
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Edited: 04-Aug-06
Member Since: 12/19/2002
Posts: 576
"some of us are christians and very "logical" and rational thinkers. Its just fun for some people to knock others belief's becuase they scratch the surface and don't use their whole heart. *********flame away************" I guess I'll be the first to point out that you claim to be a logical person and in the same sentence defend your stance by saying people don't use their hearts.
8/4/06 7:24 PM
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boogiemac
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Edited: 04-Aug-06
Member Since: 08/17/2005
Posts: 81
"some of us are christians and very "logical" and rational thinkers. Its just fun for some people to knock others belief's becuase they scratch the surface and don't use their whole heart." I have found that my heart is not nearly as reliable as my mind. You should try listening to mind sometime, you may be suprised at what you hear.
8/8/06 6:04 PM
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ReneH
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Edited: 08-Aug-06
Member Since: 01/01/2001
Posts: 351
"One explenation that I have seen, to why religions can develop in groups of people, comes from evolutionary psychologists, who argue along the lines that societies that developes religious rules and codifies moral behaviour will have an evolutionary advantage to other societies who doesn?t." If our laws mirror religious doctrines than it will be much easier to control and establish civil order. it is in the best interest of any government to condone religion overall. On the other hand, what compels people to accept fairy tales to guide their existence is beyond me. I can't comprehend that at all.
8/12/06 11:39 AM
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DonnaTroy
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Edited: 12-Aug-06
Member Since: 09/22/2002
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"How are so many people caught up in ancient fairy tales that don't even make sence?" Because they are raised this way... and heaven is a beautiful fairy tale, ain't it? To face reality as it is uses to hurt us.
8/16/06 3:32 AM
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FiatLux
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Edited: 16-Aug-06
Member Since: 03/12/2002
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Considering Christianity's preoccupation with eschatology: what is the virtue of a death cult?
9/27/06 9:16 AM
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Indrek R.
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Edited: 27-Sep-06
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Don´t start that shit again... no matter how much you advertise any such a book as soon as some of us will pick it up we will find only bad scholarship and mumbo-jumbo...
10/2/06 4:06 PM
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ChDnny
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Edited: 02-Oct-06
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Posts: 22
sorry im a young dude not brought up in a christian household and i find just with the facts i know that christianinty and the bible are weird yes? " George Heron, a French mathematician, calculated that the odds of one man fulfilling only 40 of those prophecies are 1 in 10 to the power of 157. That is a 1 followed by 157 zeros. Compare it to this; your odds on winning the state lottery are 14 followed by 6 zeros. Mathematician, Dr. Peter S. Ruckman, claims the odds of being fulfilled only 60 of them by the only person who claimed to be the Son of God, and who died on a "tree" on Calvary, and who rose the 3rd day are astronomical!... not just one in one trillion, but one out of ten to the 895th power. That is a one over a one followed by 895 zeros. " shouldnt those numbers prove god couldnt have done them instead of the opposite? and the bible says the earth is only 4000 years old right? so in science classes christians have bad grades and deny what they are learning? pangea and shiz couldnt be real, and we are not sitting on moving faults? my boss said that evolution is whack....how do they explain all different types of birds and how they are different because of their surroundings and such? on the history channel they have a lot of shows dedicated to hell, they tell of how people explain how hell is and that they can go into detail, but i havent seen a show on heaven. i havent even heard about heaven, all people know is that its good? you know to yourself what is good or bad to you(pop, chicken, racng cars, etc) but in heaven your allowed to do anything you want? and infiniti of bs arent you gonna get tired of the things you always wanted to do and not wanna do a damn thing? dead babies cant grow up and have a mind in heaven? if youve done it all, for infiniti, wouldnt heaven become a hell where you dont want to do a thing? im sorry maybe what i said sounds ignorant, i would like someone to tell me and disprove what im thinkin....
10/2/06 4:09 PM
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ChDnny
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Edited: 02-Oct-06 04:51 PM
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Posts: 23
dang, double post?
11/5/06 11:52 PM
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truthisalive
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Edited: 05-Nov-06
Member Since: 03/14/2002
Posts: 448
Ruthlesstoothles...perhaps I can challenge you to a game of wits....find me one contradiction in the bible.
12/19/06 8:26 PM
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EVILYOSHIDA
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Edited: 19-Dec-06
Member Since: 12/03/2003
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The widespread belief in christianity proves that the west is far more hierarchical minded and less indivdualistic than the aetheist societies of the east. Nothing is more fatalist then giving your life to God. Nothing is more fatalist then saying that everything is a product of your genes. Both of these philosphies are fatalist.

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