Train Judo Ground JUDO banned all leg holding...why?

6/26/18 1:12 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 6369

Well that would be nice but not on their watch.

6/28/18 5:29 PM
5/20/18
Posts: 17

I would love to see the statistics on ippons pre and post leg hold ban...

Judo becomes even less valuable as a martial art...

like I said just create a "greco" divison, dont change an ancient art for a hope at gaining popularity.

somebody psot some ippon stats.

hudge advantage for taller athletes!!!

7/29/18 5:23 PM
5/20/18
Posts: 19

Ban the IJF, bring back real judo.

 

I feel sorry for the kids that are gonna get POUNDED when they try to take that style ANYWHERE else. 

JUDO/BJJ...ALMOST evicted from MMA at this point.

wrestling and muay thai have taken over!!

 

Edited: 8/6/18 2:05 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 6403

Evicted. I don't know about that. There are so many guys doing MMA that sometimes it seems watered down as well.

Edited: 8/1/18 3:35 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 4353
Weird how literally all submissions are banned from wrestling, yet people get on judo's effectiveness in a fight or mma for the stupid leg-banning rule.
 
As far as judo is concerned.. if your seoi-nage, uchi mata and harai goshi sucked before the leg rule, they're still going to suck now.  Stupid rule yes, but it's mostly used as an excuse from people who don't train judo to shit on it as if somehow 95% of it is still the same as it was before.
8/3/18 7:14 PM
5/20/18
Posts: 22

well, I would like to hear some numbers

 

i dont think its good for the long term 

 

so simple math...have "big ippons" become more common?

8/4/18 5:08 PM
5/13/05
Posts: 4383
SlapUsilly -
Weird how literally all submissions are banned from wrestling, yet people get on judo's effectiveness in a fight or mma for the stupid leg-banning rule.
 
As far as judo is concerned.. if your seoi-nage, uchi mata and harai goshi sucked before the leg rule, they're still going to suck now.  Stupid rule yes, but it's mostly used as an excuse from people who don't train judo to shit on it as if somehow 95% of it is still the same as it was before.

Wrestling translates better to MMA than Judo because the takedowns are more practical without a gi. Also, most people in MMA are going to train bjj or submission grappling for their submission skills rather than just judo. I know people involved with Judo for close to 40 years who think the leg grab rule is dumb.

8/7/18 3:52 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 4356
cyberc92 - 
SlapUsilly -
Weird how literally all submissions are banned from wrestling, yet people get on judo's effectiveness in a fight or mma for the stupid leg-banning rule.
 
As far as judo is concerned.. if your seoi-nage, uchi mata and harai goshi sucked before the leg rule, they're still going to suck now.  Stupid rule yes, but it's mostly used as an excuse from people who don't train judo to shit on it as if somehow 95% of it is still the same as it was before.

Wrestling translates better to MMA than Judo because the takedowns are more practical without a gi. Also, most people in MMA are going to train bjj or submission grappling for their submission skills rather than just judo. I know people involved with Judo for close to 40 years who think the leg grab rule is dumb.


The early UFCs already demonstrated wrestling's big holes when it came to submissions.  Pure Judo guys like Pardoel and Leninger fared slightly better than the wrestlers because of that. It's no secret.
 
For MMA these days, wrestlers of course, have a quick transition when compared to judo because of what you say about the takedowns being easier to transfer right away and because of scrambling. And both judokas and wrestlers can train bjj or submissions to better their game. 
 
I know one other person, myself, that have been doing judo 10+ years and I think the leg grab rule is dumb.  No denying it.  That's not even an argument.    Still, none of this negates the fact, and what my argument really is, that as a whole, Judo is not affected too much by the leg grab rule.  
 
 
8/11/18 9:03 AM
9/26/07
Posts: 638

On a related note what was the original reasoning for Greco roman not allowing leg attacks? Has there always just been view that leg tackles were too easy or untechnical? I actually have the Ippon pickups book and the author mentions that not many competitors practiced or at least uchikomi'd leg attacks even when they were legal.

8/13/18 1:05 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 6419

The big thing in Judo is the GI. It neutralizes everyone........Most of the no GI guys in our club don't do Judo. It's too technical and takes a long time to get good at. MMA doesn't have that facet to it so I can see why wrestlers can transfer skills easy.

9/10/18 1:56 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 40
cyberc92 -

This is what happens as martial arts begin to turn to sport.

True, totally agree, but it is also a good arena to test the practicality of techniques.

9/29/18 11:46 AM
5/20/18
Posts: 25
Denis Kelly -

On a related note what was the original reasoning for Greco roman not allowing leg attacks? Has there always just been view that leg tackles were too easy or untechnical? I actually have the Ippon pickups book and the author mentions that not many competitors practiced or at least uchikomi'd leg attacks even when they were legal.

its all about the beauty of big throws. No leg holds [theoretically] allows more big throws.

 

thats the debate, does it??

Edited: 1/3/19 2:15 PM
12/1/18
Posts: 9
they keep "fiddling" with the rules trying to make the sport more exciting, just look at folstyle wrestling!
instead of joining the rest of the world in free and greco the usa invented their own set of rules that keep changing every year and just plain ruin the sport!
Edited: 1/11/19 1:18 PM
12/1/18
Posts: 34

So has this new rule made high 

amplitude throws occur more, less or unchanged in statistics.

 

The fallacy in theory is that if athletes dont have to worry about leg grabs they can concentrate on big throws....

however its eaiser to defend a big throw than initiate one sooo all they have to do is defend and counter the throw attempt with waza and hope the ref dosent 

call them for passivity...plus u get the added problem of confusion   for the spectator. Folkstyle 

wrestling is ruined by 

overcomplicated rules

 spectators cant follow...

 

 

I know that Judo athletes will be wildly less effective in all other   grapplng and fight sports if they dont train for leg grabs...nobody would debate that eh?

Edited: 1/11/19 1:43 PM
12/1/18
Posts: 35
Denis Kelly -

On a related note what was the original reasoning for Greco roman not allowing leg attacks? Has there always just been view that leg tackles were too easy or untechnical? I actually have the Ippon pickups book and the author mentions that not many competitors practiced or at least uchikomi'd leg attacks even when they were legal.

Greco is older than freestyle and the theory is that it has more entertaining high amplitude throws however i dont think that pans out in practice, with less attack options DEFFENSIVE GRAPPLING (what governing bodies want to reduce) actually becomes EVEN MORE EFFECTIVE!!!

 

i would welcome an additional division in JUDO but taking away such a important attack option takes whats left of Judos combat effectiveness and relegates it to a special skill with very little use outside sport competition judo 

MMA actually has more big throws than any grapplng art because its myrid of attack options means the athlete has to work harder to defend more things and thus cant concentrate on defense of the high amplitude throws....that why we see all these awesome slamms in MMA but in olympic greco they are very rare!

https://youtu.be/gNF0j9AZolM

Search wrestling throws and you will see way more in freestyle than greco. 

Greco is the classic form of wrestling but has no place as an effective fighting style, its all about art and history. 

 

2/22/19 10:46 AM
1/1/01
Posts: 6876

Someone was telling me at class that they may bring back leg grabbing. Not sure where they got the information.