David Jacobs' BJJGround Instructor got black belt - doesn't train much now

29 days ago
3/15/15
Posts: 12457
AmericanJJ -
misterw -
AmericanJJ -

If your intsrutor is a blue, purple, brown, new or old black belt and doesnt train = Go find a new gym!

I'm in my late 40's and have been training for 25yrs. Black belt for 15yrs. I train 4-6 days a week. And I run an academy. It's my job. 

The intsructor has an obligation to train or get out of the way. This is what causes the whole "sport vs self defense" "old school vs new school" BS. A bunch of lazy dudes that dont train anymore and can't deal with the sport evolving without them need an excuse. Their only hope of saving face is to say either their style of BJJ is more deadly (oldest martial arts trick in the book) or that the "old school" is better. Whatever the hell that means. Anyone who has been training for more than 10yrs consistanct knows that BJJ gets better and better. 

 

A good instructor trains! It doesnt need to be 100% every day, but they sweat. The stay up to date. They are involved. A wall sitter needs to stop teaching and beocome a business owner and a fan.  

 

Find an instructor that isn't lazy. 

So what happens when you get too old to train the way you say you are doing, but still have a lifetime's worth of accumulated knowledge?  

I didn’t say that you need to train like it’s the world championships. I said you need to train. That means be on the mat and sweat, learn, move. He said his instructor doesn’t train at all or barely.  
 

I know 70yr old black belts, guys with long term injuries, hectic lives, etc who train 3-5x week. They are smart. They train to their level and ability. They aren’t using age or injuries as an excuse. They are still grinding. I think OP said his instructor is healthy, not too old and has no limitations. No real excuse. He just doesn’t train = lame. 

A good instructor is also involved in daily training. He runs sparring. He either trains with the class or oversees it. He sets Traning partners and the goal of the sparring. They know the students limitations and goals. He partners or puts people in groups accordingly. You don’t let these issues exist. Again, the killers go with killers, the older guys with older guys, the regular people with eachother, etc. you can’t have Mundial champs 3wks out from a comp forced to train with a 50yr old 9-5 blue belt. It’s not fair for either of them. 
Don’t get me started on “wall sitting” and partner avoidance. 
 

What a silly post. In no other sport, and I've done a few -wrestling, boxing, Judo, soccer, is a coach/instructor exepected to keep training forever. It is really tied to each individual's fitness, goals and genetics. I know someone who is pretty much on morphine due to daily back pain, there is no friggin way he can train now. The problem is that your attitude of "grinding" wrecks bodies. I have learned tons from some BJJers who no longer train due to injuries.

You speak of ideals, but after training since the birth of the UFC and having dropped in to about 50 clubs over my life, I have never seen this mythical grouping of age and skill you speak of. Oh, it's spoken of, and talked about and occasionally done a few times,  but rarely done. In the end, I see 20-35 yr. olds (outside of kids) being the main adult market, going hard against 50 year old, etc. It's a nice ldeal but it rarely happens out of lip service.   

We also talk about all these senior citizens training BJJ, but they are rareties, and generally, but not always, guys that were physically tough to begin with. I have known from what I remember, about 60 guys who started training over the age of 45. And from what I can see only 2, perhaps 3 really train anymore. 

 

28 days ago
5/16/08
Posts: 884

People are different and only the individual knows his/her aches and pains. A lot of the older guys started competing in their childhood. Here in America I imagine some of you were wrestlers, in Brazil Judocas. Years of competition and wear and tear of joints and muscles and the individual overall health will play a factor. So, if you are on your 40's and older, comparing yourself and judging others without knowing based on your parameters is not a fair assessment. Some older guys roll some don't and both groups can be great. Enjoy and take advantage of their knowledge. 

28 days ago
9/26/07
Posts: 722
HotSteppa - 
AmericanJJ -
misterw -
AmericanJJ -

If your intsrutor is a blue, purple, brown, new or old black belt and doesnt train = Go find a new gym!

I'm in my late 40's and have been training for 25yrs. Black belt for 15yrs. I train 4-6 days a week. And I run an academy. It's my job. 

The intsructor has an obligation to train or get out of the way. This is what causes the whole "sport vs self defense" "old school vs new school" BS. A bunch of lazy dudes that dont train anymore and can't deal with the sport evolving without them need an excuse. Their only hope of saving face is to say either their style of BJJ is more deadly (oldest martial arts trick in the book) or that the "old school" is better. Whatever the hell that means. Anyone who has been training for more than 10yrs consistanct knows that BJJ gets better and better. 

 

A good instructor trains! It doesnt need to be 100% every day, but they sweat. The stay up to date. They are involved. A wall sitter needs to stop teaching and beocome a business owner and a fan.  

 

Find an instructor that isn't lazy. 

So what happens when you get too old to train the way you say you are doing, but still have a lifetime's worth of accumulated knowledge?  

I didn’t say that you need to train like it’s the world championships. I said you need to train. That means be on the mat and sweat, learn, move. He said his instructor doesn’t train at all or barely.  
 

I know 70yr old black belts, guys with long term injuries, hectic lives, etc who train 3-5x week. They are smart. They train to their level and ability. They aren’t using age or injuries as an excuse. They are still grinding. I think OP said his instructor is healthy, not too old and has no limitations. No real excuse. He just doesn’t train = lame. 

A good instructor is also involved in daily training. He runs sparring. He either trains with the class or oversees it. He sets Traning partners and the goal of the sparring. They know the students limitations and goals. He partners or puts people in groups accordingly. You don’t let these issues exist. Again, the killers go with killers, the older guys with older guys, the regular people with eachother, etc. you can’t have Mundial champs 3wks out from a comp forced to train with a 50yr old 9-5 blue belt. It’s not fair for either of them. 
Don’t get me started on “wall sitting” and partner avoidance. 
 

What a silly post. In no other sport, and I've done a few -wrestling, boxing, Judo, soccer, is a coach/instructor exepected to keep training forever. It is really tied to each individual's fitness, goals and genetics. I know someone who is pretty much on morphine due to daily back pain, there is no friggin way he can train now. The problem is that your attitude of "grinding" wrecks bodies. I have learned tons from some BJJers who no longer train due to injuries.

You speak of ideals, but after training since the birth of the UFC and having dropped in to about 50 clubs over my life, I have never seen this mythical grouping of age and skill you speak of. Oh, it's spoken of, and talked about and occasionally done a few times,  but rarely done. In the end, I see 20-35 yr. olds (outside of kids) being the main adult market, going hard against 50 year old, etc. It's a nice ldeal but it rarely happens out of lip service.   

We also talk about all these senior citizens training BJJ, but they are rareties, and generally, but not always, guys that were physically tough to begin with. I have known from what I remember, about 60 guys who started training over the age of 45. And from what I can see only 2, perhaps 3 really train anymore. 

 


This is true but I think BJJ has usually been seen as a different type of sport to wrestling and boxing. One of the major selling points in getting people in the door and signing up is that BJJ is the gentle art, a sport that you can keep doing for years and years even when you get old. Now admittedly as pointed out earlier in the thread this is usually bullshit and its actually very rare to see older people doing BJJ (or at least rolling) but it is one of the selling points of the sport/martial art and it is also one of the reasons why boxing is $2 per lesson and BJJ is $20 per lesson.

27 days ago
11/13/09
Posts: 3300
Denis Kelly -
HotSteppa - 
AmericanJJ -
misterw -
AmericanJJ -

If your intsrutor is a blue, purple, brown, new or old black belt and doesnt train = Go find a new gym!

I'm in my late 40's and have been training for 25yrs. Black belt for 15yrs. I train 4-6 days a week. And I run an academy. It's my job. 

The intsructor has an obligation to train or get out of the way. This is what causes the whole "sport vs self defense" "old school vs new school" BS. A bunch of lazy dudes that dont train anymore and can't deal with the sport evolving without them need an excuse. Their only hope of saving face is to say either their style of BJJ is more deadly (oldest martial arts trick in the book) or that the "old school" is better. Whatever the hell that means. Anyone who has been training for more than 10yrs consistanct knows that BJJ gets better and better. 

 

A good instructor trains! It doesnt need to be 100% every day, but they sweat. The stay up to date. They are involved. A wall sitter needs to stop teaching and beocome a business owner and a fan.  

 

Find an instructor that isn't lazy. 

So what happens when you get too old to train the way you say you are doing, but still have a lifetime's worth of accumulated knowledge?  

I didn’t say that you need to train like it’s the world championships. I said you need to train. That means be on the mat and sweat, learn, move. He said his instructor doesn’t train at all or barely.  
 

I know 70yr old black belts, guys with long term injuries, hectic lives, etc who train 3-5x week. They are smart. They train to their level and ability. They aren’t using age or injuries as an excuse. They are still grinding. I think OP said his instructor is healthy, not too old and has no limitations. No real excuse. He just doesn’t train = lame. 

A good instructor is also involved in daily training. He runs sparring. He either trains with the class or oversees it. He sets Traning partners and the goal of the sparring. They know the students limitations and goals. He partners or puts people in groups accordingly. You don’t let these issues exist. Again, the killers go with killers, the older guys with older guys, the regular people with eachother, etc. you can’t have Mundial champs 3wks out from a comp forced to train with a 50yr old 9-5 blue belt. It’s not fair for either of them. 
Don’t get me started on “wall sitting” and partner avoidance. 
 

What a silly post. In no other sport, and I've done a few -wrestling, boxing, Judo, soccer, is a coach/instructor exepected to keep training forever. It is really tied to each individual's fitness, goals and genetics. I know someone who is pretty much on morphine due to daily back pain, there is no friggin way he can train now. The problem is that your attitude of "grinding" wrecks bodies. I have learned tons from some BJJers who no longer train due to injuries.

You speak of ideals, but after training since the birth of the UFC and having dropped in to about 50 clubs over my life, I have never seen this mythical grouping of age and skill you speak of. Oh, it's spoken of, and talked about and occasionally done a few times,  but rarely done. In the end, I see 20-35 yr. olds (outside of kids) being the main adult market, going hard against 50 year old, etc. It's a nice ldeal but it rarely happens out of lip service.   

We also talk about all these senior citizens training BJJ, but they are rareties, and generally, but not always, guys that were physically tough to begin with. I have known from what I remember, about 60 guys who started training over the age of 45. And from what I can see only 2, perhaps 3 really train anymore. 

 


This is true but I think BJJ has usually been seen as a different type of sport to wrestling and boxing. One of the major selling points in getting people in the door and signing up is that BJJ is the gentle art, a sport that you can keep doing for years and years even when you get old. Now admittedly as pointed out earlier in the thread this is usually bullshit and its actually very rare to see older people doing BJJ (or at least rolling) but it is one of the selling points of the sport/martial art and it is also one of the reasons why boxing is $2 per lesson and BJJ is $20 per lesson.

I agree.  I think it will move away from this more and more but BJJ is also different in that you generally get to roll with the best and the brightest right out the gate.  I have no boxing background but I have friends that have travelled to big name boxing gyms and they don't let you 'spar' the stars or the coach on your first day (or anyday really).  I strongly believe part of the magic of BJJ is that you can get safely manhandled on the first day.  Often the coach was the most likely to do that because he was the best and also because the coach can check to see if you are a complete loon.  I think from this grew the image that the coach should pretty much always be the best in the room and therefore should be rolling.  Obviously that is pretty dumb and outdated but the idea persists that the blackbelt in the room should be able to maul anyone at anytime.  Hopefully that notion can hurry and go away.  I don't know of any major sport where the coach is always the resident champion and can beat all-comers

27 days ago
2/1/08
Posts: 1640
onyx2002 -
Denis Kelly -
HotSteppa - 
AmericanJJ -
misterw -
AmericanJJ -

If your intsrutor is a blue, purple, brown, new or old black belt and doesnt train = Go find a new gym!

I'm in my late 40's and have been training for 25yrs. Black belt for 15yrs. I train 4-6 days a week. And I run an academy. It's my job. 

The intsructor has an obligation to train or get out of the way. This is what causes the whole "sport vs self defense" "old school vs new school" BS. A bunch of lazy dudes that dont train anymore and can't deal with the sport evolving without them need an excuse. Their only hope of saving face is to say either their style of BJJ is more deadly (oldest martial arts trick in the book) or that the "old school" is better. Whatever the hell that means. Anyone who has been training for more than 10yrs consistanct knows that BJJ gets better and better. 

 

A good instructor trains! It doesnt need to be 100% every day, but they sweat. The stay up to date. They are involved. A wall sitter needs to stop teaching and beocome a business owner and a fan.  

 

Find an instructor that isn't lazy. 

So what happens when you get too old to train the way you say you are doing, but still have a lifetime's worth of accumulated knowledge?  

I didn’t say that you need to train like it’s the world championships. I said you need to train. That means be on the mat and sweat, learn, move. He said his instructor doesn’t train at all or barely.  
 

I know 70yr old black belts, guys with long term injuries, hectic lives, etc who train 3-5x week. They are smart. They train to their level and ability. They aren’t using age or injuries as an excuse. They are still grinding. I think OP said his instructor is healthy, not too old and has no limitations. No real excuse. He just doesn’t train = lame. 

A good instructor is also involved in daily training. He runs sparring. He either trains with the class or oversees it. He sets Traning partners and the goal of the sparring. They know the students limitations and goals. He partners or puts people in groups accordingly. You don’t let these issues exist. Again, the killers go with killers, the older guys with older guys, the regular people with eachother, etc. you can’t have Mundial champs 3wks out from a comp forced to train with a 50yr old 9-5 blue belt. It’s not fair for either of them. 
Don’t get me started on “wall sitting” and partner avoidance. 
 

What a silly post. In no other sport, and I've done a few -wrestling, boxing, Judo, soccer, is a coach/instructor exepected to keep training forever. It is really tied to each individual's fitness, goals and genetics. I know someone who is pretty much on morphine due to daily back pain, there is no friggin way he can train now. The problem is that your attitude of "grinding" wrecks bodies. I have learned tons from some BJJers who no longer train due to injuries.

You speak of ideals, but after training since the birth of the UFC and having dropped in to about 50 clubs over my life, I have never seen this mythical grouping of age and skill you speak of. Oh, it's spoken of, and talked about and occasionally done a few times,  but rarely done. In the end, I see 20-35 yr. olds (outside of kids) being the main adult market, going hard against 50 year old, etc. It's a nice ldeal but it rarely happens out of lip service.   

We also talk about all these senior citizens training BJJ, but they are rareties, and generally, but not always, guys that were physically tough to begin with. I have known from what I remember, about 60 guys who started training over the age of 45. And from what I can see only 2, perhaps 3 really train anymore. 

 


This is true but I think BJJ has usually been seen as a different type of sport to wrestling and boxing. One of the major selling points in getting people in the door and signing up is that BJJ is the gentle art, a sport that you can keep doing for years and years even when you get old. Now admittedly as pointed out earlier in the thread this is usually bullshit and its actually very rare to see older people doing BJJ (or at least rolling) but it is one of the selling points of the sport/martial art and it is also one of the reasons why boxing is $2 per lesson and BJJ is $20 per lesson.

I agree.  I think it will move away from this more and more but BJJ is also different in that you generally get to roll with the best and the brightest right out the gate.  I have no boxing background but I have friends that have travelled to big name boxing gyms and they don't let you 'spar' the stars or the coach on your first day (or anyday really).  I strongly believe part of the magic of BJJ is that you can get safely manhandled on the first day.  Often the coach was the most likely to do that because he was the best and also because the coach can check to see if you are a complete loon.  I think from this grew the image that the coach should pretty much always be the best in the room and therefore should be rolling.  Obviously that is pretty dumb and outdated but the idea persists that the blackbelt in the room should be able to maul anyone at anytime.  Hopefully that notion can hurry and go away.  I don't know of any major sport where the coach is always the resident champion and can beat all-comers

I think it came from Hollywood more than anything.  The martial arts teacher is semi-mystical and can always easily defeat those stronger and younger than him.  We bought into a lot of the nonsense that surrounded TMAs.  

25 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 4521
judoinmotion - 

People are different and only the individual knows his/her aches and pains. A lot of the older guys started competing in their childhood. Here in America I imagine some of you were wrestlers, in Brazil Judocas. Years of competition and wear and tear of joints and muscles and the individual overall health will play a factor. So, if you are on your 40's and older, comparing yourself and judging others without knowing based on your parameters is not a fair assessment. Some older guys roll some don't and both groups can be great. Enjoy and take advantage of their knowledge. 


Over the years, i've had people my age (40 in a few days) or slightly older but newer at the sart, like blue belts or white belts, be dismissive of me when i've said that i have an ache or pain.  
I've always had to remind them that yea, I may be near their age or younger, but my body has a lot more mileage on it than theirs since i've been doing BJJ for over two decades.
 
Big difference between someone that is in their late thirties that started BJJ when they were 18, than a person of the same age that started five years ago.
 
 
 
My days of rolling with all commers regarding of size are over.  This is the only art that people aren't allowed to age.
 
25 days ago
5/16/08
Posts: 885
SlapUsilly -
judoinmotion - 

People are different and only the individual knows his/her aches and pains. A lot of the older guys started competing in their childhood. Here in America I imagine some of you were wrestlers, in Brazil Judocas. Years of competition and wear and tear of joints and muscles and the individual overall health will play a factor. So, if you are on your 40's and older, comparing yourself and judging others without knowing based on your parameters is not a fair assessment. Some older guys roll some don't and both groups can be great. Enjoy and take advantage of their knowledge. 


Over the years, i've had people my age (40 in a few days) or slightly older but newer at the sart, like blue belts or white belts, be dismissive of me when i've said that i have an ache or pain.  
I've always had to remind them that yea, I may be near their age or younger, but my body has a lot more mileage on it than theirs since i've been doing BJJ for over two decades.
 
Big difference between someone that is in their late thirties that started BJJ when they were 18, than a person of the same age that started five years ago.
 
 
 
My days of rolling with all commers regarding of size are over.  This is the only art that people aren't allowed to age.
 

Been a competitor since I was 8 years old and now at 54, I am very picky of who I train with. 

I'm not concerned of my students hurting me, I'm concern that I'll hurt myself while moving. 

I expend a lot of money with medical bills so I can keep my body somewhat able. 

25 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 562
That's a great point, this is totally the only sport\art that you are not allowed to age. I tell my students all the time about how shit my recovery has become and how much pain I am in from rolling and I know they don't "buy it". Part of it is because I look younger than I am and another is when you're 20 years old, you just can't imagine what a rolling hangover actually feels like.
25 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 13761

"rolling hangover" LMMFAO....THAT IS AWESOME

25 days ago
2/27/08
Posts: 1748
If you're getting rolling hangovers why not just roll lighter? Concede position more often, tap more often etc.

That strategy works at every other colour of belt.
25 days ago
2/1/08
Posts: 1641
Red Stuff - If you're getting rolling hangovers why not just roll lighter? Concede position more often, tap more often etc.

That strategy works at every other colour of belt.

That helps, but it's not quite that easy.  Large people rolling with intensity can still mash on you with their weight, yank on subs they don't have, even if you are conceding position.  

25 days ago
8/28/10
Posts: 12791
SpeedKing9 - That's a great point, this is totally the only sport\art that you are not allowed to age. I tell my students all the time about how shit my recovery has become and how much pain I am in from rolling and I know they don't "buy it". Part of it is because I look younger than I am and another is when you're 20 years old, you just can't imagine what a rolling hangover actually feels like.

Yeah when I was in my mid 20s and my training partners and coaches were in their late 30s to mid 40s and would complain about aches and pains I couldn't comprehend wtf they were going on about. Liked dude just suck it up and fucking train.

 

Now that I'm almost 40 I get it, and I'm not looking forward to the next 15 years of training. Everything fucking hurts, all the fucking time.

I have a friend who's a high caliber sports physician and he told me the only way to continue training the way I want to, or used to, is to make sure I have good levels of test and other shit flowing in my system, or I can accept that my body is breaking down and I'm getting old. 

25 days ago
2/27/08
Posts: 1749
misterw - 
Red Stuff - If you're getting rolling hangovers why not just roll lighter? Concede position more often, tap more often etc.

That strategy works at every other colour of belt.

That helps, but it's not quite that easy.  Large people rolling with intensity can still mash on you with their weight, yank on subs they don't have, even if you are conceding position.  


Of course it can.


But a black belt can mitigate that easier than some new guy of the same age who will face the same large, intense, mashing rolling partners.
25 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 13764

Forces applied to joints and muscles still cause stress and inflamation. Building muscle helps like a protective layer and holds things together....but that takes effort, strees.and wear&tear too. But at least you can control the movemnts when strength workouts unlike in sparrung. Probably, m9st of us are walking around with arthritis.

 

There are tricks to help deal with pressure in training, but no5hing can help with explosive movements, either yours or your partners, or impacts. I can protect my neck most 9f the time sparring, I can do nothijg about the shock of ukemi tranfered thriugh my bones. I can protect my shoukder mostly grappling,  but I cant hold my arms up for long or take a lot of impact punching. I have a crazy tourettes-hip.....it causes spasms and I collapse in heap with swearing. Sometimes when Im just sitting and the joint is starting to relax.or.unhinge itself after some kind of load. Its actually funny to see.

 

The onky thing that really helped a lot forn inflamation in the past.....methylprednisolone and cortisone. I feel like like a damn 20y.o. wi5h a tapered dose and shot! Something that makes a significant difference, but not as drastic....keto. I now feel like a 50y.o., maybe 48 :p

 

24 days ago
2/1/08
Posts: 1642
Red Stuff -
misterw - 
Red Stuff - If you're getting rolling hangovers why not just roll lighter? Concede position more often, tap more often etc.

That strategy works at every other colour of belt.

That helps, but it's not quite that easy.  Large people rolling with intensity can still mash on you with their weight, yank on subs they don't have, even if you are conceding position.  


Of course it can.


But a black belt can mitigate that easier than some new guy of the same age who will face the same large, intense, mashing rolling partners.

Easier, yes.  Completely, no.  And then you look at the future and you see that you haver a very finite amount of time to do this thing that you love doing, and you ask yourself whether it is worth shortening that amount of time to roll with a large spazzy bluebelt when they would get just as much benefit at this point out of rolling with a younger upper belt.  

24 days ago
2/20/05
Posts: 443

I am a 36 year old brown belt and i own, operate, and instruct all the classes at my academy. Been training for a bit,  albeit not as long as some of you guys.

I've noticed, since opening my own place, that i cant roll everyday. I really try to and i will at the very least roll 3 to 4 days per week. Some days it's all survival rolling. Some days it's full on.  I teach every class and that adds up to about 25+ hours on the mat each week. 

I can understand not participating here and there but to just stop is out of the question for me. Sure, take some rolls off here and there, skip a round, these are important aspects of being a coac as you need to watch and evaluate the student body.

I've got partial ACL and MCL in both knees and like many of you, the onset of arthritis creeping in on my fingers. Maybe this is the last remaining fibers of my youth talking but, I'll be rolling (to some degree) until noon, the day of my funeral.

24 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 546

LMAO at all the people complaining who aren't even 40 yet. Wait until you get close to 50...

 

I'd give anything to be back in my 30s.

 

Edited: 24 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 8957
liuk3 -

LMAO at all the people complaining who aren't even 40 yet. Wait until you get close to 50...

 

I'd give anything to be back in my 30s.

 

Exactly. When you turn 50 get back to us and let us know how you’re feeling. 
 

 

24 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 8636
HotSteppa - 
AmericanJJ -
misterw -
AmericanJJ -

If your intsrutor is a blue, purple, brown, new or old black belt and doesnt train = Go find a new gym!

I'm in my late 40's and have been training for 25yrs. Black belt for 15yrs. I train 4-6 days a week. And I run an academy. It's my job. 

The intsructor has an obligation to train or get out of the way. This is what causes the whole "sport vs self defense" "old school vs new school" BS. A bunch of lazy dudes that dont train anymore and can't deal with the sport evolving without them need an excuse. Their only hope of saving face is to say either their style of BJJ is more deadly (oldest martial arts trick in the book) or that the "old school" is better. Whatever the hell that means. Anyone who has been training for more than 10yrs consistanct knows that BJJ gets better and better. 

 

A good instructor trains! It doesnt need to be 100% every day, but they sweat. The stay up to date. They are involved. A wall sitter needs to stop teaching and beocome a business owner and a fan.  

 

Find an instructor that isn't lazy. 

So what happens when you get too old to train the way you say you are doing, but still have a lifetime's worth of accumulated knowledge?  

I didn’t say that you need to train like it’s the world championships. I said you need to train. That means be on the mat and sweat, learn, move. He said his instructor doesn’t train at all or barely.  
 

I know 70yr old black belts, guys with long term injuries, hectic lives, etc who train 3-5x week. They are smart. They train to their level and ability. They aren’t using age or injuries as an excuse. They are still grinding. I think OP said his instructor is healthy, not too old and has no limitations. No real excuse. He just doesn’t train = lame. 

A good instructor is also involved in daily training. He runs sparring. He either trains with the class or oversees it. He sets Traning partners and the goal of the sparring. They know the students limitations and goals. He partners or puts people in groups accordingly. You don’t let these issues exist. Again, the killers go with killers, the older guys with older guys, the regular people with eachother, etc. you can’t have Mundial champs 3wks out from a comp forced to train with a 50yr old 9-5 blue belt. It’s not fair for either of them. 
Don’t get me started on “wall sitting” and partner avoidance. 
 

What a silly post. In no other sport, and I've done a few -wrestling, boxing, Judo, soccer, is a coach/instructor exepected to keep training forever. It is really tied to each individual's fitness, goals and genetics. I know someone who is pretty much on morphine due to daily back pain, there is no friggin way he can train now. The problem is that your attitude of "grinding" wrecks bodies. I have learned tons from some BJJers who no longer train due to injuries.

You speak of ideals, but after training since the birth of the UFC and having dropped in to about 50 clubs over my life, I have never seen this mythical grouping of age and skill you speak of. Oh, it's spoken of, and talked about and occasionally done a few times,  but rarely done. In the end, I see 20-35 yr. olds (outside of kids) being the main adult market, going hard against 50 year old, etc. It's a nice ldeal but it rarely happens out of lip service.   

We also talk about all these senior citizens training BJJ, but they are rareties, and generally, but not always, guys that were physically tough to begin with. I have known from what I remember, about 60 guys who started training over the age of 45. And from what I can see only 2, perhaps 3 really train anymore. 

 


EXACTLY....

I'm sorry but many people involved in BJJ have zero good sense. I mean some of you are just plain dumb.

I've never expected my wrestling coach or boxing coach to be a terror on the mat or in the ring. My expectation of my wrestling and boxing coaches was the transmission of their knowledge. That's I only cared about my coaches teaching/coaching ability. I am paying my coaches to instruct/coach me not to prove they still got it as a fighter.
23 days ago
11/13/09
Posts: 3307
misterw -
onyx2002 -
Denis Kelly -
HotSteppa - 
AmericanJJ -
misterw -
AmericanJJ -

If your intsrutor is a blue, purple, brown, new or old black belt and doesnt train = Go find a new gym!

I'm in my late 40's and have been training for 25yrs. Black belt for 15yrs. I train 4-6 days a week. And I run an academy. It's my job. 

The intsructor has an obligation to train or get out of the way. This is what causes the whole "sport vs self defense" "old school vs new school" BS. A bunch of lazy dudes that dont train anymore and can't deal with the sport evolving without them need an excuse. Their only hope of saving face is to say either their style of BJJ is more deadly (oldest martial arts trick in the book) or that the "old school" is better. Whatever the hell that means. Anyone who has been training for more than 10yrs consistanct knows that BJJ gets better and better. 

 

A good instructor trains! It doesnt need to be 100% every day, but they sweat. The stay up to date. They are involved. A wall sitter needs to stop teaching and beocome a business owner and a fan.  

 

Find an instructor that isn't lazy. 

So what happens when you get too old to train the way you say you are doing, but still have a lifetime's worth of accumulated knowledge?  

I didn’t say that you need to train like it’s the world championships. I said you need to train. That means be on the mat and sweat, learn, move. He said his instructor doesn’t train at all or barely.  
 

I know 70yr old black belts, guys with long term injuries, hectic lives, etc who train 3-5x week. They are smart. They train to their level and ability. They aren’t using age or injuries as an excuse. They are still grinding. I think OP said his instructor is healthy, not too old and has no limitations. No real excuse. He just doesn’t train = lame. 

A good instructor is also involved in daily training. He runs sparring. He either trains with the class or oversees it. He sets Traning partners and the goal of the sparring. They know the students limitations and goals. He partners or puts people in groups accordingly. You don’t let these issues exist. Again, the killers go with killers, the older guys with older guys, the regular people with eachother, etc. you can’t have Mundial champs 3wks out from a comp forced to train with a 50yr old 9-5 blue belt. It’s not fair for either of them. 
Don’t get me started on “wall sitting” and partner avoidance. 
 

What a silly post. In no other sport, and I've done a few -wrestling, boxing, Judo, soccer, is a coach/instructor exepected to keep training forever. It is really tied to each individual's fitness, goals and genetics. I know someone who is pretty much on morphine due to daily back pain, there is no friggin way he can train now. The problem is that your attitude of "grinding" wrecks bodies. I have learned tons from some BJJers who no longer train due to injuries.

You speak of ideals, but after training since the birth of the UFC and having dropped in to about 50 clubs over my life, I have never seen this mythical grouping of age and skill you speak of. Oh, it's spoken of, and talked about and occasionally done a few times,  but rarely done. In the end, I see 20-35 yr. olds (outside of kids) being the main adult market, going hard against 50 year old, etc. It's a nice ldeal but it rarely happens out of lip service.   

We also talk about all these senior citizens training BJJ, but they are rareties, and generally, but not always, guys that were physically tough to begin with. I have known from what I remember, about 60 guys who started training over the age of 45. And from what I can see only 2, perhaps 3 really train anymore. 

 


This is true but I think BJJ has usually been seen as a different type of sport to wrestling and boxing. One of the major selling points in getting people in the door and signing up is that BJJ is the gentle art, a sport that you can keep doing for years and years even when you get old. Now admittedly as pointed out earlier in the thread this is usually bullshit and its actually very rare to see older people doing BJJ (or at least rolling) but it is one of the selling points of the sport/martial art and it is also one of the reasons why boxing is $2 per lesson and BJJ is $20 per lesson.

I agree.  I think it will move away from this more and more but BJJ is also different in that you generally get to roll with the best and the brightest right out the gate.  I have no boxing background but I have friends that have travelled to big name boxing gyms and they don't let you 'spar' the stars or the coach on your first day (or anyday really).  I strongly believe part of the magic of BJJ is that you can get safely manhandled on the first day.  Often the coach was the most likely to do that because he was the best and also because the coach can check to see if you are a complete loon.  I think from this grew the image that the coach should pretty much always be the best in the room and therefore should be rolling.  Obviously that is pretty dumb and outdated but the idea persists that the blackbelt in the room should be able to maul anyone at anytime.  Hopefully that notion can hurry and go away.  I don't know of any major sport where the coach is always the resident champion and can beat all-comers

I think it came from Hollywood more than anything.  The martial arts teacher is semi-mystical and can always easily defeat those stronger and younger than him.  We bought into a lot of the nonsense that surrounded TMAs.  

oh yes absolutely!  For me though it was a huge selling point.  I got rolled up by my 145lbs instructor on the first day and I knew it was legit.