David Jacobs' BJJGround Does anyone feel sport bjj....

Edited: 7/21/19 11:25 AM
12/21/04
Posts: 1971
One problem with self-defense arguments, particularly in the Martial Arts world is that people assume you are going to be defending yourself against someone who is trying to fight you. In reality, that scenario probably only covers a small percentage of self-defense situations, at least in adulthood. The unexpected robber on the street probably doesn't want to fight you. The thief who breaks into your house probably isn't looking for a fight either. And if El Chapo wants you dead he sure as heck isn't sending someone to start a fight with you.
7/21/19 12:19 PM
7/30/03
Posts: 7222
Aaron Lapointe - One problem with self-defense arguments, particularly in the Martial Arts world is that people assume you are going to be defending yourself against someone who is trying to fight you. In reality, that scenario probably only covers a small percentage of self-defense situations, at least in adulthood. The unexpected robber on the street probably doesn't want to fight you. The thief who breaks into your house probably isn't looking for a fight either. And if El Chapo wants you dead he sure as heck isn't sending someone to start a fight with you.

That’s obvious but the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife so he is testing you physically and verbally doesn’t really want to fight you either but if you are not confident in yourself defense then chances are you won’t respond properly.

7/21/19 12:37 PM
12/21/04
Posts: 1972
Calhoon -
Aaron Lapointe - One problem with self-defense arguments, particularly in the Martial Arts world is that people assume you are going to be defending yourself against someone who is trying to fight you. In reality, that scenario probably only covers a small percentage of self-defense situations, at least in adulthood. The unexpected robber on the street probably doesn't want to fight you. The thief who breaks into your house probably isn't looking for a fight either. And if El Chapo wants you dead he sure as heck isn't sending someone to start a fight with you.

That’s obvious but the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife so he is testing you physically and verbally doesn’t really want to fight you either but if you are not confident in yourself defense then chances are you won’t respond properly.

Then the question should be "What is the best self-defense to use against the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife and is testing you physically and verbally." 

7/21/19 12:39 PM
7/30/03
Posts: 7223
Aaron Lapointe -
Calhoon -
Aaron Lapointe - One problem with self-defense arguments, particularly in the Martial Arts world is that people assume you are going to be defending yourself against someone who is trying to fight you. In reality, that scenario probably only covers a small percentage of self-defense situations, at least in adulthood. The unexpected robber on the street probably doesn't want to fight you. The thief who breaks into your house probably isn't looking for a fight either. And if El Chapo wants you dead he sure as heck isn't sending someone to start a fight with you.

That’s obvious but the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife so he is testing you physically and verbally doesn’t really want to fight you either but if you are not confident in yourself defense then chances are you won’t respond properly.

Then the question should be "What is the best self-defense to use against the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife and is testing you physically and verbally." 

Conceal and carry, duh!

7/21/19 12:55 PM
12/21/04
Posts: 1973
Calhoon -
Aaron Lapointe -
Calhoon -
Aaron Lapointe - One problem with self-defense arguments, particularly in the Martial Arts world is that people assume you are going to be defending yourself against someone who is trying to fight you. In reality, that scenario probably only covers a small percentage of self-defense situations, at least in adulthood. The unexpected robber on the street probably doesn't want to fight you. The thief who breaks into your house probably isn't looking for a fight either. And if El Chapo wants you dead he sure as heck isn't sending someone to start a fight with you.

That’s obvious but the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife so he is testing you physically and verbally doesn’t really want to fight you either but if you are not confident in yourself defense then chances are you won’t respond properly.

Then the question should be "What is the best self-defense to use against the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife and is testing you physically and verbally." 

Conceal and carry, duh!

I won't argue with you there. Lol. 

7/21/19 1:03 PM
7/30/03
Posts: 7224
Aaron Lapointe -
Calhoon -
Aaron Lapointe -
Calhoon -
Aaron Lapointe - One problem with self-defense arguments, particularly in the Martial Arts world is that people assume you are going to be defending yourself against someone who is trying to fight you. In reality, that scenario probably only covers a small percentage of self-defense situations, at least in adulthood. The unexpected robber on the street probably doesn't want to fight you. The thief who breaks into your house probably isn't looking for a fight either. And if El Chapo wants you dead he sure as heck isn't sending someone to start a fight with you.

That’s obvious but the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife so he is testing you physically and verbally doesn’t really want to fight you either but if you are not confident in yourself defense then chances are you won’t respond properly.

Then the question should be "What is the best self-defense to use against the drunk asshole at the party who wants to bang your wife and is testing you physically and verbally." 

Conceal and carry, duh!

I won't argue with you there. Lol. 

I was being sarcastic. I don’t condone pulling a gun on a drunk at a party.

7/21/19 1:43 PM
2/28/03
Posts: 47627

Most self defense situations are honor contests to establish a hierarchy on the social ladder.  these are what you guys are referring to here.  You can walk away from almost all of these. 

Bjj is good for these, but only if you know how to recognize them and become the aggressor first.  Many people wait to be the victim in these (get hit first) and then start fighting back.   If you are in an honor contest, strike first and you should be okay 

 

as said above, real self defense is usually a weapons situation or multiple attackers.  They often ambush and don’t give you too many clues ahead of time.  Not too much is good for these with empty hands 

7/21/19 2:33 PM
5/17/13
Posts: 12547
checkuroil -

Most self defense situations are honor contests to establish a hierarchy on the social ladder.  these are what you guys are referring to here.  You can walk away from almost all of these. 

Bjj is good for these, but only if you know how to recognize them and become the aggressor first.  Many people wait to be the victim in these (get hit first) and then start fighting back.   If you are in an honor contest, strike first and you should be okay 

 

as said above, real self defense is usually a weapons situation or multiple attackers.  They often ambush and don’t give you too many clues ahead of time.  Not too much is good for these with empty hands 

I disagree with you on the walk away thing. I feel like in certain situations you may have no choice. Issue is in today's society if you strike first it opens you up to law suites etc.

 

clearly there are tons of different ways things can go down and its impossible to put everything into two categories. 

 

 

7/21/19 3:21 PM
2/2/08
Posts: 12076
Brian McLaughlin - 

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves


How did he get put to sleep
7/21/19 3:22 PM
2/2/08
Posts: 12077
Bot - 

I like how the first and two most important skills needed to use BJJ in a fight are rarely taught in BJJ class.

1) Close the distance vs strikes without getting knocked out.

2) Takedowns


7/21/19 3:40 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 4382
forumnewb -
Brian McLaughlin - 

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves


How did he get put to sleep

Right hand to the dome

7/21/19 6:36 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 13633
checkuroil -

Most self defense situations are honor contests to establish a hierarchy on the social ladder.  these are what you guys are referring to here.  You can walk away from almost all of these. 

Bjj is good for these, but only if you know how to recognize them and become the aggressor first.  Many people wait to be the victim in these (get hit first) and then start fighting back.   If you are in an honor contest, strike first and you should be okay 

 

as said above, real self defense is usually a weapons situation or multiple attackers.  They often ambush and don’t give you too many clues ahead of time.  Not too much is good for these with empty hands 

--"as said above, real self defense is usually a weapons situation or multiple attackers.  They often ambush and don’t give you too many clues ahead of time.  Not too much is good for these with empty hands"

 

A baseline skillset is empty hands. Even if you have weapons avaklable to you, to get to your weapon you sometimes need to fight to clear your weapon. In some cases, you cant get to your weapon because you have to deal with the attack or attacker's weapon(impact or edged) with your physical skills, because transitioning to a weapon makes you vulnerable. And many violentencounters are done with empty hands or defended with empty hands. Training should address using such as effectively as possiblee IF jiujitsu is marketed as a martial art and defensively.....otherwise its disbonest and shit.

 

 

 

7/21/19 6:54 PM
4/2/13
Posts: 6267

Been training a variety of martial arts for years.  In the 21st century though, my focus has drastically shifted to being very proficient in Glock Kwon do and M4 Maga.  Plan on also brushing up with Sarge on edged weapons, gotta get my stab and slash game on point.

7/21/19 6:57 PM
4/2/13
Posts: 6268
Sgt. Slaphead -
checkuroil -

Most self defense situations are honor contests to establish a hierarchy on the social ladder.  these are what you guys are referring to here.  You can walk away from almost all of these. 

Bjj is good for these, but only if you know how to recognize them and become the aggressor first.  Many people wait to be the victim in these (get hit first) and then start fighting back.   If you are in an honor contest, strike first and you should be okay 

 

as said above, real self defense is usually a weapons situation or multiple attackers.  They often ambush and don’t give you too many clues ahead of time.  Not too much is good for these with empty hands 

--"as said above, real self defense is usually a weapons situation or multiple attackers.  They often ambush and don’t give you too many clues ahead of time.  Not too much is good for these with empty hands"

 

A baseline skillset is empty hands. Even if you have weapons avaklable to you, to get to your weapon you sometimes need to fight to clear your weapon. In some cases, you cant get to your weapon because you have to deal with the attack or attacker's weapon(impact or edged) with your physical skills, because transitioning to a weapon makes you vulnerable. And many violentencounters are done with empty hands or defended with empty hands. Training should address using such as effectively as possiblee IF jiujitsu is marketed as a martial art and defensively.....otherwise its disbonest and shit.

 

 

 

Got to get with you later.  Been tasked with teaching some force in force stuff with simunitions and edged weapons.  All focused on creating space and getting to your weapon.

7/21/19 7:17 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 13634

UGH....sounds painful :(

7/21/19 10:19 PM
7/31/09
Posts: 5209
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

7/21/19 10:57 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 13636
robbie380 -
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

But according to many here on forum....peole will do opposite and basically adjust on 5he fly!

 

ZHOOOZHISU....BES SPORD INNA WIRL!

 

 

7/21/19 11:22 PM
2/15/14
Posts: 653
robbie380 -
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

that is a result of stupid individual decision making

 

I have a friend who is a cop and former heavyweight pro-boxer. He was a murderous KO puncher during his career. He was making an arrest alone in a bad neighborhood that had a gang of hoodlums around him. As he was cuffing the guy, another challenged him to a fistfight and if they won, my friend would have to let the homeboy off the cuffs and walk free. My friend agreed, fought the other guy one on one. 2 of the frist 3 punches thrown by my friend KO'd the challenger stiff and another guy jumped in and was also immediately KO'd by the next punch thrown. However, 5 more guys jumped on my friend and mobbed him and nearly beat him to death. My friend was hospitalized and unable to work for the next couple months. Should he have changed his training to dealt with this? No, he just made a a mistake in decision making.  I've seen many guard playing officers successfully restrain and take down assailants without pulling guard.

 

Both your black belt cop and my friend are both just f**king idiots at the moment when they were under tremendous pressure

7/22/19 12:51 AM
11/11/11
Posts: 23111
mideastgrappler -
robbie380 -
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

that is a result of stupid individual decision making

 

I have a friend who is a cop and former heavyweight pro-boxer. He was a murderous KO puncher during his career. He was making an arrest alone in a bad neighborhood that had a gang of hoodlums around him. As he was cuffing the guy, another challenged him to a fistfight and if they won, my friend would have to let the homeboy off the cuffs and walk free. My friend agreed, fought the other guy one on one. 2 of the frist 3 punches thrown by my friend KO'd the challenger stiff and another guy jumped in and was also immediately KO'd by the next punch thrown. However, 5 more guys jumped on my friend and mobbed him and nearly beat him to death. My friend was hospitalized and unable to work for the next couple months. Should he have changed his training to dealt with this? No, he just made a a mistake in decision making.  I've seen many guard playing officers successfully restrain and take down assailants without pulling guard.

 

Both your black belt cop and my friend are both just f**king idiots at the moment when they were under tremendous pressure

I think both stories are nonetheless still a testament to resorting to training habits when in crisis situations. Odds are there if these two guys did it that there are plenty more where that come from. Its been said for but bjj and other self defense training really needs to encompass other techniques besides the expected physical bs. Crisis descalation, the crisis cycle(that recent Disney fight is a perfect example), verbal negotietc.reading a situation, etc. really should all go hand in hand with a black belt.

7/22/19 1:41 PM
5/17/13
Posts: 12557
mideastgrappler -
robbie380 -
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

that is a result of stupid individual decision making

 

I have a friend who is a cop and former heavyweight pro-boxer. He was a murderous KO puncher during his career. He was making an arrest alone in a bad neighborhood that had a gang of hoodlums around him. As he was cuffing the guy, another challenged him to a fistfight and if they won, my friend would have to let the homeboy off the cuffs and walk free. My friend agreed, fought the other guy one on one. 2 of the frist 3 punches thrown by my friend KO'd the challenger stiff and another guy jumped in and was also immediately KO'd by the next punch thrown. However, 5 more guys jumped on my friend and mobbed him and nearly beat him to death. My friend was hospitalized and unable to work for the next couple months. Should he have changed his training to dealt with this? No, he just made a a mistake in decision making.  I've seen many guard playing officers successfully restrain and take down assailants without pulling guard.

 

Both your black belt cop and my friend are both just f**king idiots at the moment when they were under tremendous pressure

This is slightly different, apples to oranges. You’re talking a 1v1 and someone being jumped. 

7/22/19 2:11 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 8560
It is clear to me that most people on this thread don't live in the harsh, tough, and unforgiving urban environments in the USA. We live in a VIOLENT world and those of us who live in those tough urban environments know this all to well.

First off, there is no such thing as a "fair" fight in the "real" world. Even if you win a fight in the streets in the so called real world, there is always the revenge factor: the person coming back and taking his revenge on you (and it doesn't have to be immediately). Furthermore so called street fights in the so called real world are not like arranged, ruled bound, matches of MMA, Boxing, Bjj etc. Indeed, I wouldn't even call them fight at least not as we think of fights.


Secondly self-defense doesn't always mean "fighting" and it certainly doesn't mean winning. Self-defense is essentially all about self-preservation. It is all about surviving and escaping. There is more to self-defense than trying to knockout or chokeout some fool on the street.
7/22/19 2:20 PM
2/15/14
Posts: 656
GaspareBJJ -
mideastgrappler -
robbie380 -
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

that is a result of stupid individual decision making

 

I have a friend who is a cop and former heavyweight pro-boxer. He was a murderous KO puncher during his career. He was making an arrest alone in a bad neighborhood that had a gang of hoodlums around him. As he was cuffing the guy, another challenged him to a fistfight and if they won, my friend would have to let the homeboy off the cuffs and walk free. My friend agreed, fought the other guy one on one. 2 of the frist 3 punches thrown by my friend KO'd the challenger stiff and another guy jumped in and was also immediately KO'd by the next punch thrown. However, 5 more guys jumped on my friend and mobbed him and nearly beat him to death. My friend was hospitalized and unable to work for the next couple months. Should he have changed his training to dealt with this? No, he just made a a mistake in decision making.  I've seen many guard playing officers successfully restrain and take down assailants without pulling guard.

 

Both your black belt cop and my friend are both just f**king idiots at the moment when they were under tremendous pressure

This is slightly different, apples to oranges. You’re talking a 1v1 and someone being jumped. 

yes, slightly different but th root of it all was the same-stupid decision making.

 

Did Ryan Hall choose to Imanari Roll his way into restraining that guy he choked in the burger place? No, he RNC's the guy even though he has probably drilled Imanari Roll a few thousand times by now

7/22/19 3:21 PM
5/17/13
Posts: 12558
mideastgrappler -
GaspareBJJ -
mideastgrappler -
robbie380 -
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

that is a result of stupid individual decision making

 

I have a friend who is a cop and former heavyweight pro-boxer. He was a murderous KO puncher during his career. He was making an arrest alone in a bad neighborhood that had a gang of hoodlums around him. As he was cuffing the guy, another challenged him to a fistfight and if they won, my friend would have to let the homeboy off the cuffs and walk free. My friend agreed, fought the other guy one on one. 2 of the frist 3 punches thrown by my friend KO'd the challenger stiff and another guy jumped in and was also immediately KO'd by the next punch thrown. However, 5 more guys jumped on my friend and mobbed him and nearly beat him to death. My friend was hospitalized and unable to work for the next couple months. Should he have changed his training to dealt with this? No, he just made a a mistake in decision making.  I've seen many guard playing officers successfully restrain and take down assailants without pulling guard.

 

Both your black belt cop and my friend are both just f**king idiots at the moment when they were under tremendous pressure

This is slightly different, apples to oranges. You’re talking a 1v1 and someone being jumped. 

yes, slightly different but th root of it all was the same-stupid decision making.

 

Did Ryan Hall choose to Imanari Roll his way into restraining that guy he choked in the burger place? No, he RNC's the guy even though he has probably drilled Imanari Roll a few thousand times by now

Yes but Ryan Hall is also the 1% of 1% who trains everyday. Not a guy with a day job, wife, kids etc.

 

Also stupid decision yes, but sometimes these things are unavoidable. 

7/22/19 7:15 PM
2/15/14
Posts: 658
GaspareBJJ -
mideastgrappler -
GaspareBJJ -
mideastgrappler -
robbie380 -
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

that is a result of stupid individual decision making

 

I have a friend who is a cop and former heavyweight pro-boxer. He was a murderous KO puncher during his career. He was making an arrest alone in a bad neighborhood that had a gang of hoodlums around him. As he was cuffing the guy, another challenged him to a fistfight and if they won, my friend would have to let the homeboy off the cuffs and walk free. My friend agreed, fought the other guy one on one. 2 of the frist 3 punches thrown by my friend KO'd the challenger stiff and another guy jumped in and was also immediately KO'd by the next punch thrown. However, 5 more guys jumped on my friend and mobbed him and nearly beat him to death. My friend was hospitalized and unable to work for the next couple months. Should he have changed his training to dealt with this? No, he just made a a mistake in decision making.  I've seen many guard playing officers successfully restrain and take down assailants without pulling guard.

 

Both your black belt cop and my friend are both just f**king idiots at the moment when they were under tremendous pressure

This is slightly different, apples to oranges. You’re talking a 1v1 and someone being jumped. 

yes, slightly different but th root of it all was the same-stupid decision making.

 

Did Ryan Hall choose to Imanari Roll his way into restraining that guy he choked in the burger place? No, he RNC's the guy even though he has probably drilled Imanari Roll a few thousand times by now

Yes but Ryan Hall is also the 1% of 1% who trains everyday. Not a guy with a day job, wife, kids etc.

 

Also stupid decision yes, but sometimes these things are unavoidable. 

The guard pulling cop did a dumb one by pulling guard under stress. At even at the mere hint of an escalation, pulling guard should not have even been in the vocabulary

 

My pro-boxer cop friend did a dumb one by agreeing to fight one guy in mutual combat in a bad neighborhood when the guy had 7 of his thug homies waiting around him. Agreeing to a one on one fight should not have been in the vocabulary.

 

I see your point though

Normal people and not 1%ers can and should train everything within reason. Training sport BJJ, which includes takedowns and restraints conrol should not be neglected at all. Having the common sense to separate them in any given situation should be an intuitive thing

7/22/19 7:42 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 13637
mideastgrappler -
GaspareBJJ -
mideastgrappler -
GaspareBJJ -
mideastgrappler -
robbie380 -
Brian McLaughlin -

I know a sport BJJ black belt that got cocky with a guy at a bar and got put to sleep, there are definitely some folks who over estimate themselves

Speaking to that a black belt cop that trains at our gym had a similar experience.  He was a major guard player and got into an altercation with someone he was trying to arrest.  Shit started happening and he pulled guard out of habit from training and he nearly got knocked out in the scuffle.  He said he completely changed his training after that incident and just reminded us that when shit goes crazy that you revert back to your training habits and you have to train in a fashion that would protect you in a fight.  

that is a result of stupid individual decision making

 

I have a friend who is a cop and former heavyweight pro-boxer. He was a murderous KO puncher during his career. He was making an arrest alone in a bad neighborhood that had a gang of hoodlums around him. As he was cuffing the guy, another challenged him to a fistfight and if they won, my friend would have to let the homeboy off the cuffs and walk free. My friend agreed, fought the other guy one on one. 2 of the frist 3 punches thrown by my friend KO'd the challenger stiff and another guy jumped in and was also immediately KO'd by the next punch thrown. However, 5 more guys jumped on my friend and mobbed him and nearly beat him to death. My friend was hospitalized and unable to work for the next couple months. Should he have changed his training to dealt with this? No, he just made a a mistake in decision making.  I've seen many guard playing officers successfully restrain and take down assailants without pulling guard.

 

Both your black belt cop and my friend are both just f**king idiots at the moment when they were under tremendous pressure

This is slightly different, apples to oranges. You’re talking a 1v1 and someone being jumped. 

yes, slightly different but th root of it all was the same-stupid decision making.

 

Did Ryan Hall choose to Imanari Roll his way into restraining that guy he choked in the burger place? No, he RNC's the guy even though he has probably drilled Imanari Roll a few thousand times by now

Yes but Ryan Hall is also the 1% of 1% who trains everyday. Not a guy with a day job, wife, kids etc.

 

Also stupid decision yes, but sometimes these things are unavoidable. 

The guard pulling cop did a dumb one by pulling guard under stress. At even at the mere hint of an escalation, pulling guard should not have even been in the vocabulary

 

My pro-boxer cop friend did a dumb one by agreeing to fight one guy in mutual combat in a bad neighborhood when the guy had 7 of his thug homies waiting around him. Agreeing to a one on one fight should not have been in the vocabulary.

 

I see your point though

Normal people and not 1%ers can and should train everything within reason. Training sport BJJ, which includes takedowns and restraints conrol should not be neglected at all. Having the common sense to separate them in any given situation should be an intuitive thing

--"Normal people and not 1%ers can and should train everything within reason. Training sport BJJ, which includes takedowns and restraints conrol should not be neglected at all. Having the common sense to separate them in any given situation should be an intuitive thing"

 

Seems to me, the only peolle neglecting a facet of trai ing is the "sport is all you need" crowd.

 

Common sense isnt the issue....defaults, habits, comfort and foundation is. Fpr example, did a little half-cripple randori this morning with one of my partners during morning trainjng. My gripping has a lot of broad application to what i do for clinching and fighting. His was more specialized  and focused for judo. Both work, but for me, not much changes and works well enough for sport/recreation and I get to always practice.things that I will use....indont have to change or adapt.