OtherGround Forums OG doc. AMA on COVID-19

3/15/20 7:57 AM
8/11/12
Posts: 10626
scrapdo -
trobinson21 -
mataleo1 -
Believe in the Power of One - 

Been hearing kids under 9 aren't getting it, is that true?

What SHOULD we be doing other than avoiding people? 


Bear in mind this is based on incomplete data.

There are many cases of infants and children having it, but no lethalities so far.

What to do:
-Avoid crowds
-Avoid unnecessary travel
-If you're sick, stay home, many toll free numbers out there to help you figure out if you have symptoms.
-If you're very sick, go to the ER, try protecting your mouth on your way there (or wear a mask if you have one)

And remember guys, water is wet and the Earth is round. 
 

Stay safe gang! Lol

I know who I’m hoping catches THD (Tom Hanks Disease)

Wtf is THD? What is it and what does it do? Does it turn you into the nicest person in the world? I think he can use some THD.

3/15/20 8:01 AM
9/24/06
Posts: 2935
Should mma / bjj gyms close, and if so, for how long?
3/15/20 8:03 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2894
robhustle - Should mma / bjj gyms close, and if so, for how long?

Yeah, I definitely think so. At least for 1 month, maybe 2.

3/15/20 8:29 AM
10/4/02
Posts: 5941

Zink does seem to help with regular virus (anecdote)

Interesting thought that the virus has been around allready, a coworker came home from Africa late in fall with a real shitty flu and fever that kept coming and going. A few others, including myself had this oddly behaving flu that hung around a while. Not likly to be covid I know, but I can't shake the thought of how many chinese there are all over Africa

3/15/20 9:29 AM
9/6/17
Posts: 478

Did they ever resolve the length of incubation, latency, and the duration of symptoms and being infectious? And get a peer reviewed R naught value? This question might have already been answered but I probably missed it. Thanks

3/15/20 10:07 AM
2/2/15
Posts: 8943

So we had an emergency landing at the airport here due to a medical emergency. Happened last night. The flight was coming from Mexico to the UK, anyway, they let almost three hundred passengers out to roam the fucking city for 24 hours, no restrictions, nothing. The incompetence of government is unbelievable.

3/15/20 10:24 AM
1/1/01
Posts: 63286

Thank you for the thread of the year.

Apologies for the trobinson troll. He was of course shown the door.

I do have a question that for me is huge. I am based in Western Massachusetts. Just yesterday we had the first presumptive cases in the county. I have a fight gym, and am trying to figure out whether to close or not. We have reached out to the town board of health repeatedly for some direction, without a response so far.

Do you think fight gyms should close down? Should they move to stand up only? Stand up only with a limited size and instruction to try to maintain social distancing? Follow the lead of school officials, and close down or limit size and/or programming if K-12 are closed down in the town?

I know it's impossible to answer anything definitively, but any feedback whatsoever would be very gratefully received.

And again, sincerest apologies for the troll. He obviously leads a very miserable life, at the least internally.

3/15/20 10:28 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2895
Trotskyshammer - 

Did they ever resolve the length of incubation, latency, and the duration of symptoms and being infectious? And get a peer reviewed R naught value? This question might have already been answered but I probably missed it. Thanks


This is the best peer-reviewed data we currently have, but keep in mind new papers are coming up every day:

Incubation: 4.5-5.8 days, 98% under 11.5 days
Ref: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2762510

Latency: No good data (only anecdotal)

Duration of symptoms: Median 5.0 days, with range 5-13 days
Ref:https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/31986264

Consider you're shedding soon after you're exposed to the end of symptoms.

Distance? Haven't seen good data

3/15/20 10:39 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2896
Kirik - 

Thank you for the thread of the year.

Apologies for the trobinson troll. He was of course shown the door.

I do have a question that for me is huge. I am based in Western Massachusetts. Just yesterday we had the first presumptive cases in the county. I have a fight gym, and am trying to figure out whether to close or not. We have reached out to the town board of health repeatedly for some direction, without a response so far.

Do you think fight gyms should close down? Should they move to stand up only? Stand up only with a limited size and instruction to try to maintain social distancing? Follow the lead of school officials, and close down or limit size and/or programming if K-12 are closed down in the town?

I know it's impossible to answer anything definitively, but any feedback whatsoever would be very gratefully received.

And again, sincerest apologies for the troll. He obviously leads a very miserable life, at the least internally.


Thx kirik,

I've been a lurker here since the old NHB pages. Don't apologize for trob, I knew i'd get my shit shoved in by posting here. One develops thick skin over the years, better just mock the morons.

As for your question, I wouldn't listen to me, but my wife is a true expert on health policy/Infectious diseases and she'd tell you to close that gym until further notice. Yeah, BJJ is worse, but any close fighting poses a real risk for transmission (probably worse than a plane), as droplets are simply everywhere. I know it sucks, but we just don't know what we're facing yet. People like to shit on the Italian example but consider this a worse-case scenario that can happen here in any densely populated area. Let's learn from that example and take all steps necessary to reduce its likelihood.

3/15/20 10:49 AM
12/26/09
Posts: 6979
Caladan -

Have you guys seen a lot of random unexplained viral infections this year affecting the upper respiratory system? More than usual I mean, of people who aren't positive for anything on the normal flu test?

 

I've had this theory for a few days now that this shit has been here for awhile and everyone has or has had it. We've heard for awhile now how this is an extra bad flu year and I've heard so many anecsotes of people who have had a weird viral infection that they "just can't quite shake".

I’ve worked in an urgent care the last three years and yes, we’ve had a lot more lingering URI’s with negative flu tests this year.

Is it a coincidence? Not sure. 

Edited: 3/15/20 10:54 AM
2/4/09
Posts: 10447
Jack Mahogoff -
Caladan -

Have you guys seen a lot of random unexplained viral infections this year affecting the upper respiratory system? More than usual I mean, of people who aren't positive for anything on the normal flu test?

 

I've had this theory for a few days now that this shit has been here for awhile and everyone has or has had it. We've heard for awhile now how this is an extra bad flu year and I've heard so many anecsotes of people who have had a weird viral infection that they "just can't quite shake".

I’ve worked in an urgent care the last three years and yes, we’ve had a lot more lingering URI’s with negative flu tests this year.

Is it a coincidence? Not sure. 

I've mentioned it as well. I have data to a lot of stuff within the hospital. I didnt think much of it when it was occurring but there were a lot of pneumonia as well as influenza cases that came through. We do performs tests to confirm influenza cases and sometimes it's pretty simple for someone to be put on droplet precautions just to be safe. 

 

I'll try and see if there are any types of reports I can run that will give data spanning the past several months. I dont think there will be but if I can this would also be preliminary as I would have to cross reference the admitting diagnosis etc.... sometimes people pick things up in the hospital as well. I would also have to rule out confirmed influenza cases. 

3/15/20 10:53 AM
10/30/10
Posts: 8876
mataleo1 -
BJ Penn Forever - 
trobinson21 -
mataleo1 -
Believe in the Power of One - 

Been hearing kids under 9 aren't getting it, is that true?

What SHOULD we be doing other than avoiding people? 


Bear in mind this is based on incomplete data.

There are many cases of infants and children having it, but no lethalities so far.

What to do:
-Avoid crowds
-Avoid unnecessary travel
-If you're sick, stay home, many toll free numbers out there to help you figure out if you have symptoms.
-If you're very sick, go to the ER, try protecting your mouth on your way there (or wear a mask if you have one)

And remember guys, water is wet and the Earth is round. 
 

Stay safe gang! Lol

Your 20 vote downs should give you a clue that you are being a giant fucking dick while mataleo1 is trying to be cool.


Not trying to be cool brotha. I'm a giant nerd. Nerds are never cool.

But I'm trying to be helpful while I'm waiting around.

I appreciate the time you’ve spent here answering questions and giving as much factual information as possible. 

3/15/20 10:54 AM
1/21/18
Posts: 1892
mataleo1 -
MMA6053 - 

Thank you for this thread Mataleo.

I'm italian from Bari. I have friends and family currently doing it very tough over there.

I have just the one question I'm keen to hear yours or other medical professionals opinions on.

As has been noted, the Lombardy/Emilia Romagna region in Italy is one of the most modern, affluent regions in Italy if not Europe. The Italian health system is actually very good and well supported by the Govt.

So why ?..how ? Did this virus explode there of all places ??

 


Sorry to hear than man. Good luck to you.

No one knows for sure, but a few hypotheses are:
-Very dense population
-Many tourists
-Genetic predisposition
-Cultural norms (kissing on cheeks)
-Damaged mucous barriers (because of smoking)

I've been saying the cheek kissing thing was a big part of the problem in italy. This is the first time ive seen someone else mention it seriously. The truth is if it spreads by droplets and this IS something they do, that is by far the fastest way to spread it outside of open air coughing in a public space.

Edited: 3/15/20 11:01 AM
6/29/09
Posts: 3228

I appreciate your accessibility, OP, as well as your willingness to answer everyone's questions on top of all that you're already doing on the front lines.

Where would you draw the line between living life and isolating oneself? Clearly it's important to be aware and take precautions, but what about public places (restaurants, movie theaters, etc)? Avoid them altogether or just make sure to wash hands/sanitize/don't touch face? Do we assume it's everywhere even if a city/county and surrounding areas have no documented cases?

 

3/15/20 11:00 AM
12/26/09
Posts: 6980
NoNeed4aScreenName -
Jack Mahogoff -
Caladan -

Have you guys seen a lot of random unexplained viral infections this year affecting the upper respiratory system? More than usual I mean, of people who aren't positive for anything on the normal flu test?

 

I've had this theory for a few days now that this shit has been here for awhile and everyone has or has had it. We've heard for awhile now how this is an extra bad flu year and I've heard so many anecsotes of people who have had a weird viral infection that they "just can't quite shake".

I’ve worked in an urgent care the last three years and yes, we’ve had a lot more lingering URI’s with negative flu tests this year.

Is it a coincidence? Not sure. 

I've mentioned it as well. I have data to a lot of stuff within the hospital. I didnt think much of it when it was occurring but there were a lot of pneumonia as well as influenza cases that came through. We do performs tests to confirm influenza cases and sometimes it's pretty simple for someone to be put on droplet precautions just to be safe. 

 

I'll try and see if there are any types of reports I can run that will give data spanning the past several months. I dont think there will be but if I can this would also be preliminary as I would have to cross reference the admitting diagnosis etc.... sometimes people pick things up in the hospital as well. I would also have to rule out confirmed influenza cases. 

I live in NW Arkansas which is the home of Walmart, and we get a lot of international travelers on a daily basis. We started seeing an influx of patients with similar sx around late October which was earlier than expected. Lots of people from Asia come in, and lots of vendors go to Asia and come back constantly.
 

Im really surprised we don’t have more cases.

 

thanks to you and all the docs answering questions and being cool.

3/15/20 11:03 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2897
RightHandOfDOOM - 
mataleo1 -
MMA6053 - 

Thank you for this thread Mataleo.

I'm italian from Bari. I have friends and family currently doing it very tough over there.

I have just the one question I'm keen to hear yours or other medical professionals opinions on.

As has been noted, the Lombardy/Emilia Romagna region in Italy is one of the most modern, affluent regions in Italy if not Europe. The Italian health system is actually very good and well supported by the Govt.

So why ?..how ? Did this virus explode there of all places ??

 


Sorry to hear than man. Good luck to you.

No one knows for sure, but a few hypotheses are:
-Very dense population
-Many tourists
-Genetic predisposition
-Cultural norms (kissing on cheeks)
-Damaged mucous barriers (because of smoking)

I've been saying the cheek kissing thing was a big part of the problem in italy. This is the first time ive seen someone else mention it seriously. The truth is if it spreads by droplets and this IS something they do, that is by far the fastest way to spread it outside of open air coughing in a public space.


It's a theory but then you have to explain why countries such as Greece and Turkey don't nearly have as many cases (and as many deaths)

Edited: 3/15/20 11:11 AM
2/4/09
Posts: 10448
mataleo1 -
RightHandOfDOOM - 
mataleo1 -
MMA6053 - 

Thank you for this thread Mataleo.

I'm italian from Bari. I have friends and family currently doing it very tough over there.

I have just the one question I'm keen to hear yours or other medical professionals opinions on.

As has been noted, the Lombardy/Emilia Romagna region in Italy is one of the most modern, affluent regions in Italy if not Europe. The Italian health system is actually very good and well supported by the Govt.

So why ?..how ? Did this virus explode there of all places ??

 


Sorry to hear than man. Good luck to you.

No one knows for sure, but a few hypotheses are:
-Very dense population
-Many tourists
-Genetic predisposition
-Cultural norms (kissing on cheeks)
-Damaged mucous barriers (because of smoking)

I've been saying the cheek kissing thing was a big part of the problem in italy. This is the first time ive seen someone else mention it seriously. The truth is if it spreads by droplets and this IS something they do, that is by far the fastest way to spread it outside of open air coughing in a public space.


It's a theory but then you have to explain why countries such as Greece and Turkey don't nearly have as many cases (and as many deaths)

Turkey only has 9 cases. 

 

As of 2017 they had only 8% of the population over 65. They also have a negligible chinese population. Seems like they have a better demographic that italy in terms of risk.

 

They also might not be testing as much. 

 

Germany is another anomally 5,000 cases. Only 9 in serious condition and 10 deaths 

 

 

3/15/20 11:11 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2898
punchdrunkMMA - 

I appreciate your accessibility, OP, as well as your willingness to answer everyone's questions on top of all that you're already doing on the front lines.

Where would you draw the line between living life and isolating oneself? Clearly it's important to be aware and take precautions, but what about public places (restaurants, movie theaters, etc)? Avoid them altogether or just make sure to wash hands/sanitize/don't touch face? Do we assume it's everywhere even if a city/county and surrounding areas have no documented cases?

 


Thx. Just wanted to give my input as I wasn't fully supportive of many posts on here.

I live in NYC and Montreal. Both are still relatively spared so I do go out of the house, do my things, etc... I've stopped going to movie theaters, going to the gym, any place where I'd be close to many people around me. Take-out instead of restaurants. Hand sanitizers. I don't fear for my life at all but I have 150 dialysis patients and 2 sick parents that might tolerate getting it. I figure it's just a shitty time for everyone. So it's Netflix, research papers, online chess when I start my week off tomorrow.

I think it's safe to say that it'll be almost prevalent everywhere in a week or 2.

3/15/20 11:12 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2899
NoNeed4aScreenName - 
mataleo1 -
RightHandOfDOOM - 
mataleo1 -
MMA6053 - 

Thank you for this thread Mataleo.

I'm italian from Bari. I have friends and family currently doing it very tough over there.

I have just the one question I'm keen to hear yours or other medical professionals opinions on.

As has been noted, the Lombardy/Emilia Romagna region in Italy is one of the most modern, affluent regions in Italy if not Europe. The Italian health system is actually very good and well supported by the Govt.

So why ?..how ? Did this virus explode there of all places ??

 


Sorry to hear than man. Good luck to you.

No one knows for sure, but a few hypotheses are:
-Very dense population
-Many tourists
-Genetic predisposition
-Cultural norms (kissing on cheeks)
-Damaged mucous barriers (because of smoking)

I've been saying the cheek kissing thing was a big part of the problem in italy. This is the first time ive seen someone else mention it seriously. The truth is if it spreads by droplets and this IS something they do, that is by far the fastest way to spread it outside of open air coughing in a public space.


It's a theory but then you have to explain why countries such as Greece and Turkey don't nearly have as many cases (and as many deaths)

Turkey only has 9 cases. 

 

As of 2017 they had only 8% of the population over 65. They also have a negligible chinese population. Seems like they have a better demographic that italy in terms of risk.

 

They also might not be testing as much. 

 

Germany is another anomally 5,000 cases. Only 9 in serious condition and 10 deaths 

 

 


Great points and I agree: it's likely a compilation of factors for Italy.

3/15/20 11:14 AM
12/26/09
Posts: 6981
punchdrunkMMA -

I appreciate your accessibility, OP, as well as your willingness to answer everyone's questions on top of all that you're already doing on the front lines.

Where would you draw the line between living life and isolating oneself? Clearly it's important to be aware and take precautions, but what about public places (restaurants, movie theaters, etc)? Avoid them altogether or just make sure to wash hands/sanitize/don't touch face? Do we assume it's everywhere even if a city/county and surrounding areas have no documented cases?

 

I think I saw yesterday on the news that France is limiting people going to places like movies, restaurants, etc. anywhere that isn’t a “necessity”.

3/15/20 11:15 AM
8/26/11
Posts: 3887

The last 2 days I've experienced fatigue, headache, and chills.

No fever, coughing, difficulty of breathing

 

Think I just might have a cold? 

3/15/20 11:15 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2900
Jack Mahogoff - 
punchdrunkMMA -

I appreciate your accessibility, OP, as well as your willingness to answer everyone's questions on top of all that you're already doing on the front lines.

Where would you draw the line between living life and isolating oneself? Clearly it's important to be aware and take precautions, but what about public places (restaurants, movie theaters, etc)? Avoid them altogether or just make sure to wash hands/sanitize/don't touch face? Do we assume it's everywhere even if a city/county and surrounding areas have no documented cases?

 

I think I saw yesterday on the news that France is limiting people going to places like movies, restaurants, etc. anywhere that isn’t a “necessity”.


This is correct. Enforced as of today.

3/15/20 11:16 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2901
Kimbos Lice - 

The last 2 days I've experienced fatigue, headache, and chills.

No fever, coughing, difficulty of breathing

 

Think I just might have a cold? 


No fever, No cough, No difficulty = VERY UNLIKELY THIS IS COVID

3/15/20 11:45 AM
1/11/06
Posts: 7018

How about viral dose versus severity of symptoms? Is there any information in this - the thinking is that if you’re exposed to a large number of corona virus at the same time, you’ll be sicker than if you were exposed to a smidgen but just enough to infect you. Any truth to that?

3/15/20 11:48 AM
10/23/05
Posts: 2902
BZtown10 - 

What do you think about this video?  From 2018 


Hey BZ, good to see you on the thread. I already know your stance on vaccinations :)

I've read the paper and I actually know some of the authors. Don't want to derail the thread but here's an anwser.

Here's the link for full pdf: https://kopernio.com/viewer?doi=10.1371%2Fjournal.pmed.1000258&token=WzIxMzYzNSwiMTAuMTM3MS9qb3VybmFsLnBtZWQuMTAwMDI1OCJd.oOjFXf3YseAd6ie1EX3yeq3Bw4k

To be fair, there are 2 things here:
-Vaccination was protective against influenza (OR 0.4)
-Vaccination was associated with more medically attended H1N1 (OR 2.0)

H1N1 was a particularly virulent strain. Interesting data but subsequent studies did NOT show this association. And it's a far cry (if you read the paper) to suggest that vaccination may lead to an epidemic...

We can talk about it on the vaccination thread if the insults have stopped flying over there.