David Jacobs' BJJGround Ryan Hall’s Hitler Comments

9/22/20 4:30 PM
12/26/02
Posts: 12187
pbody - 
shen -
All I know is Hitler never gave discounts.

Ryan showing up here and threatening to slap whoever it was that asked for a discount on his DVDs was a top ten moment on the bjj forum. It was made even better when that poster dropped in at Ryan's place and they took a picture of Ryan slapping him. 

All other top ten slots are occupied by Ari Bolden threads.


And the one time that Wallid was FUMING MAD! 

9/22/20 5:56 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52609
twinkletoesCT -
pbody - 
shen -
All I know is Hitler never gave discounts.

Ryan showing up here and threatening to slap whoever it was that asked for a discount on his DVDs was a top ten moment on the bjj forum. It was made even better when that poster dropped in at Ryan's place and they took a picture of Ryan slapping him. 

All other top ten slots are occupied by Ari Bolden threads.


And the one time that Wallid was FUMING MAD! 

How bout Royce vs Damien Riccio/Lil Pepe?

9/23/20 3:19 AM
6/11/06
Posts: 4116
He really didn't say anything bad at all, he was just using Hitler as an example - you guys have become the Cry Babies you are constantly complaining about.

Ryan words

"I don't have to act like there's nothing good a monster has ever done.

"But imagine if the ghost of Adolf Hitler were to pop up and go, 'oh my gosh, guys I'm so sorry, I know what I've done is bad, I would like to apologise and start to make it right'.

"You hope if he popped over here we would go, 'I don't really like what you've done and I don't like you but at the same time I'm glad to hear that you are attempting to make this right and pushing in a positive direction even if you cannot make it right'.

"Otherwise what am I doing? I'm disincentivising change for the better, I'm looking to wield whatever power I have in a punitive fashion.

"That doesn't encourage people to do anything other than double down on the wrongs that they've made, knowing that at least they are going to have some support from the people who support that."

Hall continued: "I understand the urge to seek vengeance is strong.

"If I again further lash out at people, although understandable, I'm simply going to just perpetuate the cycle that's gone on to this point"
9/23/20 5:57 AM
2/15/14
Posts: 975
Fabes -
pbody -
Fabes -

You have to read it. It’s unreal.

Better yet, go watch the 3 and a half hour podcast this was excerpted from (and not linked to in the BE article). The irony here is that in that very segment Hall was talking about how silly it was to take small snippets of what someone says to use against them in an attempt to "cancel" them, because that's what BE is trying to do with that article.

I wonder if they reached out to him to ask him to clarify those remarks before publishing the article. 

I’m not watching 3.5 hours of anyone’s podcast.

Then you're missing out, this one is pretty good

 

 

9/23/20 6:02 AM
2/15/14
Posts: 976
Fabes -
pbody - 
Fabes -

You have to read it. It’s unreal.

Better yet, go watch the 3 and a half hour podcast this was excerpted from (and not linked to in the BE article). The irony here is that in that very segment Hall was talking about how silly it was to take small snippets of what someone says to use against them in an attempt to "cancel" them, because that's what BE is trying to do with that article.

I wonder if they reached out to him to ask him to clarify those remarks before publishing the article. 


When you start talking about the ghost of Hitler, I'm not sure there's really going to be a need for clarifying comments. Maybe Ryan should stick to bjj and MMA in his next interviews and try to avoid praising Hitler. That's all. 

He did not praise Hitler. He used Hitler as an example and measuring stick of someone who has done some very bad and unforgivable things. With the topic thye were discussing, it was appropriate. Would you rather he'd have used someone like the Pope, a nun, or Helen Keller as an example instead of Hitler? It wouldve made no sense if he used someone not evil as an example in their conversation 

9/23/20 8:14 AM
1/1/01
Posts: 52611

Mmhmm 

lol

crybabies 

I like Ryan, but what he said was dumb. If you love the guy and worship him, that’s cool but even his own guys admit what he said was fucking stupid. 
 

9/23/20 8:17 AM
1/1/01
Posts: 3996

I've done very bad things too. Sometimes I go 80 on the highway. Still feel like hitters bad things were worse. Socialists always seem to wind up killing lots of people eventually

9/23/20 9:23 AM
3/15/15
Posts: 13777
I agree wioth his sentiment because it is factually correct. People who do really bad things often influence or do really good things in other contexts. While this is factual and can be demonstrated, the point he is missing is that sometimes the bad stuff (in this case slaughter of millions) negates any "good" influence that might be present.

The other thing that needs to be dicussed is context and how sometimes these atrociities are overlooked or minimized depending on one's political views and the promotion of these ideas in popular thought. This is how and why univeristy students can rationalize wearing Mao shirts despite hjim having killed more people that Hitler. People are irrational.
9/23/20 11:27 AM
3/28/02
Posts: 9152
OUTCOLD - He really didn't say anything bad at all, he was just using Hitler as an example - you guys have become the Cry Babies you are constantly complaining about.

Ryan words

"I don't have to act like there's nothing good a monster has ever done.

"But imagine if the ghost of Adolf Hitler were to pop up and go, 'oh my gosh, guys I'm so sorry, I know what I've done is bad, I would like to apologise and start to make it right'.

"You hope if he popped over here we would go, 'I don't really like what you've done and I don't like you but at the same time I'm glad to hear that you are attempting to make this right and pushing in a positive direction even if you cannot make it right'.

"Otherwise what am I doing? I'm disincentivising change for the better, I'm looking to wield whatever power I have in a punitive fashion.

"That doesn't encourage people to do anything other than double down on the wrongs that they've made, knowing that at least they are going to have some support from the people who support that."

Hall continued: "I understand the urge to seek vengeance is strong.

"If I again further lash out at people, although understandable, I'm simply going to just perpetuate the cycle that's gone on to this point"

it takes a very sensitive person to be offended by these words

9/23/20 2:27 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52613
HotSteppa - I agree wioth his sentiment because it is factually correct. People who do really bad things often influence or do really good things in other contexts. While this is factual and can be demonstrated, the point he is missing is that sometimes the bad stuff (in this case slaughter of millions) negates any "good" influence that might be present.

The other thing that needs to be dicussed is context and how sometimes these atrociities are overlooked or minimized depending on one's political views and the promotion of these ideas in popular thought. This is how and why univeristy students can rationalize wearing Mao shirts despite hjim having killed more people that Hitler. People are irrational.

I think I understand what you're saying (but someone much smarter than me called me dumb earlier in the thread, so I could be wrong).

However, I do actually feel that slaughtering millions of people does in fact negate all good influence any person may have done. If Hitler had found the cure for cancer or saved the world from an alien invasion, we could re-visit this. But the mean wanted to murder an entire population, take control of the world and enslave millions of people. There was no good that came from him.

And as far as calling people sensitive. It's fucking Hitler. I feel like if people are sensitive about Hitler, that's ok. BECAUSE IT'S FUCKING HITLER. 

9/23/20 5:00 PM
2/15/14
Posts: 977
Fabes -
HotSteppa - I agree wioth his sentiment because it is factually correct. People who do really bad things often influence or do really good things in other contexts. While this is factual and can be demonstrated, the point he is missing is that sometimes the bad stuff (in this case slaughter of millions) negates any "good" influence that might be present.

The other thing that needs to be dicussed is context and how sometimes these atrociities are overlooked or minimized depending on one's political views and the promotion of these ideas in popular thought. This is how and why univeristy students can rationalize wearing Mao shirts despite hjim having killed more people that Hitler. People are irrational.

I think I understand what you're saying (but someone much smarter than me called me dumb earlier in the thread, so I could be wrong).

However, I do actually feel that slaughtering millions of people does in fact negate all good influence any person may have done. If Hitler had found the cure for cancer or saved the world from an alien invasion, we could re-visit this. But the mean wanted to murder an entire population, take control of the world and enslave millions of people. There was no good that came from him.

And as far as calling people sensitive. It's fucking Hitler. I feel like if people are sensitive about Hitler, that's ok. BECAUSE IT'S FUCKING HITLER. 

I'm no fan of Hitler but the way Ryan used him in the context of the conversation is not something he needs to apologize for

I am not saying Hitler was good, but he was popular with the people and made some good reforms  and policies that helped his people. He did some good acts, which was what led him to power 

9/24/20 1:25 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52617

Yeah, he didn’t do any good acts. He forced ans brainwashed his people to commit a genocide.

i’m not asking Ryan to apologize.

Just saying what he said was really fucking stupid.

9/24/20 1:26 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52618

And you sound like a fan of Hitler to me, but to each their own!

9/24/20 2:48 PM
5/15/09
Posts: 6106
Fabes -

Yeah, he didn’t do any good acts. He forced ans brainwashed his people to commit a genocide.

i’m not asking Ryan to apologize.

Just saying what he said was really fucking stupid.

No you aren't. What you are actually doing is purposefully trolling or going out of your way to mischaracterize what was said, so you can call it "really fucking stupid" and pat yourself on the back. Either way, you should get a more productive hobby.

Edited: 9/24/20 3:20 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52620
kennyfrommd - 
Fabes -

Yeah, he didn’t do any good acts. He forced ans brainwashed his people to commit a genocide.

i’m not asking Ryan to apologize.

Just saying what he said was really fucking stupid.

No you aren't. What you are actually doing is purposefully trolling or going out of your way to mischaracterize what was said, so you can call it "really fucking stupid" and pat yourself on the back. Either way, you should get a more productive hobby.

 

The guy who is MUCH smarter than me is back. 

 

I don't think you understand what trolling is. And for someone with an IQ that must be at least double what mine is, that is most surprising. I'm curious Mensa Kenny, are you saying that I am asking Ryan to apologize? Are you saying Hitler did some great things?

I know that you work for Ryan. I know that you owe an allegiance to him and therefore will support him. I respect that. You were that way with Balance too, right? 

I'll reiterate (even though you're so smart...way smarter than me cuz I is a dumb).

I don't care if Ryan apologizes. I don't think he's an anti-semite. I don't think he is a fan of Hitler. What he said was fucking stupid. To defend talking about Hitler the way he did (and yes, I did listen to some of the podcast which actually made it worse) is fucking idiotic. You can argue until you are green in the face. But I've said my piece. And remember, I'm really unintelligent. You're infinitely smarter than me, so maybe I just can't grasp your incredibly brilliant debating skills. Mmmmkay?

9/24/20 3:41 PM
5/30/03
Posts: 42949

BE tried to get Gordon Ryan cancelled from ADCC for his viewpoints on the poor and Renzo for his critique of antifa.  

9/24/20 3:45 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52623
The Maestro - 

BE tried to get Gordon Ryan cancelled from ADCC for his viewpoints on the poor and Renzo for his critique of antifa.  


Gordon and Renzo have also said some really dumb shit, but they have the right to do it. And while what Ryan said was dumb, I don't want him punished in any way. I still like him. I still love watching him compete. We have common friends that are close to us both. 

9/24/20 4:10 PM
2/15/14
Posts: 978
Fabes -
The Maestro - 

BE tried to get Gordon Ryan cancelled from ADCC for his viewpoints on the poor and Renzo for his critique of antifa.  


Gordon and Renzo have also said some really dumb shit, but they have the right to do it. And while what Ryan said was dumb, I don't want him punished in any way. I still like him. I still love watching him compete. We have common friends that are close to us both. 

How was Ryan's comments dumb? He made a statement that was not wrong

9/24/20 4:24 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52624

I don’t know what Gordon said.

For all other well thought out questions, see all answers above (multiple times).

9/24/20 4:31 PM
5/15/09
Posts: 6107
Fabes -
kennyfrommd - 
Fabes -

Yeah, he didn’t do any good acts. He forced ans brainwashed his people to commit a genocide.

i’m not asking Ryan to apologize.

Just saying what he said was really fucking stupid.

No you aren't. What you are actually doing is purposefully trolling or going out of your way to mischaracterize what was said, so you can call it "really fucking stupid" and pat yourself on the back. Either way, you should get a more productive hobby.

 

The guy who is MUCH smarter than me is back. 

 

I don't think you understand what trolling is. And for someone with an IQ that must be at least double what mine is, that is most surprising. I'm curious Mensa Kenny, are you saying that I am asking Ryan to apologize? Are you saying Hitler did some great things?

I know that you work for Ryan. I know that you owe an allegiance to him and therefore will support him. I respect that. You were that way with Balance too, right? 

I'll reiterate (even though you're so smart...way smarter than me cuz I is a dumb).

I don't care if Ryan apologizes. I don't think he's an anti-semite. I don't think he is a fan of Hitler. What he said was fucking stupid. To defend talking about Hitler the way he did (and yes, I did listen to some of the podcast which actually made it worse) is fucking idiotic. You can argue until you are green in the face. But I've said my piece. And remember, I'm really unintelligent. You're infinitely smarter than me, so maybe I just can't grasp your incredibly brilliant debating skills. Mmmmkay?

I get that hiding behind a veil of snark makes you somehow feel more enlightened, but would you mind pointing out where I said that you are asking for Ryan to apologize, implied or otherwise? Where did that even come from? When I use phrases like "breathtakingly dumb", these are the kind of mental leaps I am referencing. 

Infinitely smarter may be a bit of a stretch. Some people are good at different things and I really believe there are many measures of intelligence. For example, I have (and always have had) trouble with basic algebra. Some might think I am a real dumb dumb for my mathematical inepitude, but hey- maybe they don't have the handle on Fitzgerald's concept of romantic egoism that I do. Just because you can't track the analogy, or rather prefer to frame it as something it's not, doesn't mean you don't paint beautiful pictures of horses, or balance chemistry equations with the best of them. I'm sure you are plenty smart in your own way, so don't get so down on yourself.

Xoxo 

9/24/20 4:46 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52625

I accept your apology. Thank you Kenny. I can help you with Algebra if you ever need also. By the way, 50/50 is a great school. I’ve trained with Seph, Ryan, Val and a ton of great folks there. All positive experiences.

9/24/20 4:51 PM
5/15/09
Posts: 6108
Fabes -

I accept your apology. Thank you Kenny. I can help you with Algebra if you ever need also. By the way, 50/50 is a great school. I’ve trained with Seph, Ryan, Val and a ton of great folks there. All positive experiences.

Much appreciated, and glad to hear that your experiences have been positive. We'd be happy to have you stop by anytime.

9/24/20 4:56 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52626

I appreciate that Kenny. I don’t want to argue with you. We can just agree to disagree.

I retired due to multiple shoulder injuries but Val is a dear friend and I stopped by for one of her seminars a few years ago. And when she went to Rock’s, I brought my kiddo. Man I miss that guy. 
 

Best you and the gym.

9/24/20 9:52 PM
7/14/08
Posts: 25448

No one should ever talk about Hitler. He should be like Voldemort. Oh crap, I wrote Voldemort! The death eaters will get me! 

9/24/20 10:47 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 52628
MickColins -

No one should ever talk about Hitler. He should be like Voldemort. Oh crap, I wrote Voldemort! The death eaters will get me! 

Dammit. I thought we wrapped this up. Dammit all to hell!