David Jacobs' BJJGround the trends over the years

17 days ago
12/26/02
Posts: 12200

As a group, can we define the ways that the sport BJJ game has changed since its explosion in the 90s? 

Surely, some folks here have their finger on the pulse far better than I.

I'm thinking about things like: in the late 00's we saw more tornado rolling, which became a trend of inverted guard playing, which also produced a trend of using the 50/50 position and the inverted heel hook. A contributing factor to the use of 50/50 was the "no leg reaping rule" by IBJJF, which meant that to control a leg, the position had to be from the inside out. 

What trends stand out in your mind?  Do you remember when it happened and how we got there? 

17 days ago
11/10/05
Posts: 7492
I think I have questions or ideas more than opinions..
Comprido's an influence on the footlocks?

when do you think guard pulling became a thing? and why IBJJF rule change on this? I think it's interesting that we gained wrestlers and guard pulling became more popular.

I think the guard pulling is prob related to the rise in popularity of the standing pass.

lapel stuff.. was always in chokes, but it's really become embedded in the guard work itself?

capturing the arm with your legs when in back control?
Was this always a thing?
I'm guessing that this really got popularized well before DDS. I think the trend really started with BJ Penn instructing Joe Lauzon during TUF if it wasn't somewhat popular before that.

Marcelo vs Shaolin... backpack. (I think we could name a few things with MG)








17 days ago
5/11/08
Posts: 2834
Meatgrinder - I think I have questions or ideas more than opinions..
Comprido's an influence on the footlocks?

when do you think guard pulling became a thing? and why IBJJF rule change on this? I think it's interesting that we gained wrestlers and guard pulling became more popular.

I think the guard pulling is prob related to the rise in popularity of the standing pass.

lapel stuff.. was always in chokes, but it's really become embedded in the guard work itself?

capturing the arm with your legs when in back control?
Was this always a thing?
I'm guessing that this really got popularized well before DDS. I think the trend really started with BJ Penn instructing Joe Lauzon during TUF if it wasn't somewhat popular before that.

Marcelo vs Shaolin... backpack. (I think we could name a few things with MG)








In the old school bjj matches thread you can see Bustamante pulling guard multiple times in matches from the 90's. I think it's been a thing for a lot longer than we realize. 

Marcelo was big on trapping the arm from back control too. 

Inverting is basically just a granby roll. I wonder if wrestlers had an impact in adding this to bjj.

I think things like half guard and butterfly guard eventually led to standing passes, which eventually led to the more exotic open guards and berimbolos. Probably the TT guys were most impactful in terms of passing standing. Terere was incredible. 

I can still remember discussions about half guard and x-guard not being applicable to mma and that they'd get you smashed in a fight. 

Deep half was a big thing 12-13 years ago. 

Single leg x a few years later when people started figuring out what marcelo was doing. 

Darce chokes about 15 years ago. 

Again, in terms of open guard I'd say Margarida was very influencial with his colar sleeve stuff. 

The mendes Bros were very influential as well. 10-12 years ago are when things like the leg drags became popular. Their of de la riva was also different. Now just about everyone plays that way. 

Lapel play had been around for a while. I remember cyborg showing lapel sweeps on his old dvd set. I'd say they didn't really become popular until Keenan came along. 

Random thoughts.

 

17 days ago
9/7/17
Posts: 678
I can think of some things from when I started in the 00's.

- Marcelo Garcia style seated wrestling using arm drags to the back. The seatbelt grip in particular from the back and leg trapping the arms before the choke. Marcelo's X-guard.

- Increase in half guard and half guard variations in no-gi. More underhooks and wrestling up instead of just classic reguarding. Jeff Glover and Paragon guys playing deep half guard.

- Spider guard play from Romulo Barral and Cobrinha.

- Darce choke explosion to deal with more of the underhook threats from top half, top side, and from the front headlock position. Lapel brabo chokes in the gi more or less correspond with the darce timeline.

- Terere guard passing away from the legs and towards the back.

- Late 00's and early 10's Caio Terra, Cobrinha, Mendes Bros and early Atos Delariva renaissance and reverse Delariva. Outside and inside berimbolo spins to take the back. Rolling kimuras to take the back and rolling guillotine/darce/anaconda chokes. Leg drag passing that built more heavily on what Terere had been doing.

- Berimbolo berimbolo berimbolo in the early 2010's. Probably the first technique to really explode on a massive level during the youtube/internet era.

- Late 00's Marcelo Garcia developments like high elbow guillotine, north south choke, crucifix (Baret Yoshida too), and refined omoplata.

- More lapel guards by Braulio Estima and early worm guard by Keenan.

- Active posting from Leandro Lo's guard passing

- Heel hook renaissance from the DDS, Craig Jones, and Lachlan Giles.

- Refinining of getting the rear naked choke by the DDS and linking together leg locks, back attacks, front headlock, kimura, and triangle systems.

- More lapel guard refinement from Keenan in the late 10's.
17 days ago
7/30/03
Posts: 9271

In

 

This is a great thread

17 days ago
9/7/17
Posts: 680
Calhoon - 

In

 

This is a great thread


Two recent things came to mind that have the potential to become trendy.

- Braulio Estima and Robert Drysdale have all been saying how underused the wrestling cradle is for passing. They both even have cradle instructionals. It hasn't fully caught on but I've seen John Danaher and Garry Tonon teaching cradle entries into the 4-11/cross ashi and the D'arce choke on their dvds but I've never seen them show it for a guard passing position.

- The Ruotolo Twins leg pinning/foot stomp passing. Tye Ruotolo went far in ADCC with it and used it this year to really shut down the great guard of Nicky Ryan and pass him multiple times. It's a great passing system for dealing with leg lock players and I think it's got the potential to get trendy.

The Mendes Bros have been putting some no-gi drilling/rolling footage out recently working various arm triangles (Rafa), as well as heel hooks and countering heel hooks (Gui). It made me wish they weren't retired to see what innovations they could make in the current climate.
17 days ago
8/28/10
Posts: 14010
Calhoon -

In

 

This is a great thread

Agreed

17 days ago
4/30/06
Posts: 402

remember when Bravo subbed Royler? there was the massive Rubber Guard phase

16 days ago
12/26/02
Posts: 12201
Rodney Ellis - 

remember when Bravo subbed Royler? there was the massive Rubber Guard phase


and also Eddie's half guard.  This was followed by a big Brabo/D'Arce & Anaconda phase, because of the emphasis on always taking the underhook and getting on your side.

I was trying to remember how this matched up time-wise against Robson Moura and his gi & no-gi versions of Cross guard. I think that was shortly afterwards. 

16 days ago
11/11/11
Posts: 26256

I could be wrong here but I feel like jean Jacque made butterfly guard cool

16 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 19274

Trends I looked in to just cause of Marcelo:

Butterfly, X-Guard, Single leg X, Arm-Drags, Guillotines, North South Chokes.

16 days ago
7/30/03
Posts: 9274
twinkletoesCT -
Rodney Ellis - 

remember when Bravo subbed Royler? there was the massive Rubber Guard phase


and also Eddie's half guard.  This was followed by a big Brabo/D'Arce & Anaconda phase, because of the emphasis on always taking the underhook and getting on your side.

I was trying to remember how this matched up time-wise against Robson Moura and his gi & no-gi versions of Cross guard. I think that was shortly afterwards. 

Do you mean knee shield half guard? He was big on knee shield half and one of the first I remember to use it. 

 

Cross guard was when you take a cross grip on your opponents sleeve. I imagine cross guard would be a pretty tough guard to play in nogi. 

16 days ago
9/7/17
Posts: 686
Calhoon - 
twinkletoesCT -
Rodney Ellis - 

remember when Bravo subbed Royler? there was the massive Rubber Guard phase


and also Eddie's half guard.  This was followed by a big Brabo/D'Arce & Anaconda phase, because of the emphasis on always taking the underhook and getting on your side.

I was trying to remember how this matched up time-wise against Robson Moura and his gi & no-gi versions of Cross guard. I think that was shortly afterwards. 

Do you mean knee shield half guard? He was big on knee shield half and one of the first I remember to use it. 

 

Cross guard was when you take a cross grip on your opponents sleeve. I imagine cross guard would be a pretty tough guard to play in nogi. 


I'm guessing it's the knee shield. I think Robson used to call it the 93 guard. I always got 93 guard, knee shield, and Z guard confused as to whether they were all the same thing or of there were slight differences. I'm still not entirely sure.
16 days ago
9/7/17
Posts: 687
TheBearStare - 

I could be wrong here but I feel like jean Jacque made butterfly guard cool


He definitely made it cool. I think the whole deal of him having to play overhooks and underhooks and learn to butterfly sweep without grips made it very cool. I also called him the Marcelo before Marcelo because he was the 1st person I know of at ADCC to submit the majority of his opponents and have a "submission grappling" oriented style more so than just doing "BJJ without a gi."

Jean Jacques did a lot of people's favorite no-gi moves first. he has some old books and there's so much modern day stuff in all of them.
16 days ago
9/7/17
Posts: 688
twinkletoesCT - 
Rodney Ellis - 

remember when Bravo subbed Royler? there was the massive Rubber Guard phase


and also Eddie's half guard.  This was followed by a big Brabo/D'Arce & Anaconda phase, because of the emphasis on always taking the underhook and getting on your side.

I was trying to remember how this matched up time-wise against Robson Moura and his gi & no-gi versions of Cross guard. I think that was shortly afterwards. 


Definitely. And I just thought about it and I wonder if the reverse De L Riva came about partially to make the brabo/darce/anaconda/guillotine game more difficult? I know it's known for making the knee slice pass more difficult too. But with guard player's frames on the passer's far shoulder and the top foot posted on their hip or near shoulder, it makes it much harder for them to head and arm choke you unless they make a bigger commitment to roll through for your neck or dive onto it.
Edited: 16 days ago
8/20/16
Posts: 816

When I started BJJ, you would never let someone get a lasso guard on your arm because you were going to get bicep sliced. Now that's not a concern. To me that is a huge change, very similar to the no-reaping rule.

Guard jumping became guard pulling became butt scooting. The darce and the loop choke became super popular. Frames became the most important concept in defense. Getting underneath people became a huge concept in offense.

The paper cutter and baseball chokes basically disappeared. When I started the most popular choke from mount, knee on belly or standing was to take uncrossed grips on their collar and then spin yourself in order to cross your arms and get the choke. Anyone know what this choke is called?

You're no longer allowed to mash their face for control or submisions. No more rape choke, which used to be my favourite no-gi guard pass. No one does Amassa Pao any more.

The half guad game used to just be lifting them over your head with your arms/legs, but now it's an entire system. The knee slice became the most popular way to go through someone's guard, though I still prefer the same side knee slide stack passes. Actually, stack passes in general were basically replaced by running around the guard or x-passes.

Standing guard breaks took over, now you're told never to break guard on your knees. The wisdom back then was to never stand up in someone's closed guard, something Mario Sperry even says in his Vale Tudo series.

Giving up your back used to be the worst thing in the world. Thanks to Sakuraba and Eduardo Telles, it's now no big deal. (Also removing strikes to the back of the head probably had a lot to do with that. I think removing strikes is responsible for most of the changes in BJJ tbh.)

Wrestling off your butt in seated guards became the thing to do. The lying-on-your-back open guard is pretty much dead, but I still use it and regularly hit balloon sweeps on really good black belts who are not amused.

Z-guard / knee shield became a thing. I still remember the first time I was taught it, around 2004, and we had no idea what to do with it other than you could clamp your knees on their hip and keep them away. It was like an annoying half guard.

16 days ago
8/20/16
Posts: 817

Kimura became an entire control system. Scissor sweeps are dead, but scissor guard is coming in.

16 days ago
12/26/02
Posts: 12203
mata_leaos - 
Calhoon - 
twinkletoesCT -
Rodney Ellis - 

remember when Bravo subbed Royler? there was the massive Rubber Guard phase


and also Eddie's half guard.  This was followed by a big Brabo/D'Arce & Anaconda phase, because of the emphasis on always taking the underhook and getting on your side.

I was trying to remember how this matched up time-wise against Robson Moura and his gi & no-gi versions of Cross guard. I think that was shortly afterwards. 

Do you mean knee shield half guard? He was big on knee shield half and one of the first I remember to use it. 

 

Cross guard was when you take a cross grip on your opponents sleeve. I imagine cross guard would be a pretty tough guard to play in nogi. 


I'm guessing it's the knee shield. I think Robson used to call it the 93 guard. I always got 93 guard, knee shield, and Z guard confused as to whether they were all the same thing or of there were slight differences. I'm still not entirely sure.

No, both. He also did knee shield.

His gi cross guard was pretty standard.  His no gi version was that he hugged around the thigh with both arms and stuck the edge of the foot in his partner's armpit. It was kinda wacky but if you were good at the gi version you could make it work (was never my cup of tea but i had a blue belt who loved his game and tried all this).

16 days ago
12/26/02
Posts: 12204

I know this is a gi pic, but this is the leg hug.  Robson was doing a thing like this, but both arms hugging the thigh (and sole of the foot in the armpit).  It was a brief trend. 

16 days ago
9/7/17
Posts: 690
twinkletoesCT - 
mata_leaos - 
Calhoon - 
twinkletoesCT -
Rodney Ellis - 

remember when Bravo subbed Royler? there was the massive Rubber Guard phase


and also Eddie's half guard.  This was followed by a big Brabo/D'Arce & Anaconda phase, because of the emphasis on always taking the underhook and getting on your side.

I was trying to remember how this matched up time-wise against Robson Moura and his gi & no-gi versions of Cross guard. I think that was shortly afterwards. 

Do you mean knee shield half guard? He was big on knee shield half and one of the first I remember to use it. 

 

Cross guard was when you take a cross grip on your opponents sleeve. I imagine cross guard would be a pretty tough guard to play in nogi. 


I'm guessing it's the knee shield. I think Robson used to call it the 93 guard. I always got 93 guard, knee shield, and Z guard confused as to whether they were all the same thing or of there were slight differences. I'm still not entirely sure.

No, both. He also did knee shield.

His gi cross guard was pretty standard.  His no gi version was that he hugged around the thigh with both arms and stuck the edge of the foot in his partner's armpit. It was kinda wacky but if you were good at the gi version you could make it work (was never my cup of tea but i had a blue belt who loved his game and tried all this).


Thanks for clearing this up for me!
16 days ago
7/30/03
Posts: 9277
twinkletoesCT -

I know this is a gi pic, but this is the leg hug.  Robson was doing a thing like this, but both arms hugging the thigh (and sole of the foot in the armpit).  It was a brief trend. 

Aka, K-guard in modern jiu-jitsu.

 

I never made the connection to cross guard before. 

16 days ago
12/26/02
Posts: 12205
Calhoon - 
twinkletoesCT -

I know this is a gi pic, but this is the leg hug.  Robson was doing a thing like this, but both arms hugging the thigh (and sole of the foot in the armpit).  It was a brief trend. 

Aka, K-guard in modern jiu-jitsu.

 

I never made the connection to cross guard before. 


I don't know the term. Does the "K" imply that the two legs are creating a shape that stops him from circling?

By contrast, IIRC Robson's no-gi cross guard was still a lot of "throwing the free leg to back roll into a sweep" and then hitting omoplata when/if he resists.  Kneebars in there too.  

Ahh, the olden times. lol

16 days ago
5/11/08
Posts: 2840
twinkletoesCT -
Calhoon - 
twinkletoesCT -

I know this is a gi pic, but this is the leg hug.  Robson was doing a thing like this, but both arms hugging the thigh (and sole of the foot in the armpit).  It was a brief trend. 

Aka, K-guard in modern jiu-jitsu.

 

I never made the connection to cross guard before. 


I don't know the term. Does the "K" imply that the two legs are creating a shape that stops him from circling?

By contrast, IIRC Robson's no-gi cross guard was still a lot of "throwing the free leg to back roll into a sweep" and then hitting omoplata when/if he resists.  Kneebars in there too.  

Ahh, the olden times. lol

Yeah, I recall Pe De Pano also had a cross guard instructional back in the day as well. 

15 days ago
7/30/03
Posts: 9279
twinkletoesCT -
Calhoon - 
twinkletoesCT -

I know this is a gi pic, but this is the leg hug.  Robson was doing a thing like this, but both arms hugging the thigh (and sole of the foot in the armpit).  It was a brief trend. 

Aka, K-guard in modern jiu-jitsu.

 

I never made the connection to cross guard before. 


I don't know the term. Does the "K" imply that the two legs are creating a shape that stops him from circling?

By contrast, IIRC Robson's no-gi cross guard was still a lot of "throwing the free leg to back roll into a sweep" and then hitting omoplata when/if he resists.  Kneebars in there too.  

Ahh, the olden times. lol

What you described is the cross guard I remember. I wasn't aware it was used in nogi also. 

 

K-guard is a similar position with a variety of attacks. As far as I know K-guard was named by Niel Melanson and he says he named it after Karo Perisyan because he used the position a lot. 

15 days ago
9/7/17
Posts: 697
twinkletoesCT - 
Calhoon - 
twinkletoesCT -

I know this is a gi pic, but this is the leg hug.  Robson was doing a thing like this, but both arms hugging the thigh (and sole of the foot in the armpit).  It was a brief trend. 

Aka, K-guard in modern jiu-jitsu.

 

I never made the connection to cross guard before. 


I don't know the term. Does the "K" imply that the two legs are creating a shape that stops him from circling?

By contrast, IIRC Robson's no-gi cross guard was still a lot of "throwing the free leg to back roll into a sweep" and then hitting omoplata when/if he resists.  Kneebars in there too.  

Ahh, the olden times. lol


If you look at K guard when the knee is on the floor and the foot is right above their hip it kind of does look like the letter K. I think that's where the name is from. It's actually not a super new guard. I first heard the term from Neil Melanson and a guard position that he and Karo Parisyan used to launch triangles from.

I saw it referenced years later from Eddie Cummings after he broke down his win over Nate Orchard and I didn't hear the term again until Lachlan Giles popularized it after last year's ADCC. And Lachlan said he got most of his inspiration for the position from the Miyao Twins using it frequently to enter 50/50.