OtherGround Forums Ben Shapiro Says It's A "You" Problem

10 days ago
9/3/18
Posts: 940
DropKick Joe -
Middleman747 -

He's correct. Live with in your means. If you want more work for it. Shocking I know for socialists 

Working more than one job because you want more is literally working for it. 

 

And sometimes people work multiple jobs to put themselves through school, improve their situation, etc. 

Not sure what youre getting at. I work 3 jobs. Two for my family and one to support my parents. Its my choice. If I didn't want my lifestyle or to support my folks I'd work one, but again my choice. I didn't watch his clip, but I've seen plenty from him, he seems to advocate personal responsibility which I agree with. 

10 days ago
1/22/05
Posts: 3326

I work 2 jobs but my full time gig is 3 - 12 hour shifts. No reason not to work another job when I have 4 days off a week.

10 days ago
7/5/11
Posts: 2276

I kinda agree with him. I think the counterpoint is that you can no longer afford the same lifestyle you could decades ago on a single job with a median to just below median wage.

 

Back in the "good old days" if someone put in their 40 hours at a job that didn't require a ton of skill or a college education they could afford home ownership (not renting) and to support a family. I live in Phoenix which dosent have too high cost of living and theres no way you can afford to own a home and take care of a spouse and child on one income.

 

Like many others said you have to live within your means, but it would be nice if having one modest blue collar job could afford the lifestyle it once did.

10 days ago
2/22/13
Posts: 2790

Usual lazy suspects chiming in with their liberal retardation.  Dapigshit, Pedro the shitholer, etc.

10 days ago
3/12/07
Posts: 11191

I don't seen how it would be anyone else's fault. I also don't see what's wrong with working more than one job.

10 days ago
2/5/06
Posts: 3124

Shapiro probably works harder than everyone in this thread. 

10 days ago
11/18/11
Posts: 7813
tf1 -

Shapiro probably works harder than everyone in this thread. 

What does he do exactly? I'm not clear on that.

10 days ago
3/17/14
Posts: 18782

That video does not give enough context for me to say if hes right or wrong.

Also what does he mean by it being a "you" problem. Is he saying it's your problem alone and no one needs to help you? Or is he saying you work two jobs because "you" are the problem.

I think it's the former.

10 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 22007
When housing in your area explodes by 300% because a foreign country of 2 billion people is inflating home prices to insane levels because traditional metrics of value don't matter when you're simply trying to get their money out of their country it becomes more than just a simple matter of "you shouldn't have taken that job".
10 days ago
11/28/08
Posts: 21262
xNate -
DaveFu -

No one is stopping you from buying:

The cheapest cell phone

The cheapest clothes

The cheapest household goods

The cheapest car and car accessories

Poor people shop like poor people.....this is well documented. 

Or Googling lowest cost of living by state...

Rent in that area...

Jobs available in that area...

Rentals in that area....

Areas with low cost of living are that way for a reason. Not a lot of job prospects.

Edited: 10 days ago
12/26/05
Posts: 42834

Most of the exceptionally successful people I know for a large chunk of their lives worked 50-70 hours a week...

 

Most people I've known who complains about having two jobs probably worked fewer hours at those two jobs than the highly successful people I mentioned.

 

Thst doesnt mean some people arent strapped and stuck in a rough spot, but yea...its my experience that most of the people who cry about work...well let's just say working too hard is almost never their problem..

10 days ago
12/28/04
Posts: 30753
wanderpage siljackson - 

I kinda agree with him. I think the counterpoint is that you can no longer afford the same lifestyle you could decades ago on a single job with a median to just below median wage.

 

Back in the "good old days" if someone put in their 40 hours at a job that didn't require a ton of skill or a college education they could afford home ownership (not renting) and to support a family. I live in Phoenix which dosent have too high cost of living and theres no way you can afford to own a home and take care of a spouse and child on one income.

 

Like many others said you have to live within your means, but it would be nice if having one modest blue collar job could afford the lifestyle it once did.


Correct, the working class are now basically subsidising the super rich. This is why people now need to work multiple jobs...

Image result for middle class and income inequality

10 days ago
5/18/10
Posts: 12567
BrocksSwockRanTrane_onShane -
wanderpage siljackson - 

I kinda agree with him. I think the counterpoint is that you can no longer afford the same lifestyle you could decades ago on a single job with a median to just below median wage.

 

Back in the "good old days" if someone put in their 40 hours at a job that didn't require a ton of skill or a college education they could afford home ownership (not renting) and to support a family. I live in Phoenix which dosent have too high cost of living and theres no way you can afford to own a home and take care of a spouse and child on one income.

 

Like many others said you have to live within your means, but it would be nice if having one modest blue collar job could afford the lifestyle it once did.


Correct, the working class are now basically subsidising the super rich. This is why people now need to work multiple jobs...

Image result for middle class and income inequality

So the poor are richer thank they've ever been

Edited: 10 days ago
12/28/04
Posts: 30754
ryans - 
BrocksSwockRanTrane_onShane -
wanderpage siljackson - 

I kinda agree with him. I think the counterpoint is that you can no longer afford the same lifestyle you could decades ago on a single job with a median to just below median wage.

 

Back in the "good old days" if someone put in their 40 hours at a job that didn't require a ton of skill or a college education they could afford home ownership (not renting) and to support a family. I live in Phoenix which dosent have too high cost of living and theres no way you can afford to own a home and take care of a spouse and child on one income.

 

Like many others said you have to live within your means, but it would be nice if having one modest blue collar job could afford the lifestyle it once did.


Correct, the working class are now basically subsidising the super rich. This is why people now need to work multiple jobs...

Image result for middle class and income inequality

So the poor are richer thank they've ever been

 

No, they have higher incomes but if you take inflation into account they have less money, hence the need for multiple jobs. 

 

Edited: 10 days ago
12/28/04
Posts: 30755

This comes down to the reduction of the middle class, the USA used to have a massive middle class. Not anymore, and the median wealth has suffered... 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_class

 United States       NO 29 37.7%

Image result for percent of middle class by country

 

Thats why the USA scores higher on average wage than median wage. 

 

 

10 days ago
5/18/10
Posts: 12568
BrocksSwockRanTrane_onShane -
ryans - 
BrocksSwockRanTrane_onShane -
wanderpage siljackson - 

I kinda agree with him. I think the counterpoint is that you can no longer afford the same lifestyle you could decades ago on a single job with a median to just below median wage.

 

Back in the "good old days" if someone put in their 40 hours at a job that didn't require a ton of skill or a college education they could afford home ownership (not renting) and to support a family. I live in Phoenix which dosent have too high cost of living and theres no way you can afford to own a home and take care of a spouse and child on one income.

 

Like many others said you have to live within your means, but it would be nice if having one modest blue collar job could afford the lifestyle it once did.


Correct, the working class are now basically subsidising the super rich. This is why people now need to work multiple jobs...

Image result for middle class and income inequality

So the poor are richer thank they've ever been

 

No, they have higher incomes but if you take inflation into account they have less money, hence the need for multiple jobs. 

 

That's empirically completely untrue. Absolute poverty has been decreasing virtually monotonically since records began in the West.

 

We have it better than our parents. Our parents better than our grandparents.

 

This idea that we're worse off is a cultural meme created by whiny millennials. 

10 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 11186

He is correct but he could have presented it better. I believe it was his intent to say that if you find yourself in a situation that you are not happy/satisfied/fulfilled in, then change your situation. 

I was a public school teacher for 13 years. I was not happy with the life it allowed me to livealthoughI loved being in a classroom with the kids. I worked multiple jobs and went back to school. Now I am a college Professor. Of course I still wish I made more $, but this is light years shards of where I’d be as a school teacher. I was unsatisfied so I made change.

In America, quite literally everyone has opportunity. Only 6.7% of the entire population of Earth has a college degree. More than 21% of Americans have degrees. Over 9% of Americans have Masters Degrees and almost 2% have PhD’s. 

People can bitch about student loans all they want to, and debt definitely sucks. Between my wife and I we have substantial student loan debt, but our income has risen to a level that it would never have gotten to across a 35 year career in education without our degrees. Making payments sucks, but the degree is undoubtedly worth it.

the truth is, it isn’t the debt or access to funding that stops people. It is an unwillingness to do the damn work. I worked 3 jobs and went to school through my entire Grad School process. People told me how they couldn’t afford it, how they couldn’t take the debt on, etc. that’s a euphemism. They weren’t willling to match my work ethic and do what it takes to get the degrees.

Ben is right.

10 days ago
5/18/10
Posts: 12569
ryans -
BrocksSwockRanTrane_onShane -
ryans - 
BrocksSwockRanTrane_onShane -
wanderpage siljackson - 

I kinda agree with him. I think the counterpoint is that you can no longer afford the same lifestyle you could decades ago on a single job with a median to just below median wage.

 

Back in the "good old days" if someone put in their 40 hours at a job that didn't require a ton of skill or a college education they could afford home ownership (not renting) and to support a family. I live in Phoenix which dosent have too high cost of living and theres no way you can afford to own a home and take care of a spouse and child on one income.

 

Like many others said you have to live within your means, but it would be nice if having one modest blue collar job could afford the lifestyle it once did.


Correct, the working class are now basically subsidising the super rich. This is why people now need to work multiple jobs...

Image result for middle class and income inequality

So the poor are richer thank they've ever been

 

No, they have higher incomes but if you take inflation into account they have less money, hence the need for multiple jobs. 

 

That's empirically completely untrue. Absolute poverty has been decreasing virtually monotonically since records began in the West.

 

We have it better than our parents. Our parents better than our grandparents.

 

This idea that we're worse off is a cultural meme created by whiny millennials. 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN07096/SN07096.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwilipLr3oTkAhXjrnEKHXeJBscQFjAhegQIChAI&usg=AOvVaw0cSxl2t099oVIhBVIE0L2z&cshid=1565867613889

 

 

Sorry for the ugly link. Look at absolute low income there. Life is better than it's ever been if you look at facts and put down the Guardian

 

Middle class (median) people took longer to recover from the great recession but that only ended a few years ago yet they've bounced back

10 days ago
10/15/13
Posts: 30897
DaveFu -

No one is stopping you from buying:

The cheapest cell phone

The cheapest clothes

The cheapest household goods

The cheapest car and car accessories

Poor people shop like poor people.....this is well documented. 

But i NEED the latest, bestest I-Phone 10SRX so i i can quickly put silly faces on my selfies!

10 days ago
12/29/06
Posts: 14555

Most people who did it all themselves have worked two jobs. I did just before retiring - paid off everything and landed at age 50 free of debt, owned my own home, owned my car no CC debt, paid off my daughter's college debt.

Great feeling, though scary to retire early - you don't believe it's real. Going on 18 years retired, living the life.

 

10 days ago
10/16/07
Posts: 21468
Altofsky -
Pedro Navaja -

I used to like Shapiro as one of the few true respectable conservatives. But he’s coming off like a dick here.

who “should” take these jobs then? If they don’t pay enough to support a family? There is a problem with the system, not the people. 

What the hell is this notion that a single minimum wage income is meant to support a family?

It’s not meant to be...and like you, I’m tired of people focus on increasing the pay for unskilled labour instead of focusing on increasing the skills of the worker.

9 days ago
9/23/07
Posts: 8833
Ben is a rich kid, and while he probably does work many hours, he has no experience with the adversity that many working class people face.

Men with only a High School education used to be able to raise a family and retire sufficiently on a single income. This topic is much more nuanced than the "bootstraps" argument. Consider:

- Women entering the job market en masse and depressing wages.

-The global economy luring away what were well-paid manufacturing jobs.

- Illegal aliens entering the job market and depressing the wages for industries like construction, agriculture, service, etc..

- Not everyone is able to, for a myriad of reasons, move to the cheapest economic zone and start fresh. Nor should they have to, simply because their economy is being mismanaged.

- Some people are born into shitty situations and raised by shitty people. The cycle of poverty is real and the Democrat Party leveraging poverty and racial issues for votes has made it worse.

- Why aren't basic economics, retirement strategies, budgeting, entrepreneurial paths, tradecrafts, credit management, tax strategies, and basically all the important stuff that adults need to know, taught in public schools?

- Instead they make Johnny Average run laps, roll rubbers on bananas for safer anal sex, and convince him that without college, he won't amount to shit. Maybe it's fine for the kids from good families, or that have high IQ's, but it's a dogshit "education" for the rest.


I'm not advocating for welfare or more spending, but let's not pretend that we haven't slipped as a society, or that working two or three jobs is the ideal solution to things. That only further erodes the family.

We should do more for people than tell them to do better. How about we, as a society, do better to fix the problem by providing stable families, better education and more opportunities.
9 days ago
8/6/08
Posts: 38319

In America if you sacrifice and work your ass off beginning in school, yes you will get a job that allows you live. Of course there are exceptions to ever my rule but that is generally the case. 

9 days ago
8/6/08
Posts: 38320
The Adversary - Ben is a rich kid, and while he probably does work many hours, he has no experience with the adversity that many working class people face.

Men with only a High School education used to be able to raise a family and retire sufficiently on a single income. This topic is much more nuanced than the "bootstraps" argument. Consider:

- Women entering the job market en masse and depressing wages.

-The global economy luring away what were well-paid manufacturing jobs.

- Illegal aliens entering the job market and depressing the wages for industries like construction, agriculture, service, etc..

- Not everyone is able to, for a myriad of reasons, move to the cheapest economic zone and start fresh. Nor should they have to, simply because their economy is being mismanaged.

- Some people are born into shitty situations and raised by shitty people. The cycle of poverty is real and the Democrat Party leveraging poverty and racial issues for votes has made it worse.

- Why aren't basic economics, retirement strategies, budgeting, entrepreneurial paths, tradecrafts, credit management, tax strategies, and basically all the important stuff that adults need to know, taught in public schools?

- Instead they make Johnny Average run laps, roll rubbers on bananas for safer anal sex, and convince him that without college, he won't amount to shit. Maybe it's fine for the kids from good families, or that have high IQ's, but it's a dogshit "education" for the rest.


I'm not advocating for welfare or more spending, but let's not pretend that we haven't slipped as a society, or that working two or three jobs is the ideal solution to things. That only further erodes the family.

We should do more for people than tell them to do better. How about we, as a society, do better to fix the problem by providing stable families, better education and more opportunities.

Because telling people to do better instead of pandering actually forces people to do better 

9 days ago
12/28/04
Posts: 30756
ryans - 
BrocksSwockRanTrane_onShane -
ryans - 
BrocksSwockRanTrane_onShane -
wanderpage siljackson - 

I kinda agree with him. I think the counterpoint is that you can no longer afford the same lifestyle you could decades ago on a single job with a median to just below median wage.

 

Back in the "good old days" if someone put in their 40 hours at a job that didn't require a ton of skill or a college education they could afford home ownership (not renting) and to support a family. I live in Phoenix which dosent have too high cost of living and theres no way you can afford to own a home and take care of a spouse and child on one income.

 

Like many others said you have to live within your means, but it would be nice if having one modest blue collar job could afford the lifestyle it once did.


Correct, the working class are now basically subsidising the super rich. This is why people now need to work multiple jobs...

Image result for middle class and income inequality

So the poor are richer thank they've ever been

 

No, they have higher incomes but if you take inflation into account they have less money, hence the need for multiple jobs. 

 

That's empirically completely untrue. Absolute poverty has been decreasing virtually monotonically since records began in the West.

 

We have it better than our parents. Our parents better than our grandparents.

 

This idea that we're worse off is a cultural meme created by whiny millennials. 


But that isn't simply to do with wages, and we are talking about wages. Of course we have it better, we have better technology.