Member Since: 11/11/11
The Bear stare is a well documented undertaker hater. Always trying to belittle him in some passive aggressive way, like saying he is a great employee blah blah blah
Don't fool yourself because you don't like the character. He is the top 10 all time for most people, even top 5/mount Rushmore for a lot of people. He is the greatest big man (near 7 footer) of all time. He could work with the best of them.
In an era where we have tons of guys with convoluted titled reigns, 7, 8, 9, 10 plus titles.. he didn't have that many. I remember when Bret hart won the belt for the 5th time and that was a huge deal. Ric flairs reigns always seemed like such a huge deal. Taker always was willing to put people over. Even in his prime. He earned his once a year wrestlemania appearance.
Taker would often take guys that are new or hot and rising, or just different and let them appear strong and even go over him
Like the great Khali, Mr. Kennedy, Muhammed hassan, Kane, edge and Orton when they were barely entering the main event scene, brock lesnat when he was barely the next big thing.
Taker has some bad matches. But he has some of the greatest matches in wrestlemania history
I dont think thats a very fair statement about me. I will readily admit im not a huge taker fan. However i dont think im a hater in the slightest when it comes to taker. I like to think I'm pretty fair. I actually agree with most of the points you made.
However, I think alot of the statements you made sort of proved my point about him. In general and even in this thread the most common adjectives i hear people use about him are level headed, consistent, and solid. I'm not a baseball guy but perhaps a fair comparison would be to say is that taker is a cal ripkin of sorts of the wwf and North american wrestling scene. I dont know cal ripkins full credentials other than having the most game appearances streak and that he is well liked and respected.
In a business full of egos, selfishness, drama, and eccentric personality types, undertaker was a godsend. Thats a huge achievement to go 30 plus years and to be reliable and over.
However lets be fair. Undertaker was not a wrestler like everyone else. He was booked as an attraction for most of his career. You said it yourself he wasnt known for his title runs. That also means he wasnt "the guy" for almost his entire run. There have been plenty of mount Rushmore threads on this forum and also to be real with you barely anyone cited undertaker. If its wwf specific mount rushmore than yeah for sure he belongs but otherwise undertaker drops a tier or two.
Again 99.99 percent of wrestlers are never the guy or the ace. I dont mean that as a knock on taker. People treat undertaker like he was some Michael Jordan when all i am trying to say is no he wasn't. He is an all time great, but in a way thats different from other all time greats. When I make the "great employee" comment I'm not trying to make a back handed complement. I think it exemplifies more honestly what he was bringing to the table.
The longer ive been a fan of the business the more ive come to realize the business isnt all just about star power and drawing. In so many ways angles and card placement ultimately just comes down to how fucking reliable someone is.
Also I readily admit I didnt watch much wwf in the 2000s so ive missed quite a few wrestlemanias. However i do readily oppose this notion that taker got over a shitload of talent. Most of the jobbing he did over his career was purely to extend feuds and to extend his own relevancy. Since afterall he was a freaking attraction with a super natural gimmick that could could realistically be paired up with very few opponents. Foley was the first major guy off the top of my head i recall taker putting over. Once again I think thats one major area that taker gets too much credit as being someone who did the favors to get other guys over. Also to be clear (much like hogan) i dont think undertaker should have been jobbing alot either cause after all he was an attrattraction.i dont hold it against him but I'm not going to praise him as some elevation machine. Foley, Michaels, bret, etc. Etc. All elevated way more talent.