OtherGround Forums "Socialist" countries dominate quality of life

25 days ago
3/3/18
Posts: 9626
Le Shat V2 -
robert bentley - 

LeShat - You keep posting made up, cherry-picked, and nonsensical numbers from the Fraser institue. This part is particularly laughable:

"The Fraser Institute, a non-partisan think tank based in British Columbia, reports that the average two-adult family pays more than $12K annually. And it gets worse:"

Non-partisan?? Lol - they're funded by tobacco, oil, and the Koch brothers. The Fraser institute has had so much corporate cock in its throat it's bruised worse than a banana in an 8 year old's school back-pack. 

I've posted dozens of sources from international and independent organizations all converging on the same answer, and you find a corporate mouthpiece that "miraculously" says what you want? Get the fuck out of here lol.

That's like someone arguing against Evolution using "Answers In Genesis" as their go to source for "non-partisan" information.

What a joke.


LMAO, you have no refutation so you attack the source. yes conservatives are the ones lying, not the leftist who have blown their budgets and have a failing system, yet again.

Don't worry, your system will fail as all central planning has for a century.

Le Shat
©

Except oops these countries ALSO have lower debt per capita AND lower debt as a percentage of GDP. And our debt is getting worse, not better, thanks to President Genius Businessman. 

25 days ago
2/24/07
Posts: 28327
My cat is cuter than your cat - 
FrontBroRian -
robert bentley - 
FrontBroRian - 
jimmy23 - 
My cat is cuter than your cat - It's fascinating to watch the reactions of those who have been brainwashed into believing falsehoods while Robert Bentley completely dismantles all the usual conservative talking points one by one.

Its pretty humorous

 

They prefer emotions over facts


A libtard saying conservatives prefer emotions over facts ffs

My god this lack of awareness
 

Well - we currently have on this thread (LeShat) claiming that the governments of Norway, Sweden, France, U.K, Denmark etc. are all fascist. So there's that.

Now I'm all for calling out people on the left for overusing the word "Nazi" and claiming everyone on the right as Hitler, but if we're going to be balanced here - when someone on the right becomes unhinged and tries to claim concepts like Universal Healthcare as fascism I'm going to have to call them out too.

Hell - *I* get called alt-right, far-right, or even fascist by my lefty friends or acquaintances when I defend important concepts like Free Speech laws and principles.

But Let's not pretend that any side has a monopoly on tribalism. It's funny how often people think tribalism is a problem with the "other side".

I love the United States and think it's a wonderful country that's done many great things, but the current topic is an area where other countries have had a better idea and the idea is emblematic of one of the fundamental problems in the United States - corporate power. There is way too much of it, and corporate influence in the United States is far too ubiquitous. There are a million great and wonderful things about the United States - how much power they give to corporations isn't one of them.

Corporate influence has ruined the discussion on health care in the U.S, education, prison reform, and other areas where the lives of Americans could be immeasurably better. 

 


You’re talking about one particular person. I’m referring to the group that needed safe spaces in universities across the country, who were screaming at the sky, crying curled up in then fetal position in the corner of their rooms, etc.... all because they couldn’t emotionally handle not getting their way in an election

And yet you're also talking about one particular person. I have no idea who Jimmy is but I doubt he needs safe spaces or was screaming in the fetal position in the corner of the room. Yet the only retort you have is that he must not be self aware. Pretty funny that his "they prefer emotions over facts" comments has you projecting so much. ; )

PS: Keep up the epic dismantling, Robert. It's at the point where it's painful to read Le Shat's responses but also funny that this keeps going.


In no way was I referring to a particular person. If fact I clearly said “I’m referring to the group.”

Hope this helps
25 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 49429

Robert Bentley,

First off, full disclosure, from the parts of this thread that I've read, I definitely disagree with you. However, that being said, I'd like to better understand the foundation of your point of view. Do you have any books that you'd recommend to someone who wants to better understand the foundation of your views? 

Not some BS like the communist manifesto (unless you really think that addresses it well), but something more like how you view economics and the markets, and how you see Europe as better. 

Like for economics, I always recommend starting with Economics in One Lesson. What's the equivalent book that captures the foundation of your views. It's not going to change my mind, but I would like to better understand where someone with your views comes from.

From my side, as mentioned for economics, I always recommend Economics in One Lessson, followed by Thomas Sowell's Basic Economics for someone who wants to continue going deeper. 

I previously mentioned Debunking Utopia on this thread, and I still recommend it as light read on comparing Europe to the US and how Europe isn't as great as people make it out to be. 

Similarly, I recommend reading Primal Prescription for anyone looking for a deeper take on the US health system.

 

I enjoy reading when I can, and would greatly appreciate you recommending any books you've read that helped to educate you and form the foundation of your views 

25 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 10587
sicko - 

Robert Bentley,

First off, full disclosure, from the parts of this thread that I've read, I definitely disagree with you. However, that being said, I'd like to better understand the foundation of your point of view. Do you have any books that you'd recommend to someone who wants to better understand the foundation of your views? 

Not some BS like the communist manifesto (unless you really think that addresses it well), but something more like how you view economics and the markets, and how you see Europe as better. 

Like for economics, I always recommend starting with Economics in One Lesson. What's the equivalent book that captures the foundation of your views. It's not going to change my mind, but I would like to better understand where someone with your views comes from.

From my side, as mentioned for economics, I always recommend Economics in One Lessson, followed by Thomas Sowell's Basic Economics for someone who wants to continue going deeper. 

I previously mentioned Debunking Utopia on this thread, and I still recommend it as light read on comparing Europe to the US and how Europe isn't as great as people make it out to be. 

Similarly, I recommend reading Primal Prescription for anyone looking for a deeper take on the US health system.

 

I enjoy reading when I can, and would greatly appreciate you recommending any books you've read that helped to educate you and form the foundation of your views 


I love Thomas Sowell - Brilliant man. I don't need anyone to agree with everything I believe for me to appreciate their insight - and he's one of my favourite conservative thinkers to follow.

I've got a longer FRAT response if you're interested (with more recommendations for reading and academic sources) - but the short version is that I'm very much a free market capitalist, but one that doesn't believe *any* entity should become too powerful, and that the health of an economy should be judged by how well the people are doing, not by how much "stuff" or "money" is necessarily generated (a different number quite frequently).

 

24 days ago
11/13/14
Posts: 4482
Le Shat V2 -
robert bentley - 

LeShat - You keep posting made up, cherry-picked, and nonsensical numbers from the Fraser institue. This part is particularly laughable:

"The Fraser Institute, a non-partisan think tank based in British Columbia, reports that the average two-adult family pays more than $12K annually. And it gets worse:"

Non-partisan?? Lol - they're funded by tobacco, oil, and the Koch brothers. The Fraser institute has had so much corporate cock in its throat it's bruised worse than a banana in an 8 year old's school back-pack. 

I've posted dozens of sources from international and independent organizations all converging on the same answer, and you find a corporate mouthpiece that "miraculously" says what you want? Get the fuck out of here lol.

That's like someone arguing against Evolution using "Answers In Genesis" as their go to source for "non-partisan" information.

What a joke.


LMAO, you have no refutation so you attack the source. yes conservatives are the ones lying, not the leftist who have blown their budgets and have a failing system, yet again.

Don't worry, your system will fail as all central planning has for a century.

Le Shat
©

Mods, please ban this account. It is clearly the account of the same nitwit that posted as Munk. 

The tell here is glaring: using leftist when the correct way to make it plural would be leftists. Munk did the same dumb shit with words like socialist. He didn't understand the English language.

24 days ago
3/27/03
Posts: 43530
robert bentley -

"Which explains why Canada is such an economic and military powerhouse 

bring on the frat "

They're not a military powerhouse, and they do "okay" economically for a country with 35 million people but perhaps could do better. Your point?

Canadians live longer, healthier, and score higher on standardized education tests. Those don't meant anything to you compared to how many guns you have?

Factually speaking people all over the world would still rather come to America than Canada despite all your hysterical rambling... I guess everyone is wrong but you 

24 days ago
3/3/18
Posts: 9629
jacktripper - 
robert bentley -

"Which explains why Canada is such an economic and military powerhouse 

bring on the frat "

They're not a military powerhouse, and they do "okay" economically for a country with 35 million people but perhaps could do better. Your point?

Canadians live longer, healthier, and score higher on standardized education tests. Those don't meant anything to you compared to how many guns you have?

Factually speaking people all over the world would still rather come to America than Canada despite all your hysterical rambling... I guess everyone is wrong but you 


So when the rest of the world thinks Trump is garbage and the U.S. under him has terrible leadership, is losing its status in the world, going down the wrong path, etc, are they right? Or is everyone wrong but you? Just trying to see how consistent you are with your newfound respect for the feelings of foreigners as the ultimate argument-ender.

24 days ago
4/17/15
Posts: 5408

I've lived in the Netherlands and Finland both were very nice (in some ways much nicer than US) but they weren’t utopia. 

24 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 10588
jacktripper - 
robert bentley -

"Which explains why Canada is such an economic and military powerhouse 

bring on the frat "

They're not a military powerhouse, and they do "okay" economically for a country with 35 million people but perhaps could do better. Your point?

Canadians live longer, healthier, and score higher on standardized education tests. Those don't meant anything to you compared to how many guns you have?

Factually speaking people all over the world would still rather come to America than Canada despite all your hysterical rambling... I guess everyone is wrong but you 


Why did you use the term "Factually speaking"? You are referencing nothing more than a limited survey of people's opinions. This is your "fact"?

I've presented more than a dozen sources regarding things like better healthcare outcomes, and the *actual* facts like Canadians live longer, have fewer health problems, do better on standardized education tests, and fewer of their children die. These are all measurable facts. They also go along with things like fewer incarcerated citizens per capita and a few other details besides.

Now for some reason none of those actual facts are as important to you as a single survey of people's desires? 

This is like having a debate on evolution, and when someone posts mountains of data and facts - you respond with a survey showing that more than half of Americans don't believe in Evolution (depressingly, this isn't a hypothetical. Americans have trouble accepting evolution). You would then snidely retort - "I guess you must no better than all of those millions of Americans then eh?" 

In how many other areas of your life do you put the value of surveys over measurable data?

24 days ago
3/4/18
Posts: 438

People rather move to America because Canada is cold. Pretty simple. 

24 days ago
7/13/17
Posts: 4181

Now I know why orcus wants a socialist USA, bestiality:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/denmarks-bestiality-problem-its-legal

Edited: 24 days ago
2/2/12
Posts: 593
Kwang -
Le Shat V2 -
robert bentley - 

LeShat - You keep posting made up, cherry-picked, and nonsensical numbers from the Fraser institue. This part is particularly laughable:

"The Fraser Institute, a non-partisan think tank based in British Columbia, reports that the average two-adult family pays more than $12K annually. And it gets worse:"

Non-partisan?? Lol - they're funded by tobacco, oil, and the Koch brothers. The Fraser institute has had so much corporate cock in its throat it's bruised worse than a banana in an 8 year old's school back-pack. 

I've posted dozens of sources from international and independent organizations all converging on the same answer, and you find a corporate mouthpiece that "miraculously" says what you want? Get the fuck out of here lol.

That's like someone arguing against Evolution using "Answers In Genesis" as their go to source for "non-partisan" information.

What a joke.


LMAO, you have no refutation so you attack the source. yes conservatives are the ones lying, not the leftist who have blown their budgets and have a failing system, yet again.

Don't worry, your system will fail as all central planning has for a century.

Le Shat
©

Mods, please ban this account. It is clearly the account of the same nitwit that posted as Munk. 

The tell here is glaring: using leftist when the correct way to make it plural would be leftists. Munk did the same dumb shit with words like socialist. He didn't understand the English language.

What kind of loser can't find another place to spew his thoughts. Has to create a different account just to be able to post here? Lol

I guess this place is a safe haven for Assholes but seriously, is Munk/La Shit that desperate in life?

Edited: 18 days ago
11/20/05
Posts: 21892
Ill Portents - 

The 2019 Best Countries rankings, formed in partnership with BAV Group, a unit of global marketing communications company VMLY&R, and the Wharton School of the University of Pennsylvania, are based on a study that surveyed more than 20,000 global citizens from four regions to assess perceptions of 80 countries on 75 different metrics. The Quality of Life subranking is based on an equally weighted average of scores from nine country attributes that relate to quality of life in a country: affordable, a good job market, economically stable, family friendly, income equality, politically stable, safe, well-developed public education system and well-developed public health system. The Quality of Life subranking score had a 17 percent weight in the overall Best Countries ranking.


 


 


1. Canada - No change for past 4 years


2. Sweden - Up 1 from # 3 in 2018


3. Denmark - Down 1 from # 2 in 2018


4. Norway - No change from 2018


5. Switzerland - Up 1 from # 6 in 2018


6. Finland - Up 1 from # 7 in 2018


7. Australia - Down 2 from # 5 in 2018


8. Netherlands - No change from 2018


9. New Zealand - No change from 2018


10. Germany - No change from 2018


 



 For the fourth consecutive year, Canada ranks No. 1 overall for providing a good quality of life. Survey respondents view the North American country as No. 1 for both being politically stable and having a well-developed public education system, and No. 2 for having a good job market, a perception supported by independent research. The North American country is seen as possessing the fifth best well-developed public health care system. In fact, Canada is rated in the top 10 in all but one of the nine attributes, affordability, where Asian countries dominate.


 



 


For the second year in a row, the United States ranks No. 17 overall by survey respondents for providing a good quality of life. Its highest ranking is for its job market, where it ranks first. Its lowest ranking came in affordability, where survey responses placed it No. 56.

These countries achieved that top status when they were culturally and racially monolithic entities with a positive and in most cases Germanic work ethic with high productivity AND severe tariffs. The USE of many of the benefits was also very low in the Scandinavian countries. Their systems would be grossly abused in the U.S.
24 days ago
7/23/08
Posts: 2771

White people also dominate those countries...

24 days ago
9/27/07
Posts: 5744
Ill Portents -
jacktripper - 
robert bentley -

"Which explains why Canada is such an economic and military powerhouse 

bring on the frat "

They're not a military powerhouse, and they do "okay" economically for a country with 35 million people but perhaps could do better. Your point?

Canadians live longer, healthier, and score higher on standardized education tests. Those don't meant anything to you compared to how many guns you have?

Factually speaking people all over the world would still rather come to America than Canada despite all your hysterical rambling... I guess everyone is wrong but you 


So when the rest of the world thinks Trump is garbage and the U.S. under him has terrible leadership, is losing its status in the world, going down the wrong path, etc, are they right? Or is everyone wrong but you? Just trying to see how consistent you are with your newfound respect for the feelings of foreigners as the ultimate argument-ender.

The "rest of the world"... did you miss the HK protestors waiving the US flag?

 

Keep smoking pole, pole boy....

 

 

Hope this helps. 

24 days ago
6/22/13
Posts: 1142

Canadian here and I travel a lot in the US for work.  Just got back from a work trip travelling around Norway.  What a beautiful country... healthy, happy educated people everywhere (barely saw a fat Norwegian)... towns are clean with good infrastructure... industry is thriving. 

In comparison, US cities are much dirtier, with crumbling infrastructure with obese zombies roaming around.... it was such a stark difference and you really have to ask yourself... what happened to you USA?  For a country that is so much younger, with amazing innovation and considerably richer than Norway, why can’t you get your shit together?  

24 days ago
8/2/19
Posts: 61
Ill Portents -
jacktripper - 
robert bentley -

"Which explains why Canada is such an economic and military powerhouse 

bring on the frat "

They're not a military powerhouse, and they do "okay" economically for a country with 35 million people but perhaps could do better. Your point?

Canadians live longer, healthier, and score higher on standardized education tests. Those don't meant anything to you compared to how many guns you have?

Factually speaking people all over the world would still rather come to America than Canada despite all your hysterical rambling... I guess everyone is wrong but you 


So when the rest of the world thinks Trump is garbage and the U.S. under him has terrible leadership, is losing its status in the world, going down the wrong path, etc, are they right? Or is everyone wrong but you? Just trying to see how consistent you are with your newfound respect for the feelings of foreigners as the ultimate argument-ender.

Not that Europe is 'the world' - but the relatively recent wins by right wing (nationalist) political parties suggests that the people of these countries sympathise with Trump-like characters more than you might think.

23 days ago
7/4/13
Posts: 1761
jspeed - 
Ill Portents -
jacktripper - 
robert bentley -

"Which explains why Canada is such an economic and military powerhouse 

bring on the frat "

They're not a military powerhouse, and they do "okay" economically for a country with 35 million people but perhaps could do better. Your point?

Canadians live longer, healthier, and score higher on standardized education tests. Those don't meant anything to you compared to how many guns you have?

Factually speaking people all over the world would still rather come to America than Canada despite all your hysterical rambling... I guess everyone is wrong but you 


So when the rest of the world thinks Trump is garbage and the U.S. under him has terrible leadership, is losing its status in the world, going down the wrong path, etc, are they right? Or is everyone wrong but you? Just trying to see how consistent you are with your newfound respect for the feelings of foreigners as the ultimate argument-ender.

Not that Europe is 'the world' - but the relatively recent wins by right wing (nationalist) political parties suggests that the people of these countries sympathise with Trump-like characters more than you might think.


It's a movement. When something happens in the US, the rest of the world sees. There is a problem now in the EU, and South America, with politicians modelling themselves after Trump, ort adjusting themselves to suit. Let's hope it's contained, because in essense it comes down to "strong man" projections which have always led to war with neighbours throughout history. It's a kind of nostalgic throw-back to a century ago, and those with sense in the populace need to try and contain it. It counters all progress made in the last 50 years. People are wise enough to step around it, I believe.

23 days ago
7/4/13
Posts: 1762

And that's not to mention Russia's ever present tentacles in Europe, which need to be protected against and fought constantly. There is a lot to fight against. We have no need to turn our focus within our free & democratic countries, when looking at the big picture.