David Jacobs' BJJGround 25 year old student sexing 16 year old student

7/3/19 10:07 AM
7/26/12
Posts: 2975

I’m pissed off. I have decided to leave the gym I have been at for 9 years. It has come out that a 25 year old student was having a sexual relationship with a 16 year old student. This was a consensual thing and not illegal in my state because the age of consent is 16. The older   student told the younger that they had to keep it a secret.  The gym owner/black belt instructor  has no problem with this and the older student is still training and teaching classes. I told him I disagreed with his decision and that I can’t train with them anymore. He told me that I am judge mental and my moral standards are too high. He also said what two students do off the mats is not his problem. I am blown away with this situation and really pissed off. I loved this school and loved training with all my friends and now I’m out. I’m really just venting but also was wondering am I way off thinking this is wrong? There is a better than average chance that most of the parties involved will read this so I would love for this community to weigh in on and be honest. What would you other gym owners do? 

Should I let my teammates know why I’m not training anymore? 

9 fucking years and now I’m here. I’m pissed off.

7/3/19 10:25 AM
1/1/01
Posts: 47529

If you feel you should leave, then you should leave. I wouldn't bother telling teammates unless they specifically ask you.

7/3/19 11:01 AM
2/14/19
Posts: 198
The fact that the 25 year old is teaching is what concerns me. Two students having a consensual legal relationship is not concerning to me but an teacher using the student base as their dating pool should be of concern to the owner and other students.
7/3/19 11:02 AM
4/26/13
Posts: 4200

The fact that he told the 16 year old to keep it a secret tells you everything you need to know.  You made the right decision in leaving and if I were you I'd tell my teammates why.  If it's already out there anyway it's not like you're adding drama to the gym, and they should all understand.  

7/3/19 11:11 AM
7/25/13
Posts: 10391

I agree with the previous advice given. Hopefully you land somewhere else that you feel comfortable training. 

Edited: 7/3/19 12:24 PM
11/25/09
Posts: 4467
Bot - The fact that the 25 year old is teaching is what concerns me. Two students having a consensual legal relationship is not concerning to me but an teacher using the student base as their dating pool should be of concern to the owner and other students.

It’s not really 2 students.

 

One is an instructor and thus an authority figure in the gym, and is using that position to take the lowest hanging fruit possible by not only going after a female student, but a minor. 

 

Regardless of the laws of the age of consent, that is deeply distrurbing.

 

I would not train or teach at a school or under a head coach who condones that. 

As someone who runs a gym full time for a living, I think I have a personal responsibility to my students to live up to a higher standard. In fact it is policy within our gym that Coaches (who get paid $ to teach bjj) are  not allowed to date paying students.

7/3/19 2:14 PM
1/9/18
Posts: 86

I’m guessing there were some red flags before this issue. Finding the right gym these days is rare. There are sooo many douchebags in bjj these days.

7/3/19 2:42 PM
7/12/14
Posts: 1050

The fact that it is a trainer who is dating a student would send some bad vibes out there but to each their own. If it is the guy's first gf, you can hardly fault him. There is too little left out of the story. 

7/3/19 2:45 PM
3/15/15
Posts: 11852
I don't think it is ethically the best, but they are only 9 years apart. Who cares? It's a little stretching but nothing to leave the gym over.
My best friend was 22 and dated his high school sweetheart he met when he was in Grade 13 and she was Grade 9. They have been married for almost 25 years now and have three children.
7/3/19 3:46 PM
5/8/13
Posts: 12311
Easters -

The fact that he told the 16 year old to keep it a secret tells you everything you need to know.  You made the right decision in leaving and if I were you I'd tell my teammates why.  If it's already out there anyway it's not like you're adding drama to the gym, and they should all understand.  

This! If it’s not a big deal, why tell her to hush?!  It’s creepy and he’s using his teaching position to sleep with a child! If no big deal, you should just post it all over Facebook n make flyers advertising your old school is so great the adult teachers bang 16 year old students. Anyone who thinks he wasn’t “talking” to her before she was 16 is an idiot. This has me pissed, I’d leave too 

7/3/19 3:50 PM
5/8/13
Posts: 12312

25 year old is a loser. He finally feels important at your school and uses it to sleep with a child. He likely can’t get girls his age, unless he just loves to great conversations about life he has with a CHILD....   holy shit if that was my daughter there would be hell to pay (plus it’s illegal here)....  gotta be a school with some integrity you train at op... fuck that place and anyone who is ok with that. Just sickens me...

7/3/19 4:35 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 8537
I'm the White Dog - 

Age of consent in your state is 16 so that's that.

If you know the instructor to be a bad apple who preys on young girls, you leave that gym in a heartbeat if the owner is aware and okay with that crap.

If this 25 year old is a solid guy and just happened to hit it off with a younger girl who he can legally date in his state you are the one with the problem for being upset over this.

When I was in my mid to late 20's (25-28) I was a personal trainer at a gym in a state where 16 was the age of consent. The 16-18 high school girl crowd was constantly coming on to the trainers at my gym and so I saw both sides of this. The girls are down and legal, so check your jealously at the door. The question is whether the older guys are causing problems for the company. It was rarely a problem because when given the choice between a college age girl who can stay the night/you can stay the night with and a girl who has to go home to mommy and daddy by 10pm and can't have boys sleeping in her room with her, you choose the girl that comes with fewer burdens. But that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with dating a girl who is legal.

If the girl is legal then it really is case specific and all you've told of this story is that you're bothered by it so there's really no way to answer your question.

By the tone of your post you seem overly invested in white knighting for this 16 year old who is willing and able to consent to sex with an older guy. If it bothers you leave, but you might be giving up on your gym of 9 years because of an issue you have, not the other parties. If you've been there 9 years and loved it you would have seen other scummy behavior that would have soured you toward the gym by now.

Might want to assess your reaction and see if that isn't the real problem.


GROSS GROSS GROSS GROSS...

I'm sorry but a person in their mid twenties should NOT be trying to hook up with teenagers.

What the f*ck is wrong with you that you would have to date someone so young!? That's the question you should be asking!

1chaino,

Your reaction and actions are just and right!
7/3/19 5:33 PM
5/7/08
Posts: 21792

Is she hot?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Pics?

7/3/19 5:45 PM
11/25/09
Posts: 4468
I'm the White Dog -
BTTMike -
Bot - The fact that the 25 year old is teaching is what concerns me. Two students having a consensual legal relationship is not concerning to me but an teacher using the student base as their dating pool should be of concern to the owner and other students.

It’s not really 2 students.

 

One is an instructor and thus an authority figure in the gym, and is using that position to take the lowest hanging fruit possible by not only going after a female student, but a minor. 

 

Regardless of the laws of the age of consent, that is deeply distrurbing.

 

I would not train or teach at a school or under a head coach who condones that. 

As someone who runs a gym full time for a living, I think I have a personal responsibility to my students to live up to a higher standard. In fact it is policy within our gym that Coaches (who get paid $ to teach bjj) are  not allowed to date paying students.

As an owner that would be my policy. Not because I want to save all those precious little angels who are coming on to my instructors, but because I don't want to deal with their parents when they find out.

As a student it's none of my business unless I see a pattern of behavior I don't want to associate with.

And by definition with 16 being the age of consent you are not dealing with a minor but by saying she is a minor in a context where she is not you are being dramatic.

Wtf are you talking about? 16 is a minor regardless of age of consent laws where you.

 

Super creepy vibes, go relive your glory years of banging teenagers at a gym. 

 

 

7/3/19 6:02 PM
2/9/09
Posts: 9057

Eh my buddy dated a 16 year old when he was 22 or 23? 14 years later they’re married with kids. 

 

So lets say my buddy is the guy teaching at your school....but lets say he’s teaching now at 37 and you meet his 30 year old wife...would you freak out and leave? 

 

Look at Pat Barry and Rose, he was dating her when she was like 15 or 16....

 

Im not saying its cool or right, but if 16 is the legal age its no different if she was 18 or 28. 

7/3/19 6:15 PM
7/25/13
Posts: 10392

The key point here is that there is a significant age difference for that point in the girl’s life and the guy was also her instructor. Both within the general teaching ranks and the martial arts world there is a moral code that frowns upon this situation. School owners and instructors should be held to a higher standard.  If one’s personal sensibilities don’t align with these beliefs, then I wouldn’t want you as my instructor, teammate, or my teaching my kid. If you don’t care about such things, then that’s your choice. I respect OP for living his life by a code. Respect.

7/3/19 6:31 PM
4/2/10
Posts: 6707

Fails the half your age plus seven rule. 

7/3/19 7:07 PM
11/25/09
Posts: 4469
I'm the White Dog -
BTTMike -
I'm the White Dog -
BTTMike -
Bot - The fact that the 25 year old is teaching is what concerns me. Two students having a consensual legal relationship is not concerning to me but an teacher using the student base as their dating pool should be of concern to the owner and other students.

It’s not really 2 students.

 

One is an instructor and thus an authority figure in the gym, and is using that position to take the lowest hanging fruit possible by not only going after a female student, but a minor. 

 

Regardless of the laws of the age of consent, that is deeply distrurbing.

 

I would not train or teach at a school or under a head coach who condones that. 

As someone who runs a gym full time for a living, I think I have a personal responsibility to my students to live up to a higher standard. In fact it is policy within our gym that Coaches (who get paid $ to teach bjj) are  not allowed to date paying students.

As an owner that would be my policy. Not because I want to save all those precious little angels who are coming on to my instructors, but because I don't want to deal with their parents when they find out.

As a student it's none of my business unless I see a pattern of behavior I don't want to associate with.

And by definition with 16 being the age of consent you are not dealing with a minor but by saying she is a minor in a context where she is not you are being dramatic.

Wtf are you talking about? 16 is a minor regardless of age of consent laws where you.

 

Super creepy vibes, go relive your glory years of banging teenagers at a gym. 

 

 

You don't know what laws are you do?

She is a minor if she wants to buy alcohol, yes. Not a minor in said state if she wants to have sex, so in this context not a minor. Not a difficult concept to understand.

And for fuck sake you're gay. Don't tell me you never fucked a gay teenage boy when you were in your 20's or vice versa. Had lots of gay friends and not a single one of them hadn't had that experience with an older man so stfu.

Okay internet fingers. 16 year olds are not legal adults, regardless of age of consent to sexual intercourse. Not gonna argue any further than that cause you are clearly a complete piece of trash and a little bitch. 

 

7/3/19 7:27 PM
11/25/09
Posts: 4470

Lol I’m the troll? Keep hiding behind the keyboard. Have a good one, Nerd. 

7/3/19 7:41 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 10770

hmm, i couldn't really see btt being frutopia embracing after the condo reaction. learn something new everyday

7/3/19 8:49 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 19401
Principal Andy -

The key point here is that there is a significant age difference for that point in the girl’s life and the guy was also her instructor. Both within the general teaching ranks and the martial arts world there is a moral code that frowns upon this situation. School owners and instructors should be held to a higher standard.  If one’s personal sensibilities don’t align with these beliefs, then I wouldn’t want you as my instructor, teammate, or my teaching my kid. If you don’t care about such things, then that’s your choice. I respect OP for living his life by a code. Respect.

This.

 

 

7/3/19 9:25 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 10774

wow! i've been involved in the martial arts going on 50 years and haven't really observed that code in action. pretty much the opposite. the martial arts in general are populated by some pretty far out cats who maybe aren't "your kind of guys", maybe they weren't part of the "incrowd", or had the best "personal hygeine"

7/4/19 2:25 AM
8/28/10
Posts: 12200
I'm the White Dog -

Age of consent in your state is 16 so that's that.

If you know the instructor to be a bad apple who preys on young girls, you leave that gym in a heartbeat if the owner is aware and okay with that crap.

If this 25 year old is a solid guy and just happened to hit it off with a younger girl who he can legally date in his state you are the one with the problem for being upset over this.

When I was in my mid to late 20's (25-28) I was a personal trainer at a gym in a state where 16 was the age of consent. The 16-18 high school girl crowd was constantly coming on to the trainers at my gym and so I saw both sides of this. The girls are down and legal, so check your jealously at the door. The question is whether the older guys are causing problems for the company. It was rarely a problem because when given the choice between a college age girl who can stay the night/you can stay the night with and a girl who has to go home to mommy and daddy by 10pm and can't have boys sleeping in her room with her, you choose the girl that comes with fewer burdens. But that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with dating a girl who is legal.

If the girl is legal then it really is case specific and all you've told of this story is that you're bothered by it so there's really no way to answer your question.

By the tone of your post you seem overly invested in white knighting for this 16 year old who is willing and able to consent to sex with an older guy. If it bothers you leave, but you might be giving up on your gym of 9 years because of an issue you have, not the other parties. If you've been there 9 years and loved it you would have seen other scummy behavior that would have soured you toward the gym by now.

Might want to assess your reaction and see if that isn't the real problem.

It's legal in parts of Mexico to sleep with 12 year old girls. It may be legal but that shit isn't right.

 

16 is way too young for a dude who's closer to 30 than 20. 

My youngest daughter is 16 and I have friends who are 25. Big difference in everything from interests to maturity and I will break arms and legs and fingers and toes if I found out one was creeping with her, regardless of the law.

I told you recently on the phone about the time the girl lied to me about her age and the shit it almost caused. I avoided young girls like the plague in my later teens and early 20s and for good reason.

7/4/19 9:26 AM
6/30/07
Posts: 55081
I'm the White Dog -
m.g -
I'm the White Dog - 

Age of consent in your state is 16 so that's that.

If you know the instructor to be a bad apple who preys on young girls, you leave that gym in a heartbeat if the owner is aware and okay with that crap.

If this 25 year old is a solid guy and just happened to hit it off with a younger girl who he can legally date in his state you are the one with the problem for being upset over this.

When I was in my mid to late 20's (25-28) I was a personal trainer at a gym in a state where 16 was the age of consent. The 16-18 high school girl crowd was constantly coming on to the trainers at my gym and so I saw both sides of this. The girls are down and legal, so check your jealously at the door. The question is whether the older guys are causing problems for the company. It was rarely a problem because when given the choice between a college age girl who can stay the night/you can stay the night with and a girl who has to go home to mommy and daddy by 10pm and can't have boys sleeping in her room with her, you choose the girl that comes with fewer burdens. But that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with dating a girl who is legal.

If the girl is legal then it really is case specific and all you've told of this story is that you're bothered by it so there's really no way to answer your question.

By the tone of your post you seem overly invested in white knighting for this 16 year old who is willing and able to consent to sex with an older guy. If it bothers you leave, but you might be giving up on your gym of 9 years because of an issue you have, not the other parties. If you've been there 9 years and loved it you would have seen other scummy behavior that would have soured you toward the gym by now.

Might want to assess your reaction and see if that isn't the real problem.


GROSS GROSS GROSS GROSS...

I'm sorry but a person in their mid twenties should NOT be trying to hook up with teenagers.

What the f*ck is wrong with you that you would have to date someone so young!? That's the question you should be asking!

1chaino,

Your reaction and actions are just and right!

When both parties are legal and consensting I don't get my undies in a bunch... like you just did.

9 years is a massive gap Gap at that age, it's not the same as even 26 & 35.

 

"Regardless of the laws of the age of consent, that is deeply distrurbing"

 

There is something fundamentally unhealthy about it.

7/4/19 12:11 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 1903
I'm the Black Dog -
I'm the White Dog -
m.g -
I'm the White Dog - 

Age of consent in your state is 16 so that's that.

If you know the instructor to be a bad apple who preys on young girls, you leave that gym in a heartbeat if the owner is aware and okay with that crap.

If this 25 year old is a solid guy and just happened to hit it off with a younger girl who he can legally date in his state you are the one with the problem for being upset over this.

When I was in my mid to late 20's (25-28) I was a personal trainer at a gym in a state where 16 was the age of consent. The 16-18 high school girl crowd was constantly coming on to the trainers at my gym and so I saw both sides of this. The girls are down and legal, so check your jealously at the door. The question is whether the older guys are causing problems for the company. It was rarely a problem because when given the choice between a college age girl who can stay the night/you can stay the night with and a girl who has to go home to mommy and daddy by 10pm and can't have boys sleeping in her room with her, you choose the girl that comes with fewer burdens. But that doesn't mean there is anything wrong with dating a girl who is legal.

If the girl is legal then it really is case specific and all you've told of this story is that you're bothered by it so there's really no way to answer your question.

By the tone of your post you seem overly invested in white knighting for this 16 year old who is willing and able to consent to sex with an older guy. If it bothers you leave, but you might be giving up on your gym of 9 years because of an issue you have, not the other parties. If you've been there 9 years and loved it you would have seen other scummy behavior that would have soured you toward the gym by now.

Might want to assess your reaction and see if that isn't the real problem.


GROSS GROSS GROSS GROSS...

I'm sorry but a person in their mid twenties should NOT be trying to hook up with teenagers.

What the f*ck is wrong with you that you would have to date someone so young!? That's the question you should be asking!

1chaino,

Your reaction and actions are just and right!

When both parties are legal and consensting I don't get my undies in a bunch... like you just did.

9 years is a massive gap Gap at that age, it's not the same as even 26 & 35.

 

"Regardless of the laws of the age of consent, that is deeply distrurbing"

 

There is something fundamentally unhealthy about it.

You are a minor until you reach the age of majority.  In this country, that age is 18. What’s right and what is legal are two different things in this case. 9 years is a long time to be invested in a school. You may disagree with the OP but he is a man of principle