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PoliticalGround >> Global warming = liberal agenda?


2/7/07 11:24 AM
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Joe Ray
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Edited: 07-Feb-07
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George Bush and his government now officially believe man made economic activity induces global warming. They may not want to do anything about it but at least they now admit it is real. marines1 and all other Bush Republicans, stop emboldening the enemy by disagreeing with The Dear Leader
2/7/07 12:52 PM
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Up With Evil
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Edited: 07-Feb-07
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"I have a feeling that marines1 is warming up to give you liberals a knockout blow." He probably had to back up a long ways to get a good running start.
2/8/07 7:57 AM
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jellyman
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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http://www.oce.orst.edu/media/climate_change_Pacific_NW_6.pdf Here's an article by the same institution that calls this guy the state climatologist, saying GW is for real
2/8/07 9:56 AM
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Up With Evil
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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"Below is a petition of person who do not believe global warming is man made." Yet again you clearly demonstrate that you have almost no understanding of this issue. Your latest haul from an afternoon of heavy Googling is the infamous "Oregon Petition". Like most of your sources, this too is considered something of a joke, even earning a rebuke from the National Academy of Sciences for its thinly-veiled attempt to make the propaganda attached to the petition look exactly like an article from "Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences": "The NAS Council would like to make it clear that this petition has nothing to do with the National Academy of Sciences and that the manuscript was not published in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences or in any other peer-reviewed journal. The petition does not reflect the conclusions of expert reports of the Academy." 5 minutes of actual effort on your part would have helped you avoid being forced to defend yet another widely-discredited bundle of baloney: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_Petition http://www.sciam.com/page.cfm?section=sidebar&articleID=0004F43C-DC1A-1C6E-84A9809EC588EF21 http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Oregon_Institute_of_Science_and_Medicine#Case_Study:_The_Oregon_Petition
2/8/07 11:03 AM
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Up With Evil
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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"I did 1 minute of "googling" not an after noon." Don't think your lack of actual effort isn't obvious, either. "Every single point made against your view is discredited by standards not applied to your supporters." Yes, of course, my "supporters" use internet petitions and forged journal articles as "proof" of their position. Fine work there laddie. Here, let me show you a little something from my "supporters" which you are probably unaware of, since this won't come up when you run a Google search with the denialists keywords: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1997/10/971002070106.htm "More than 1,500 of the world's most distinguished senior scientists, including the majority of [living] Nobel laureates in science, have signed a landmark consensus declaration urging leaders worldwide to act immediately to prevent the potentially devastating consequences of human-induced global warming. The "World Scientists' Call for Action at Kyoto" was presented to the Clinton Administration today at a Science Summit on Climate Change in Washington, DC. "Let there be no doubt about the conclusions of the scientific community: the threat of global warming is very real and action is needed immediately," said Nobel laureate Henry Kendall, Chairman of the Union of Concerned Scientists and author of the scientists' statement. "It is a grave error to believe that we can continue to procrastinate. Scientists do not believe this and no one else should either." " More than 50 Nobel Prize-winning scientists - sure puts the laughable Oregon petition (which asks only that you have a bachelor's degree but will take your word for it) in perspective, doesn't it? Hey, about about the American Geophysical Union and the American Institute of Physics? http://www.aip.org/fyi/2004/042.html "Human activities are increasingly altering the Earth's climate. These effects add to natural influences that have been present over Earth's history. Scientific evidence strongly indicates that natural influences cannot explain the rapid increase in global near-surface temperatures observed during the second half of the 20th century." Again, I ask you in the interest of fairness (and surely you aren't biased against *fairness*, are you?) to actually make an effort to learn something about the laughably fraudulent "Oregon Petition" which is now your latest attempt at citing discredited pseudo-scientific authority while willfully ignoring the actual science on this topic. The petition is transparantly worthless PR funded by a right-wing political think tank and has no credibility. http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title= Oregon_Institute_of_Science_and_Medicine
2/8/07 11:14 AM
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Up With Evil
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Edited: 08-Feb-07 11:14 AM
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"BTW, I could post hundreds more on the topic. " The Great Gazoogle has been good to you, my child. "I guess every single one of the hundreds of scientists and meterologists are all paid off, liars or stupid." Because you don't read any actualy scientific articles, all you can do is troll the internet and pick out articles from people you've never heard of who just happen to agree with you. It's the "1000 flies can't be wrong" theory. I can give you the names of 100 people with bachelor's degrees who believe the earth is less than 10,000 years old, but that doesn't make them anything more than an tiny extremist fringe with no scientific credibility. If right-wing think tanks were pouring millions of dollars to Ken Ham and Duane Gish, you'd be citing their authority as well, and I'd be laughing at that. "While all of the pro global warming experts are not paid off, truth tellers and brilliant." Dear boy, you don't even make any effort to read the legitimate scientific publications on the matter, hiding behind whatever the Great Gazoogle can dig up to prop up your pseudoscientific fringe positions. In fact, it's almost as if you intentionally go out of your way to find the least-credible, most obviously debunked sources you could!
2/8/07 11:19 AM
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bhamill
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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LOL! kudos hubris.
2/8/07 1:31 PM
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jellyman
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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"I do know that when a meterologist says that he has been studying weather since 1978 and he knows no other meterologist who believe in global warming I take pause, is that not peer review?" Erm... no. Maybe you should Google "Peer Review" And don't get all mad because we discovered that your 'state climatologist' is a straight-up fraud. Such a little quibble, I'm such a liberal elitist, demanding that people who call themselves climatologists be actual climatologists. As for the marijuana debate, I simply grabbed news articles from non-marijuana related sites showing MJ is unlikely to cause lung, throat or head cancer. Quoting actual studies from actual doctors. From this you erect the straw man that I say marijuana is harmless and of course you equate actual medical research with some made-up bullshit by frauds. I can only hope you're trolling, or if not, hope that if there is a God that he watches over you, because you are looking like a simple mothafucka
2/8/07 1:31 PM
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Up With Evil
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Edited: 08-Feb-07 01:31 PM
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"That is exactly what you did for your information as well." Wrong yet again. What a sad, desperate play you continue to engage in. You've never read a scientific journal in your life, and don't think it isn't painfully obvious.
2/8/07 1:32 PM
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Dratherbe
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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I find it interesting that "UN Scientists" are somehow conferred automatic authority, while scientists with dissenting views are somehow evil co-conspirators because they might receive money from an oil company. Who funds these "UN Scientists"? Or are they simply above reproach/unimpeachable because of the arguments they espouse?
2/8/07 1:40 PM
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jellyman
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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"Jellyman, you tell people that smoking marijuana does ZERO damage to your body" You keep saying I say that. Can you link me a quote of me saying that? I never said that. But keep clinging to that lie, why not, you seem to be attracted to them.
2/8/07 1:41 PM
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Up With Evil
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"I find it interesting that "UN Scientists" are somehow conferred automatic authority" ...as well as these so-called "Nobel Laureates" and purported "National Medal of Science" winners. Who are these people? If they're so great, why aren't they on TV? "while scientists with dissenting views are somehow evil co-conspirators because they might receive money from an oil company." They either did or didn't. "Might" doesn't carry much weight. Sadly, most of them did, as I have documented in the past and will gladly do again.
2/8/07 1:50 PM
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Dratherbe
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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Interesting quote from a UN-Approved scientist, Dr. Melvyn Shapiro... You probably know him, he spoke at the UN sponsored WMO/JMA Public Forum Workshop World Conference on Disaster Reduction (WCDR) Kobe, Japan, 21 January 2005 The title of the conference was: Reducing Risks of Weather, Climate and Water extremes Through Advanced Detecting, Monitoring, Early warnings and Opportunities of Information Society ...but, you were probably there, so you know that already... He spoke during the Scientific and technological advancements towards the development of seamless predction systems of extreme events session and his topic was "The prediction of High-impact Weather on Time-scales from Minutes to Millennia" Here's what he had to say about the looming ozone crisis in 1992, "If there were no dollars attached to this game, you'd see it played on intellect and integrity," said Dr. Shapiro. "When you say the ozone threat is a scam, you're not only attacking people's scientific integrity, you're going after their pocketbook as well. It's money, purely money." I'm sure he's delusional. All of these Nobel Laureates work for free, don't they?
2/8/07 1:51 PM
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jellyman
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"while scientists with dissenting views" You mean like the state climatologist of Oregon who isn;t actually a scientist?
2/8/07 2:08 PM
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Up With Evil
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"Here's what he had to say about the looming ozone crisis in 1992," Three years after CFC's were banned by the Montreal Accord to reduce ozone depletion?
2/8/07 2:17 PM
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jellyman
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UWE don't be such a nitpicker
2/8/07 2:27 PM
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Dratherbe
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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"Three years after CFC's were banned by the Montreal Accord to reduce ozone depletion?" So, your response to his saying "it's all about money" is to mention some environmental regulation. Non-sequitur. It is about money. On both sides. And you know it.
2/8/07 2:40 PM
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Up With Evil
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"So, your response to his saying "it's all about money" is to mention some environmental regulation. Non-sequitur." Actually, that was my response to you comical hand-waving about the "looming ozone crisis in 1992" when action had already been taken years earlier to avert it. Furthermore, you've offered not even a shred of evidence that Dr. Shapiro is a global warming denialist like the industry clowns marine1 favors. If you'd like to debate the role of CFCs in ozone depletion you should start a new thread rather than try to hijack this one.
2/8/07 2:48 PM
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Up With Evil
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"Jellyman, you and I had a massive marijuana debate" Marijuana-fueled debate, more likely. Nah, I'm just being a jerk, I never even saw the thread in question. Smoking anything isn't healthy though.
2/8/07 2:54 PM
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Up With Evil
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"Million dollar question that will never be answered by the brilliant and above average "up with evil"." Can't you Google up a proper answer? See if Timothy Ball has ever opined on the issue. Who are these "UN Scientists"? Are they actually an international group of scientists affiliated with Universities and institutions worldwide who are lending their expertise to a multidisciplinary panel but whose actual employment is with said Universities and institutions in their respective home nations?
2/8/07 3:04 PM
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Dratherbe
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Edited: 08-Feb-07
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"Furthermore, you've offered not even a shred of evidence that Dr. Shapiro is a global warming denialist like the industry clowns marine1 favors."

Who said he was a denialist?  Let me requote again what he said: "When you say the ozone threat is a scam, you're not only attacking people's scientific integrity, you're going after their pocketbook as well. It's money, purely money."

Hope that helps with your reading comprehension issue.

"Actually, that was my response to you comical hand-waving about the "looming ozone crisis in 1992" when action had already been taken years earlier to avert it."

My comical handwaving?  Perhaps you meant to say "Your establishment of a precedence for pre-Man-causes-global-warming, money-grubbing, & profitable 'scientific' environmental hysteria."

So the Canadian legislators averted the ozone depletion problem, eh?  Well let's thank those Canadian politicians for saving the world from imminent global meltdown that they predicted would be coming and perhaps they would do us the favor of saving us from this global doomsday scenario as well.  They are, after all, the 51st state.  It's the least they could do.

2/8/07 4:48 PM
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jellyman
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Edited: 08-Feb-07 08:10 PM
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marines1 I have never said marijuana was harmless. I have said it's less harmful than cigarettes, and this is true. Nicotine is far more addictive and people who smoke cigarettes tend to smoke a lot more, and more often. I don't advocate smoking, I see vaporization and eating as less harmful alternatives, based on a couple actual studies, I first came across in Economist Magazine, and generally outlined here: http://www.maps.org/mmj/pr5.02.03.html It was not until last year some other forum members dug up a story run in an Australian mainstream newspaper, http://www.smh.com.au/news/world/marijuana-links-to-cancer-going-up-in-smoke/2005/10/28/1130400366837.html and also alluded to on this website dedicated to health science news http://www.webmd.com/content/article/23/1728_57309 that I even entertained the notion that MJ smoke might not be that big a cancer risk in and of itself Notice these web sites are not dedicated to marijuana. Notice the clear outline of the experiment. Notice the last one also mentions dangers of smoking, like risk of heart attack.
2/9/07 6:51 PM
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jellyman
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Edited: 09-Feb-07
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12/9/07 10:45 PM
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kylethasnizake
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Edited: 09-Dec-07
Member Since: 01/07/2004
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the sun is getting brighter and the rest of the solar system is experiancing the same warming trend we are! that is a fact! hummers are not making the martian ice caps retreat!

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