David Jacobs' BJJGround IBJJF Registration

10 days ago
8/15/07
Posts: 16770
carcaju - 
Soul Gravy - 
mideastgrappler - 
Soul Gravy - I've always assumed they have such ridiculous requirements and hoops to jump through because they're afraid of an outsider wrecking their clique. Doesn't look good having walk-ons show up their good ol' boys Brazilian network.

what do you mean?


They want to keep some unknown from a garage gym from signing up and proceeding to wreck their division. Sort of like keeping undesirables out of a country club. In this case, IBJJF is the country club.

Hilarious if you actually believe this.

True story.
10 days ago
2/21/11
Posts: 6394
Soul Gravy - 
carcaju - 
Soul Gravy - 
mideastgrappler - 
Soul Gravy - I've always assumed they have such ridiculous requirements and hoops to jump through because they're afraid of an outsider wrecking their clique. Doesn't look good having walk-ons show up their good ol' boys Brazilian network.

what do you mean?


They want to keep some unknown from a garage gym from signing up and proceeding to wreck their division. Sort of like keeping undesirables out of a country club. In this case, IBJJF is the country club.

Hilarious if you actually believe this.

True story.

Yes the only thing keeping these killer garage trained bjj guys out is the evil IBJJF. Lol. Fuck outta here. IBJJF is the gold standard for level of competition, with things like Grappling Industries generating decent competition.

The only things the IBJJF is interested in is money, professionalism and trying to maintain legitimacy/standards.


Moreso money.
10 days ago
4/25/11
Posts: 2748
Soul Gravy -
mideastgrappler - 
Soul Gravy - I've always assumed they have such ridiculous requirements and hoops to jump through because they're afraid of an outsider wrecking their clique. Doesn't look good having walk-ons show up their good ol' boys Brazilian network.

what do you mean?


They want to keep some unknown from a garage gym from signing up and proceeding to wreck their division. Sort of like keeping undesirables out of a country club. In this case, IBJJF is the country club.

Lol you can't be serious?

10 days ago
8/15/07
Posts: 16771
Agree to disagree, guys.
Edited: 10 days ago
4/25/11
Posts: 2751
Soul Gravy - Agree to disagree, guys.

No, you are delusional. You don't understand the level of some of these guys. The blue belt medalists are better than most club black belts. Name one guy from a garage gym without official ibjjf rank that could walk in and "wreck" a higher belt ibjjf division. 

10 days ago
11/10/05
Posts: 7449

I never know what this talk is all about...

I pay $35...

got card...

registered for a competition... 

spend sleepless nights wondering why I signed up for a competition...

 

10 days ago
2/15/14
Posts: 674
Meatgrinder -

I never know what this talk is all about...

I pay $35...

got card...

registered for a competition... 

spend sleepless nights wondering why I signed up for a competition...

 

I do the same, this is my 4th yr doing this as a black belt. I have not applied for my 1st stripe nor do I have any plans to until I'm due for my 3rd degree

 

When do I owe the $400? Is there any way around that?

Are you recognized as a 1st/2nd/3rd degree black belt?

10 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 3391
mideastgrappler - 
Meatgrinder -

I never know what this talk is all about...

I pay $35...

got card...

registered for a competition... 

spend sleepless nights wondering why I signed up for a competition...

 

I do the same, this is my 4th yr doing this as a black belt. I have not applied for my 1st stripe nor do I have any plans to until I'm due for my 3rd degree

 

When do I owe the $400? Is there any way around that?

Are you recognized as a 1st/2nd/3rd degree black belt?


The membership card and the cert/stripes are two seperate things

The card allows you to compete
The $400 cert gets you recognised as a BB, which is the first step to getting your IBJJF recognised stripes and eventually giving out IBJJF recognised black belts.

If all you want to do is compete, then just get the card.

If you're a school owner, or plan on opening a school and care about having your black belt students recognised by the IBJJF, then you need to get the cert and do all the other stuff (yearly membership, First Aid, referee course) to get your stripes and eventually be recognised as allowed to give out black belts that will also be recognised by the federation. One thing to consider is that while you may not care about the IBJJF, your BB students might want to open their own schools AND be recognised. So by avoiding the IBJJF, you're actually creating difficulties for your students further down the line. It's bullshit, but it's the way the federation maintains control.

James
10 days ago
3/2/04
Posts: 442

True, but there are ways around that. E.g., AFAIK you can get skip all the bureaucratic nonsense by doing it through BJJ Globetrotters, as they have suitably high enough degree black belts that have done all the paperwork. 

9 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 18567
slideyfoot - 

True, but there are ways around that. E.g., AFAIK you can get skip all the bureaucratic nonsense by doing it through BJJ Globetrotters, as they have suitably high enough degree black belts that have done all the paperwork. 


Again that's just for competition.  

9 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 14691
mideastgrappler -
Meatgrinder -

I never know what this talk is all about...

I pay $35...

got card...

registered for a competition... 

spend sleepless nights wondering why I signed up for a competition...

 

I do the same, this is my 4th yr doing this as a black belt. I have not applied for my 1st stripe nor do I have any plans to until I'm due for my 3rd degree

 

When do I owe the $400? Is there any way around that?

Are you recognized as a 1st/2nd/3rd degree black belt?

Again you aren't avoiding it as I have said multiple times this thread.  Your first certificate is going to be that and there is zero negotiation on that.  As long as you are in standing w them (i.e. kept up your general membership for the required amount of years) then yeah you can pay and go in at 3rd degree years from now.  You lapse however and for official recognition of rank you won't get it, they will add that on for years for you to sit at a rank as recognized by the federation.

 

And its stupid as shit but it is what it is.  As you can get your memberanship rank card as a black belt and its fine.  But they seperate being a competitor vs being a professor, making you have to pay the higher fee as a result.  Its a complete cash grab for recognition and for recognition for future people you promote and that really is it.

9 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 14693
Sir Taps -
Soul Gravy - I've always assumed they have such ridiculous requirements and hoops to jump through because they're afraid of an outsider wrecking their clique. Doesn't look good having walk-ons show up their good ol' boys Brazilian network.

The black belt cert and all the stupid expensive hoops you have to jump through aren't about stopping gringos from winning at the Worlds. It's about helping the big associations keep their affiliates for as long as possible.

James

Say it louder for people in the back, as the big associations are def pushing for all black belts to be IBJJF certified.

9 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 3393
deepu - 
slideyfoot - 

True, but there are ways around that. E.g., AFAIK you can get skip all the bureaucratic nonsense by doing it through BJJ Globetrotters, as they have suitably high enough degree black belts that have done all the paperwork. 


Again that's just for competition.  


This is they key thing. You have to seperate membership for competition from recognition of your black belt to be able to promote your own students to an IBJJF recognised black belt (and therefore make it easier for them in turn to have their students recognised).

Membership Card: Required to compete
Black Belt Certificate: Required to be recognised as a BB by the IBJJF. All subsequent degree promotions then need to go through the IBJJF to be able to have your own BB students recognised by the federation.

As shitty as it is, not following the IBJJF rules potentially limits your students and their future plans for teaching. So unless Globetrotters have a 3rd degree BB who's happy to sign off the IBJJF paperwork for black belts (and their subsequent degree promotions) they've never met, then you can't rely on that method to keep the IBJJF at arm's reach and still not cause complications later down the line for your black belt students.

James
9 days ago
3/2/04
Posts: 443
Sir Taps -
deepu - 
slideyfoot - 

True, but there are ways around that. E.g., AFAIK you can get skip all the bureaucratic nonsense by doing it through BJJ Globetrotters, as they have suitably high enough degree black belts that have done all the paperwork. 


Again that's just for competition.  


This is they key thing. You have to seperate membership for competition from recognition of your black belt to be able to promote your own students to an IBJJF recognised black belt (and therefore make it easier for them in turn to have their students recognised).

Membership Card: Required to compete
Black Belt Certificate: Required to be recognised as a BB by the IBJJF. All subsequent degree promotions then need to go through the IBJJF to be able to have your own BB students recognised by the federation.

As shitty as it is, not following the IBJJF rules potentially limits your students and their future plans for teaching. So unless Globetrotters have a 3rd degree BB who's happy to sign off the IBJJF paperwork for black belts (and their subsequent degree promotions) they've never met, then you can't rely on that method to keep the IBJJF at arm's reach and still not cause complications later down the line for your black belt students.

James

AFAIK, they do have a third (might be fourth degree) black belt at BJJ Globetrotters who can do that for you. Although yeah, I would assume you'd have to attend at least a few camps first, presumably they wouldn't do that for a complete stranger. 

 

I guess I'll find out, as that's my current plan for the future. Though I dislike the IBJJF sufficiently that I'm willing to risk losing students over not being registered with them. 

8 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 8595
Sir Taps - 
mideastgrappler - 
Meatgrinder -

I never know what this talk is all about...

I pay $35...

got card...

registered for a competition... 

spend sleepless nights wondering why I signed up for a competition...

 

I do the same, this is my 4th yr doing this as a black belt. I have not applied for my 1st stripe nor do I have any plans to until I'm due for my 3rd degree

 

When do I owe the $400? Is there any way around that?

Are you recognized as a 1st/2nd/3rd degree black belt?


The membership card and the cert/stripes are two seperate things

The card allows you to compete
The $400 cert gets you recognised as a BB, which is the first step to getting your IBJJF recognised stripes and eventually giving out IBJJF recognised black belts.

If all you want to do is compete, then just get the card.

If you're a school owner, or plan on opening a school and care about having your black belt students recognised by the IBJJF, then you need to get the cert and do all the other stuff (yearly membership, First Aid, referee course) to get your stripes and eventually be recognised as allowed to give out black belts that will also be recognised by the federation. One thing to consider is that while you may not care about the IBJJF, your BB students might want to open their own schools AND be recognised. So by avoiding the IBJJF, you're actually creating difficulties for your students further down the line. It's bullshit, but it's the way the federation maintains control.

James

Excellent information!
7 days ago
4/26/03
Posts: 29377

So I emailed them. It got kicked back for mistakes I made. I resubmitted and emailed them. The email was rejected because their mailbox is full. Lol

7 days ago
2/15/14
Posts: 678
slideyfoot -
Sir Taps -
deepu - 
slideyfoot - 

True, but there are ways around that. E.g., AFAIK you can get skip all the bureaucratic nonsense by doing it through BJJ Globetrotters, as they have suitably high enough degree black belts that have done all the paperwork. 


Again that's just for competition.  


This is they key thing. You have to seperate membership for competition from recognition of your black belt to be able to promote your own students to an IBJJF recognised black belt (and therefore make it easier for them in turn to have their students recognised).

Membership Card: Required to compete
Black Belt Certificate: Required to be recognised as a BB by the IBJJF. All subsequent degree promotions then need to go through the IBJJF to be able to have your own BB students recognised by the federation.

As shitty as it is, not following the IBJJF rules potentially limits your students and their future plans for teaching. So unless Globetrotters have a 3rd degree BB who's happy to sign off the IBJJF paperwork for black belts (and their subsequent degree promotions) they've never met, then you can't rely on that method to keep the IBJJF at arm's reach and still not cause complications later down the line for your black belt students.

James

AFAIK, they do have a third (might be fourth degree) black belt at BJJ Globetrotters who can do that for you. Although yeah, I would assume you'd have to attend at least a few camps first, presumably they wouldn't do that for a complete stranger. 

 

I guess I'll find out, as that's my current plan for the future. Though I dislike the IBJJF sufficiently that I'm willing to risk losing students over not being registered with them. 

so you dislike them so much why again? 

 

You'd rather skip out on paying $400 certificate+a few other small fees than potentially have about ~7 ($1000) that may come to you because you can sign off for them to compete in IBJJF competition because they have the most organzied and consistent competitions

7 days ago
12/21/04
Posts: 2000

I've always wondered how Carlson Gracie Sr. would have responded to the IBJJF's grading requirements, particularly with regard to his own students. When Carlson Gracie Jr. registered with the IBJJF he had to reduce his rank (i.e., remove a stripe from his black belt) because he was told that he had not been a black belt long enough by IBJJF standards to have the rank that his teacher (Carlson Gracie Sr.) gave him. Keep in mind that Carlson Gracie Sr. had already passed by this time. I can understand and appreciate why the IBJJF wants to strive for some level of consistency but I was shocked to hear that they did not honor Junior's rank. 

7 days ago
3/2/04
Posts: 444
mideastgrappler -
slideyfoot -
Sir Taps -
deepu - 
slideyfoot - 

True, but there are ways around that. E.g., AFAIK you can get skip all the bureaucratic nonsense by doing it through BJJ Globetrotters, as they have suitably high enough degree black belts that have done all the paperwork. 


Again that's just for competition.  


This is they key thing. You have to seperate membership for competition from recognition of your black belt to be able to promote your own students to an IBJJF recognised black belt (and therefore make it easier for them in turn to have their students recognised).

Membership Card: Required to compete
Black Belt Certificate: Required to be recognised as a BB by the IBJJF. All subsequent degree promotions then need to go through the IBJJF to be able to have your own BB students recognised by the federation.

As shitty as it is, not following the IBJJF rules potentially limits your students and their future plans for teaching. So unless Globetrotters have a 3rd degree BB who's happy to sign off the IBJJF paperwork for black belts (and their subsequent degree promotions) they've never met, then you can't rely on that method to keep the IBJJF at arm's reach and still not cause complications later down the line for your black belt students.

James

AFAIK, they do have a third (might be fourth degree) black belt at BJJ Globetrotters who can do that for you. Although yeah, I would assume you'd have to attend at least a few camps first, presumably they wouldn't do that for a complete stranger. 

 

I guess I'll find out, as that's my current plan for the future. Though I dislike the IBJJF sufficiently that I'm willing to risk losing students over not being registered with them. 

so you dislike them so much why again? 

 

You'd rather skip out on paying $400 certificate+a few other small fees than potentially have about ~7 ($1000) that may come to you because you can sign off for them to compete in IBJJF competition because they have the most organzied and consistent competitions

I dislike them because I view them as dishonest: they're a business that pretends to be a governing body, attempting (successfully, judging by this thread) to profit considerably from that pretence. Which they can push because they have a large share of the competition market (especially in the US, where they're harder to ignore than here in the UK).

If other people want to support them that's their prerogative (and I'm a nobody, so it's not like they need my support), but I intend to continue avoiding them. 

6 days ago
11/10/05
Posts: 7451

they're not pretending to be a governing body. They are one. You're not forced to be a part of it, but there are benefits and credibility in being a part of it. Are they not supposed to make any profit? That's the part that you don't like.... Pretty sure FIFA makes a few dollars.

Edited: 5 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 18574
Meatgrinder -

they're not pretending to be a governing body. They are one. You're not forced to be a part of it, but there are benefits and credibility in being a part of it. Are they not supposed to make any profit? That's the part that you don't like.... Pretty sure FIFA makes a few dollars.

FIFA is corrupt as hell and not a model to emulate.  And even they don't have a team while running the show unlike IBJJF and Garcie Barra.  

Edited: 5 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 34871
Meatgrinder - 

they're not pretending to be a governing body. They are one. You're not forced to be a part of it, but there are benefits and credibility in being a part of it. Are they not supposed to make any profit? That's the part that you don't like.... Pretty sure FIFA makes a few dollars.

 

The IBJJF positions itself like a true international governing body for amature sports a la Judo, TKD or wrestling but the IBJJF CAN'T be a legit sports governing body for the amature sport of BJJ on a global scale because it's for profit and isn't structured correctly. That's why the rival SJJIF exists, to get BJJ into the Olympics. [Not that I personally care too much about that]. The SJJIF has a different feel; cheaper fees, more responsive to members and Black Belts compete for free. It's an "amature sports organization" more like you see in Judo, TKD & Wrestling.

The IBJJF pretends to be the IJF, WTF or UWW, but they are not.  At it's heart it's really more of a martial arts organization posing as an amature sports organization.

 

4 days ago
11/10/05
Posts: 7452
shen - 
Meatgrinder - 

they're not pretending to be a governing body. They are one. You're not forced to be a part of it, but there are benefits and credibility in being a part of it. Are they not supposed to make any profit? That's the part that you don't like.... Pretty sure FIFA makes a few dollars.

 

The IBJJF positions itself like a true international governing body for amature sports a la Judo, TKD or wrestling but the IBJJF CAN'T be a legit sports governing body for the amature sport of BJJ on a global scale because it's for profit and isn't structured correctly. That's why the rival SJJIF exists, to get BJJ into the Olympics. [Not that I personally care too much about that]. The SJJIF has a different feel; cheaper fees, more responsive to members and Black Belts compete for free. It's an "amature sports organization" more like you see in Judo, TKD & Wrestling.

The IBJJF pretends to be the IJF, WTF or UWW, but they are not.  At it's heart it's really more of a martial arts organization posing as an amature sports organization.

 


I see. I'm not sure that the SJJIF is familiar to me. That's not the thing that Rickson started and tried using to verify people and have tournaments is it?

 

 

4 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 2065
shen - 
Meatgrinder - 

they're not pretending to be a governing body. They are one. You're not forced to be a part of it, but there are benefits and credibility in being a part of it. Are they not supposed to make any profit? That's the part that you don't like.... Pretty sure FIFA makes a few dollars.

 

The IBJJF positions itself like a true international governing body for amature sports a la Judo, TKD or wrestling but the IBJJF CAN'T be a legit sports governing body for the amature sport of BJJ on a global scale because it's for profit and isn't structured correctly. That's why the rival SJJIF exists, to get BJJ into the Olympics. [Not that I personally care too much about that]. The SJJIF has a different feel; cheaper fees, more responsive to members and Black Belts compete for free. It's an "amature sports organization" more like you see in Judo, TKD & Wrestling.

The IBJJF pretends to be the IJF, WTF or UWW, but they are not.  At it's heart it's really more of a martial arts organization posing as an amature sports organization.

 


In what ways does the IBJJF pretend to be the IJF etc? What do they pretend to do but don't actually do? Or what do they pretend not to do but actually do?
4 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 18576
JCT - 
shen - 
Meatgrinder - 

they're not pretending to be a governing body. They are one. You're not forced to be a part of it, but there are benefits and credibility in being a part of it. Are they not supposed to make any profit? That's the part that you don't like.... Pretty sure FIFA makes a few dollars.

 

The IBJJF positions itself like a true international governing body for amature sports a la Judo, TKD or wrestling but the IBJJF CAN'T be a legit sports governing body for the amature sport of BJJ on a global scale because it's for profit and isn't structured correctly. That's why the rival SJJIF exists, to get BJJ into the Olympics. [Not that I personally care too much about that]. The SJJIF has a different feel; cheaper fees, more responsive to members and Black Belts compete for free. It's an "amature sports organization" more like you see in Judo, TKD & Wrestling.

The IBJJF pretends to be the IJF, WTF or UWW, but they are not.  At it's heart it's really more of a martial arts organization posing as an amature sports organization.

 


In what ways does the IBJJF pretend to be the IJF etc? What do they pretend to do but don't actually do? Or what do they pretend not to do but actually do?

I know that if you want govt funding for your sport and they require that your sport have an international governing body, you can use IBJJF for bjj.  I have friends in Africa that went down that path.