OtherGround Forums I’ve never met a pit bull owner that was smart

2/22/20 8:53 AM
11/17/10
Posts: 52060

why do people ignore thae actual attack stats and keep pointing to this dumb "temperament test" that supposedly says pitbulls are the best dogs ever

 

let's say that is 100% true, that pits score at the top of this "temperament test"

 

does it somehow make all the pitbull attacks disappear?

2/22/20 10:07 AM
3/14/04
Posts: 134064

Myth #9: Pit bulls pass the American Temperament Test

In 1977, Alfons Ertel designed the American Temperament Test in hopes of creating a uniform temperament test for dogs. Of the 77 million plus dogs that populate the U.S. today,21 6,670 are tested per year (0.008% of all dogs).22 The temperament data published by the group is not based upon scientific random sampling of any dog breed. It seems it would be virtually impossible to develop such a reliable study, as the base population source group is unidentifiable.

Due to the temperament data being objectively statistically unreliable, it is also highly misleading. Pit bull advocates frequently use this misleading data to point to the breed's good temperament and to advocate against breed-specific laws ("Pit bulls pass the ATTS test more often than beagles!"). Yet anyone who has a minimal understanding of critical statistical analysis should be able to see that the ATTS "breed statistics" temperament data is essentially valueless.

The 12-minute test stimulates a casual walk through a park with a range of encounters. The test focuses on stability, shyness, aggressiveness and a few other factors. According to the group, the overall pass rate (the combination of all breeds) is 84%.23 Unlike the AKC's Canine Good Citizen test, no part of the ATTS test is performed without the dog owner present. It also fails to evaluate the most basic scenario that leads to aggression: How a dog reacts when it sees another dog.

For more information regarding the unreliability of all temperament testing, please see: Behavior Testing Shelter Dogs -- A Summary of Where We Are Now by animal behaviorist and author Alexandra Semyonova (2016) and our section for Dog Behavior Studies.

Related articles:

2/22/20 10:29 AM
3/14/04
Posts: 134065

Pitbulls lead bite counts all across the US.  No, despite what some liars on this thread claim, it's not labs that bite the most, it's pitbulls, despite the fact that there are a shitload more labs than pits in the dog population.

 

https://blog.dogsbite.org/2009/07/pit-bulls-lead-bite-counts-across-us.html

2/22/20 11:00 AM
3/14/04
Posts: 134066

Well steak and chicken?  Here's the truth behind your bullshit temperament test.

 

https://nonlineardogs.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/behavior-testing-shelter-dogs-a-summary-of-where-we-are-now-semyonova-2016.pdf

 

There is much that these tests don’t tell us. Scientists acknowledge that the tests do NOT detect territorial aggression, predatory aggression, owner-directed aggression, dog-aggression, nuisance barking, escape behavior, or how a dog will react to direct physical contact or restraint once it’s rehomed. In addition, all of the tests are based on the premise that behavior is stable – the friendly dog will always be friendly – and that dogs will warn with elevating threat signals before biting or attacking. In fact, none of the tests can – or ever will – detect impulsive aggression (IA), which is by definition the tendency to commit a sudden, unpredictable, explosive attack, out of all proportion to any stimulus or threat to the dog, not preceded by any warning signals, and often occurring in a dog that is otherwise friendly and obedient. This is a trait that is known to be strongly heritable and to be present in only a handful of dog breeds and types. The best indicator of high risk that IA will be present is ‘breed’ or type of dog, regardless of how such a dog does on a behavior test.

 

What does real science say? As Jane Goodall demonstrated half a century ago, real science has to include field observations and data. When we do this, we come to the only possible scientific conclusions. The first is that ‘breed’ and type of dog is the best predictor of whether a dog will commit a sudden, sustained, maiming or fatal attack on other animals and on humans. In the past three years, pit bull and molosser / mastiff types have been responsible for close to 90% of these attacks. In shelter dogs, these two dog types account for 98% of all fatal attacks by tested then rehomed dogs. This means that not the tests, but again the type of dog is the best predictor that placing a dog will present a serious threat to public safety.

2/22/20 11:18 AM
1/9/02
Posts: 50770
In Limbo -

why do people ignore thae actual attack stats and keep pointing to this dumb "temperament test" that supposedly says pitbulls are the best dogs ever

 

let's say that is 100% true, that pits score at the top of this "temperament test"

 

does it somehow make all the pitbull attacks disappear?

no

it means the "temperment test" is bullshit

 

these ppl are not scientists though, they dont know how to evaluate evidence, most pitbull owners are barely literate

Edited: 2/22/20 11:19 AM
1/9/02
Posts: 50771
stevezur -

always carry a knife

that dog should have been gutted like a fish, then you can do the same thing to the owner if you're lucky enough for them to attack you for killing their dog.

2/22/20 11:58 AM
3/14/04
Posts: 134067
gregbrady - 
In Limbo -

why do people ignore thae actual attack stats and keep pointing to this dumb "temperament test" that supposedly says pitbulls are the best dogs ever

 

let's say that is 100% true, that pits score at the top of this "temperament test"

 

does it somehow make all the pitbull attacks disappear?

no

it means the "temperment test" is bullshit

 

these ppl are not scientists though, they dont know how to evaluate evidence, most pitbull owners are barely literate


Like I pointed out above, the temperament test doesn't measure the type of aggression exhibited by pits.

I think that should be obvious to anyone with even half a brain.

Pits account for the most bites, attacks, and deaths out of all dog breeds. They are unpredictable and their aggression, as explained in the information I posted above, is often impulsive and not predictable. On the other hand, you have this temperament test that pit apologists claim proves that pits are harmless docile dogs that are more stable than even golden retrievers.

When you look at both of those things, obviously, there is a problem with one of them. Since the dog bite/attack/deaths numbers are there for all to see, the only conclusion a person who isn't a complete retard can draw is that the temperament test is worthless and is a poor way to measure how safe or dangerous a dog, or a breed of dog, has the potential to be.

If the temperament test really proved pits are harmless, pits wouldn't account for most dog bites including 90+ percent of fatal attacks on humans and other dogs.

But since pits do account for the overwhelming majority of those attacks, it's pretty obvious that the test CANNOT prove that they are stable and not predisposed to impulsive and predatory aggression. It's impossible for the test to prove that because the reality simply doesn't support it.
2/22/20 12:02 PM
1/27/20
Posts: 142

Guys trobinson and steak and chicken are still sleeping . They don’t wake up before noon on weekends

2/22/20 12:13 PM
3/14/04
Posts: 134068
Seven Late Hammerfists - 

Guys trobinson and steak and chicken are still sleeping . They don’t wake up before noon on weekends


Noon? More like 2 or 3 in the afternoon. Breakfast is a 40 oz and a bowl of cereal with water.
2/22/20 12:19 PM
3/14/04
Posts: 134069
trobinson21 - 
angryinch -
trobinson21 - 
angryinch - <p>steak and chicken, so what's your level of professional experience with dog behavior?  How many abused, aggressive, fearful, etc...  dogs have you personally rehabilitated?  What formal education do you have in canine behavior?  What certifications in the field of dog behavior do you have?  How many shelters have contracted you as an expert in dog behavior?  How many reactive/aggressive dog group classes have you taught in which you are in a small area with between 4 and 6 dogs that want to kill every other dog they see?  

</p><p>By all means, enlighten us with your expertise, which is obviously far more extensive than mine.  </p>

Cesar Milan has a history of rehabbing all types of dogs, his worst bite...Holly a yellow lab. 
 

You can copy and paste from the same shitty website all you like, the fact remains that pit bulls don’t account for the most dog bites, they have been tested and proven not to be the most aggressive, they are strong and have been bred to hold on when they bite which leads to worse injuries in the rare case that they do bite.

Facts and statistics trump your opinion and the copy and pasted Google search results from a pit bull hating website.

Then again you are the same unintelligent mouth breather who literally said “1 in 8, 1 in 80, it’s all the same” Lol


Cesar Milan has a history of being a fucktard and not knowing what he's doing. If you're talking about the one where he challenges a dog with food guarding issues, yeah, real fucking genius right there. That is the LAST thing you want to do in that situation.

Cesar himself has said he's not a trainer. He has no formal training.

Everything you said is either false or a complete mischaracterization of the truth with the exception of explaining how pitbulls attack, and even that is not entirely accurate.

Everyone is a fucktard who disagrees with the grown man who cleans up dogshit for a living and spends Valentines Day crying on the OG about being alone eating a Hungry Man dinner. Lol

Maybe it’s just you, Corky.


Oh look who woke up. Feel free to address any of the facts I posted. If you can't do that, STFU and go eat a Tide pod.
2/22/20 12:36 PM
1/27/20
Posts: 143
trobinson21 -
Seven Late Hammerfists -

Guys trobinson and steak and chicken are still sleeping . They don’t wake up before noon on weekends

Lol says the adult who alleges to be on vacation spending every day pretending like he is going to fight people who embarrass him on message boards.

Still waiting for you to tell everyone what combat sport you “compete” in Mr Insecurity.

I usually just post from work, my middle son had a football game this morning now I’m waiting on him. Enjoy your “vacation” searching for self esteem on the internet, fat ass.

Your son is a homosexual

2/22/20 12:38 PM
3/14/04
Posts: 134070
trobinson21 - 
angryinch -
trobinson21 - 
angryinch -
trobinson21 - 
angryinch - <p>steak and chicken, so what's your level of professional experience with dog behavior?  How many abused, aggressive, fearful, etc...  dogs have you personally rehabilitated?  What formal education do you have in canine behavior?  What certifications in the field of dog behavior do you have?  How many shelters have contracted you as an expert in dog behavior?  How many reactive/aggressive dog group have you taught in which you are in a small area with between 4 and 6 dogs that want to kill every other dog they see?  

</p><p>By all means, enlighten us with your expertise, which is obviously far more extensive than mine.  </p>

Cesar Milan has a history of rehabbing all types of dogs, his worst bite...Holly a yellow lab. 
 

You can copy and paste from the same shitty website all you like, the fact remains that pit bulls don’t account for the most dog bites, they have been tested and proven not to be the most aggressive, they are strong and have been bred to hold on when they bite which leads to worse injuries in the rare case that they do bite.

Facts and statistics trump your opinion and the copy and pasted Google search results from a pit bull hating website.

Then again you are the same unintelligent mouth breather who literally said “1 in 8, 1 in 80, it’s all the same” Lol


Cesar Milan has a history of being a fucktard and not knowing what he's doing. If you're talking about the one where he challenges a dog with food guarding issues, yeah, real fucking genius right there. That is the LAST thing you want to do in that situation.

Cesar himself has said he's not a trainer. He has no formal training.

Everything you said is either false or a complete mischaracterization of the truth with the exception of explaining how pitbulls attack, and even that is not entirely accurate.

Everyone is a fucktard who disagrees with the grown man who cleans up dogshit for a living and spends Valentines Day crying on the OG about being alone eating a Hungry Man dinner. Lol

Maybe it’s just you, Corky.


Oh look who woke up. Feel free to address any of the facts I posted. If you can't do that, STFU and go eat a Tide pod.

I’ve already addressed your “facts” pit bulls bite hard and hold on, that doesn’t make pit bull attacks “frequent”.

Still waiting on you to address my facts or the facts of statistics. Like why pit bulls tested to be less “aggressive” than chihuahuas or why these vicious killers only kill about 17 people per year when there are 4 million or why a grown man cleans up shit for a living when there are community colleges everywhere or why you spent Valentines Day crying about being lonely.

Im going to the movies in a little bit so hurry up. Lol


lol....right, there's an epidemic of fatal chihuahua attacks. When I'm out walking my dog, the last thing I'm worried about is being attacked by a chihuahua.

And no, pitbulls did not test to be less aggressive than chihuahuas. That's an outright lie and I posted thorough explanations of why that is a lie. It might behoove you to actually read posts before responding to them. You might look slightly less retarded.
2/22/20 12:39 PM
3/14/04
Posts: 134071
Seven Late Hammerfists - 
trobinson21 -
Seven Late Hammerfists -

Guys trobinson and steak and chicken are still sleeping . They don’t wake up before noon on weekends

Lol says the adult who alleges to be on vacation spending every day pretending like he is going to fight people who embarrass him on message boards.

Still waiting for you to tell everyone what combat sport you “compete” in Mr Insecurity.

I usually just post from work, my middle son had a football game this morning now I’m waiting on him. Enjoy your “vacation” searching for self esteem on the internet, fat ass.

Your son is a homosexual


I don't know about his son but I'm pretty sure his husband is.
2/22/20 12:42 PM
1/27/20
Posts: 144

So trobinsons son is married to another man . Lol! He has a gay son in law!!

2/22/20 12:53 PM
10/30/19
Posts: 1260
Seven Late Hammerfists -

So trobinsons son is married to another man . Lol! He has a gay son in law!!

2/22/20 2:14 PM
2/27/12
Posts: 3480

Throughout this thread trobinson has proved OP's thesis true.

2/22/20 2:22 PM
1/27/20
Posts: 145
The Regulator -

Throughout this thread trobinson has proved OP's thesis true.

Thank you. I never get tired of winning

2/22/20 4:11 PM
10/30/19
Posts: 1263
Seven Late Hammerfists -
The Regulator -

Throughout this thread trobinson has proved OP's thesis true.

Thank you. I never get tired of winning

Edited: 2/22/20 4:30 PM
5/23/07
Posts: 20436
trobinson21 - 
angryinch -

Pitbulls lead bite counts all across the US.  No, despite what some liars on this thread claim, it's not labs that bite the most, it's pitbulls, despite the fact that there are a shitload more labs than pits in the dog population.

 

https://blog.dogsbite.org/2009/07/pit-bulls-lead-bite-counts-across-us.html

Typical response from a retard who is trying to Google his way to the truth....there are 50 states moron, the first paragraph from this blog clearly states this is a poll from random cities from 19 states.

Good try though, instead of spending Saturday on the internet so angry you Google about pitbull attacks all Saturday morning then cherry picking conflated results why don’t you google community colleges in your area?

A career better than cleaning up dog shit might lead to a Valentines Date next year so you won’t have to cry on the OG again.

 

Lol @ those magical dog biting states where pitbull bites only occur. 

 

You look like an idiot in this thread.

Edited: 2/22/20 4:46 PM
11/19/19
Posts: 1386

Why would anyone ever own a POS pit bull?

 

Probably because they can't afford a real dog.

 

2/22/20 6:01 PM
8/18/13
Posts: 9370

Shocking that someone who names himself after perma retard Tommy Robinson loves him a pitbull 

2/22/20 6:26 PM
1/27/20
Posts: 146
trobinson21 -
Seven Late Hammerfists -
The Regulator -

Throughout this thread trobinson has proved OP's thesis true.

Thank you. I never get tired of winning

You’ve been exposed as a 300 pounder, a fake fighter, you’ve pretended to be on vacation and pretended like you were going to fight someone.

You are the textbook sad, insecure adult male, all over pit bulls. I’m sorry you’re poor and love around trailer dogs, but you’re self esteem doesn’t come from lying on the internet.

 

You’re completely out of your mind.

2/22/20 11:35 PM
1/27/20
Posts: 147

Pizza

2/23/20 4:26 AM
5/17/01
Posts: 4084

Mmmm...pizza

2/27/20 12:58 AM
1/27/20
Posts: 157