OtherGround Forums The reason Kobe's helicopter crashed, new details

23 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 43561
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. -
pfsjkd -
thedogofdogs -
Erik Apple -
grenade whistle - Conditions were not suitable for flying, according to Los Angeles police who grounded their own choppers. But Kobe Bryant's pilot wanted to fly anyway and requested to abandon IFR (instrument flight rules) in favor of flying under visual flight rules (VFR), and ascended, or climbed to more than 2,000 feet, in what appeared to be an attempt to put some space between helicopter and terrain, and then crashed. He needed to climb to see what's below him BUT INSTEAD OF REVERTING TO IFR, HE CONTINUED FLYING UNDER VFR and this is why he crashed.

In addition to this, Kobe's helicopter was NOT equipped with TAWS (Terrain Avoidance Warning System). For years the NTSB has been recommending it on large passenger helicopters, but the FAA has not yet ordered it to be mandatory. The chopper did also not have black boxes, a cockpit voice or flight data recorder that could have provided critical information about why the pilot crashed. Kobe's helicopter was built in 1991 and his pilot had over 8,200 flying hours as of July 2019.

Flightradar24 visual map and last air traffic control


About TAWS technology

None of that explains why they dropped 1500 or 2000 feet in a minute or less....

Main rotor failure is the only reason.

 

If it was 'main rotor failure' at the altitude where it started to descend, the debris would be scattered over a much wider area. The rotors would have come down away from the main wreckage. Nobody has said this is a possibility. 

a dude that experienced would autorotate that fucker and land on a cunt hair

100% wrong. Autorotations that precise take constant practice. Guaranteed he's not taking an S-76 down to the ground on multiple autos per day. Most likely the only touchdown autos that pilot had done in the aircraft were in the simulator.  

23 days ago
11/18/15
Posts: 5743
thedogofdogs -
pfsjkd -
thedogofdogs -
Cuckoldberry Finn -
thedogofdogs -
grenade whistle - Conditions were not suitable for flying, according to Los Angeles police who grounded their own choppers. But Kobe Bryant's pilot wanted to fly anyway and requested to abandon IFR (instrument flight rules) in favor of flying under visual flight rules (VFR), and ascended, or climbed to more than 2,000 feet, in what appeared to be an attempt to put some space between helicopter and terrain, and then crashed. He needed to climb to see what's below him BUT INSTEAD OF REVERTING TO IFR, HE CONTINUED FLYING UNDER VFR and this is why he crashed.

In addition to this, Kobe's helicopter was NOT equipped with TAWS (Terrain Avoidance Warning System). For years the NTSB has been recommending it on large passenger helicopters, but the FAA has not yet ordered it to be mandatory. The chopper did also not have black boxes, a cockpit voice or flight data recorder that could have provided critical information about why the pilot crashed. Kobe's helicopter was built in 1991 and his pilot had over 8,200 flying hours as of July 2019.

Flightradar24 visual map and last air traffic control


About TAWS technology

ive flown in over a 100 helicopters, the only reason you would drop that fast is mechanical failure.

The main rotor losing power.

 

well I'm beginning to question your experience.  if the main rotor simply loses power the descent is slowed by the helicopter falling from the sky.  when the main rotor loses power tou pick an airspeed and fly to it, since you dont have power you are falling.  as you are falling the air package you are descending through is spinning the rotors, think blowing on a fan.  when the aircraft is falling and the relative wind is driving the rotor system it causes the torque on the gearbox to reverse and there is a mechanism that decouples the main rotor from the drive system.  this is why autorotation works.

 

the 76 is an old design but only a total gearbox failure would realistically bring it down.  

 

if the pilot was disoriented he could have unknowingly ended up inverted, pulled the collective like you would usually do to climb and drive himself into the dirt.  there is case studies done on this exact thing were unintentional inversion has cause massive altitude losses in short periods of time

The wreck when i was in, they said it was mechanical failure, grounded the fleet, changed some of training schedule.

You guys trying to blame the pilot, when you have no evidence is sad.

Things break, the gentleman was a very experienced pilot, not one who would lose control, unless something had gone wrong with the chopper itself.

Are you a pilot?? We're playing the odds, not tying to shit on the pilot. The facts are that pilot error accounts for the vast majority of aircraft mishaps. Mechanical failure accounts for much less. 
 

If he had mechanical failure he would have likely made a mayday call about it. He didn't. This suggests that he was fighting the aircraft himself.

And when a friend of of one the family reads something like this, and passes it onto the family?

 

Have some class.

 

Theres 50 million other things you could be discussing.

 

No one knows until the official report comes out.

This is definitely one of the most classless threads ive ever seen on here.

someone says this exact same thing whenever the cause on a crash is speculated upon.  

 

and in most cases you are right.  the media doesn't know Jack shit about aviation.  fucking don lemon theorized mh370 was sucked up by a black hole... so yeah that type of speculation is harmful and lacks class.

we live this every day.  I've lost enough friends over the years to consider leaving aviation twice.  the first few fatal accidents I lost close friends in were the worst days of my life.  

I guess in part because we are industry insiders we might be desensitized to a degree to the deaths that come as a surprise to unsuspecting consumers but as we live it we become keenly interested and aware of how and why these accidents happen.  accidents can be extremely valuable learning tools but being industry insider we see certain patterns that repeat.  it is actually essential because if we cant count on repeating patterns we cant operate safely.

this case fits a pattern we have seen countless times before.  the available data points to spatial disorientation leading to controlled flight into terrain.  that isnt speculation in bad faith, that is the logical conclusion given the available data.  other data or new data may come out for sure, but the most likely cause of that accident was what we are telling you.

what is unlikely is a main rotor failure, speculation you were happy to offer to a certainty before you criticized PJk.... for doing the same.

 

23 days ago
11/18/15
Posts: 5744
pfsjkd -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. -
pfsjkd -
thedogofdogs -
Erik Apple -
grenade whistle - Conditions were not suitable for flying, according to Los Angeles police who grounded their own choppers. But Kobe Bryant's pilot wanted to fly anyway and requested to abandon IFR (instrument flight rules) in favor of flying under visual flight rules (VFR), and ascended, or climbed to more than 2,000 feet, in what appeared to be an attempt to put some space between helicopter and terrain, and then crashed. He needed to climb to see what's below him BUT INSTEAD OF REVERTING TO IFR, HE CONTINUED FLYING UNDER VFR and this is why he crashed.

In addition to this, Kobe's helicopter was NOT equipped with TAWS (Terrain Avoidance Warning System). For years the NTSB has been recommending it on large passenger helicopters, but the FAA has not yet ordered it to be mandatory. The chopper did also not have black boxes, a cockpit voice or flight data recorder that could have provided critical information about why the pilot crashed. Kobe's helicopter was built in 1991 and his pilot had over 8,200 flying hours as of July 2019.

Flightradar24 visual map and last air traffic control


About TAWS technology

None of that explains why they dropped 1500 or 2000 feet in a minute or less....

Main rotor failure is the only reason.

 

If it was 'main rotor failure' at the altitude where it started to descend, the debris would be scattered over a much wider area. The rotors would have come down away from the main wreckage. Nobody has said this is a possibility. 

a dude that experienced would autorotate that fucker and land on a cunt hair

100% wrong. Autorotations that precise take constant practice. Guaranteed he's not taking an S-76 down to the ground on multiple autos per day. Most likely the only touchdown autos that pilot had done in the aircraft were in the simulator.  

I've been working around 76s for the past 8 years and I've never seen them attempt a simulated auto where I'm at

Edited: 23 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 43562
thedogofdogs -
pfsjkd -
thedogofdogs -
Cuckoldberry Finn -
thedogofdogs -
grenade whistle - Conditions were not suitable for flying, according to Los Angeles police who grounded their own choppers. But Kobe Bryant's pilot wanted to fly anyway and requested to abandon IFR (instrument flight rules) in favor of flying under visual flight rules (VFR), and ascended, or climbed to more than 2,000 feet, in what appeared to be an attempt to put some space between helicopter and terrain, and then crashed. He needed to climb to see what's below him BUT INSTEAD OF REVERTING TO IFR, HE CONTINUED FLYING UNDER VFR and this is why he crashed.

In addition to this, Kobe's helicopter was NOT equipped with TAWS (Terrain Avoidance Warning System). For years the NTSB has been recommending it on large passenger helicopters, but the FAA has not yet ordered it to be mandatory. The chopper did also not have black boxes, a cockpit voice or flight data recorder that could have provided critical information about why the pilot crashed. Kobe's helicopter was built in 1991 and his pilot had over 8,200 flying hours as of July 2019.

Flightradar24 visual map and last air traffic control


About TAWS technology

ive flown in over a 100 helicopters, the only reason you would drop that fast is mechanical failure.

The main rotor losing power.

 

well I'm beginning to question your experience.  if the main rotor simply loses power the descent is slowed by the helicopter falling from the sky.  when the main rotor loses power tou pick an airspeed and fly to it, since you dont have power you are falling.  as you are falling the air package you are descending through is spinning the rotors, think blowing on a fan.  when the aircraft is falling and the relative wind is driving the rotor system it causes the torque on the gearbox to reverse and there is a mechanism that decouples the main rotor from the drive system.  this is why autorotation works.

 

the 76 is an old design but only a total gearbox failure would realistically bring it down.  

 

if the pilot was disoriented he could have unknowingly ended up inverted, pulled the collective like you would usually do to climb and drive himself into the dirt.  there is case studies done on this exact thing were unintentional inversion has cause massive altitude losses in short periods of time

The wreck when i was in, they said it was mechanical failure, grounded the fleet, changed some of training schedule.

You guys trying to blame the pilot, when you have no evidence is sad.

Things break, the gentleman was a very experienced pilot, not one who would lose control, unless something had gone wrong with the chopper itself.

Are you a pilot?? We're playing the odds, not tying to shit on the pilot. The facts are that pilot error accounts for the vast majority of aircraft mishaps. Mechanical failure accounts for much less. 
 

If he had mechanical failure he would have likely made a mayday call about it. He didn't. This suggests that he was fighting the aircraft himself.

And when a friend of of one the family reads something like this, and passes it onto the family?

 

Have some class.

 

Theres 50 million other things you could be discussing.

 

No one knows until the official report comes out.

This is definitely one of the most classless threads ive ever seen on here.

As Finn said, your speculation is no more satisfying than pilot error. Millions of people all over the world are speculating.  But you're worried Kobe's family is gonna read this particular thread and get upset? Bitch, please. 

23 days ago
11/18/15
Posts: 5745

that being said a guy who operates a smaller machine like an a-star or a Hughes 500 might actually be able to pull it off.  those guys do train that shit all the time because of the environments they operate in. 

23 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 43563
Cuckoldberry Finn -
pfsjkd -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. -
pfsjkd -
thedogofdogs -
Erik Apple -
grenade whistle - Conditions were not suitable for flying, according to Los Angeles police who grounded their own choppers. But Kobe Bryant's pilot wanted to fly anyway and requested to abandon IFR (instrument flight rules) in favor of flying under visual flight rules (VFR), and ascended, or climbed to more than 2,000 feet, in what appeared to be an attempt to put some space between helicopter and terrain, and then crashed. He needed to climb to see what's below him BUT INSTEAD OF REVERTING TO IFR, HE CONTINUED FLYING UNDER VFR and this is why he crashed.

In addition to this, Kobe's helicopter was NOT equipped with TAWS (Terrain Avoidance Warning System). For years the NTSB has been recommending it on large passenger helicopters, but the FAA has not yet ordered it to be mandatory. The chopper did also not have black boxes, a cockpit voice or flight data recorder that could have provided critical information about why the pilot crashed. Kobe's helicopter was built in 1991 and his pilot had over 8,200 flying hours as of July 2019.

Flightradar24 visual map and last air traffic control


About TAWS technology

None of that explains why they dropped 1500 or 2000 feet in a minute or less....

Main rotor failure is the only reason.

 

If it was 'main rotor failure' at the altitude where it started to descend, the debris would be scattered over a much wider area. The rotors would have come down away from the main wreckage. Nobody has said this is a possibility. 

a dude that experienced would autorotate that fucker and land on a cunt hair

100% wrong. Autorotations that precise take constant practice. Guaranteed he's not taking an S-76 down to the ground on multiple autos per day. Most likely the only touchdown autos that pilot had done in the aircraft were in the simulator.  

I've been working around 76s for the past 8 years and I've never seen them attempt a simulated auto where I'm at

Because the owner would fire the shit out of any pilot who put their $14 million aircraft in danger of crashing by doing an autorotation. 

23 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 43564
Cuckoldberry Finn -

that being said a guy who operates a smaller machine like an a-star or a Hughes 500 might actually be able to pull it off.  those guys do train that shit all the time because of the environments they operate in. 

A big chunk of my time is MD500 and Astar. The only time I can practice autos is about twice per year. And only on one of those occasions can I do full touchdowns. 
 

The only pilots who can auto a helicopter on a cunt hair are flight instructors who are doing them every day, day in and day out. And they're not doing them in $14 million dollar machines generating huge revenues. 

23 days ago
6/28/09
Posts: 2214
pfsjkd -
LiveWire -

Scudrun? Cfit?

Scud running is when an aircraft tries to fly low around and/or under the clouds. It's a dangerous activity because it increases the chances of the aircraft hitting something (wires, terrain, etc.). 
 

CFIT = Controlled Flight Into Terrain. Happens when the pilot(s) get distracted and don't realize the aircraft is approaching rising terrain or descending into it.

This.  A scud run that went VFR to inadvertent IMC into rising terrain = flying a perfectly good aircraft into the side of a hill.  Certainly not the first time, and unfortunately won't be the last time. Not much to speculate or debate on this one. 

Edited: 23 days ago
11/18/15
Posts: 5746
pfsjkd -
Cuckoldberry Finn -

that being said a guy who operates a smaller machine like an a-star or a Hughes 500 might actually be able to pull it off.  those guys do train that shit all the time because of the environments they operate in. 

A big chunk of my time is MD500 and Astar. The only time I can practice autos is about twice per year. And only on one of those occasions can I do full touchdowns. 
 

The only pilots who can auto a helicopter on a cunt hair are flight instructors who are doing them every day, day in and day out. And they're not doing them in $14 million dollar machines generating huge revenues. 

probably the result of a different environments.  where I'm at they're always doing company recurrent training because of the terrain we have around us.  different risk profiles = different training schemes.  by no means is it realistic to expect a pilot to execute a perfect autorotation onto a cunt hair even if they did train it every day, I guess the only guys I've seen with that skill are a few guys who fly light helicopters and practice all the time.

a 76b isnt a 14m helicopter though. you can get an "airworthy" 76b for 700k all day.  it was reported that kobe (or whoever owns that ship now) paid 595,00 for it.

still not something you would do simulated autos with though.. they're so reliable you dont really need it in the real world because if you need it it's pretty much already too late.  I believe the 76 has derated engines and when one fails the fuel control unit allows the operating engine to exceed 100% to compensate for the loss at around 70 percent of the total shaft horsepower available with both engines running.  they dont usually just crash.

 

23 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 43565

^Wiki has the unit cost as $13 mil as if 2014. That's probably brand new. 

23 days ago
12/4/18
Posts: 4680

So it's the fault of the overzealous pilot? 

23 days ago
11/18/15
Posts: 5747
pfsjkd -

^Wiki has the unit cost as $13 mil as if 2014. That's probably brand new. 

that would be brand new.  controller.com has three or four right now.  in the sub million dollar range. I work next to a 76 operator and they're always talking about how all the airframes are old and they're really expensive to keep in the air but they also say it's an amazing machine so... I guess it's like every other helicopter pretty much

Edited: 23 days ago
11/18/15
Posts: 5748
God Of Thunder -

So it's the fault of the overzealous pilot? 

that's unfair.  he wasn't going out that day to crash.  usually in these situations it comes down you were good until you weren't.  

it's hard to explain but when you're looking at the ground and it disappears into a white light it's like being put in a dep tank, you cant feel what's going on.  pretty much the second that happens you are fucked.

the whole scudrunning thing is just about how we view people who do it, cowboy mentality, but to be fair it's been pointed out that there is no visibility requirements under special vfr so he didnt really break any laws and in aviation legal=safe

23 days ago
6/28/09
Posts: 2215
Cuckoldberry Finn -
God Of Thunder -

So it's the fault of the overzealous pilot? 

that's unfair.  he wasn't going out that day to crash.  usually in these situations it comes down you were good until you weren't.  

it's hard to explain but when you're looking at the ground and it disappears into a white light it's like being put in a dep tank, you cant feel what's going on.  pretty much the second that happens you are fucked.

the whole scudrunning thing is just about how we view people who do it, cowboy mentality, but to be fair it's been pointed out that there is no visibility requirements under special vfr so he didnt really break any laws and in aviation legal=safe

That's not unfair at all. 

23 days ago
12/1/10
Posts: 4486
pfsjkd - 
Cuckoldberry Finn -

that being said a guy who operates a smaller machine like an a-star or a Hughes 500 might actually be able to pull it off.  those guys do train that shit all the time because of the environments they operate in. 

A big chunk of my time is MD500 and Astar. The only time I can practice autos is about twice per year. And only on one of those occasions can I do full touchdowns. 
 

The only pilots who can auto a helicopter on a cunt hair are flight instructors who are doing them every day, day in and day out. And they're not doing them in $14 million dollar machines generating huge revenues. 


I was a ch-46 crew chief in the usmc we did tons of autos. had to always strap down everything in the back. fucking pilots would do them over and over again.


we also flew at night in rain, fog, lighting storms, snow storms ect ect. lights out on nvg googles.
we landed on oil rigs at night full lights out with cables swaying everywhere dropping recon and seals. did zodiac boat drops with the back end in the water.
23 days ago
1/24/16
Posts: 38
Cuckoldberry Finn - 
God Of Thunder -

So it's the fault of the overzealous pilot? 

that's unfair.  he wasn't going out that day to crash.  usually in these situations it comes down you were good until you weren't.  

it's hard to explain but when you're looking at the ground and it disappears into a white light it's like being put in a dep tank, you cant feel what's going on.  pretty much the second that happens you are fucked.

the whole scudrunning thing is just about how we view people who do it, cowboy mentality, but to be fair it's been pointed out that there is no visibility requirements under special vfr so he didnt really break any laws and in aviation legal=safe


Yeah its crazy how quickly you get a vertigo like feeling going into clouds or fog, and unless you are flying instrument all the time even a rated pilot can get confused. and trying to go ifr instantly almost never works out, a person can start to not believe their instruments and end up in a dive instantly. I have flown in Ak for most of my life and been pilot for 20 years recreationally and have lost 10-12 good friends and honestly I cant think of a single one that was mechanical. They were all pilot error.
It happens we all make mistakes some are just not recoverable, the last friend of mine that got killed was a guy and his wife who had been flying up here since the late 50s he was scudrunning and got caught in a canyon and tried to turn out of it but ended up pancaking near the top of the mountain killing him and his wife. He had at least 30,000 hours flying up here (he was in his 70s when this happened).
23 days ago
11/18/15
Posts: 5750
Gift from God -
Cuckoldberry Finn - 
God Of Thunder -

So it's the fault of the overzealous pilot? 

that's unfair.  he wasn't going out that day to crash.  usually in these situations it comes down you were good until you weren't.  

it's hard to explain but when you're looking at the ground and it disappears into a white light it's like being put in a dep tank, you cant feel what's going on.  pretty much the second that happens you are fucked.

the whole scudrunning thing is just about how we view people who do it, cowboy mentality, but to be fair it's been pointed out that there is no visibility requirements under special vfr so he didnt really break any laws and in aviation legal=safe


Yeah its crazy how quickly you get a vertigo like feeling going into clouds or fog, and unless you are flying instrument all the time even a rated pilot can get confused. and trying to go ifr instantly almost never works out, a person can start to not believe their instruments and end up in a dive instantly. I have flown in Ak for most of my life and been pilot for 20 years recreationally and have lost 10-12 good friends and honestly I cant think of a single one that was mechanical. They were all pilot error.
It happens we all make mistakes some are just not recoverable, the last friend of mine that got killed was a guy and his wife who had been flying up here since the late 50s he was scudrunning and got caught in a canyon and tried to turn out of it but ended up pancaking near the top of the mountain killing him and his wife. He had at least 30,000 hours flying up here (he was in his 70s when this happened).

you guys had a rough season last year.  ketchikan got beat hard last summer.  here's to a better season.  

23 days ago
1/24/16
Posts: 39
Cuckoldberry Finn - 
Gift from God -
Cuckoldberry Finn - 
God Of Thunder -

So it's the fault of the overzealous pilot? 

that's unfair.  he wasn't going out that day to crash.  usually in these situations it comes down you were good until you weren't.  

it's hard to explain but when you're looking at the ground and it disappears into a white light it's like being put in a dep tank, you cant feel what's going on.  pretty much the second that happens you are fucked.

the whole scudrunning thing is just about how we view people who do it, cowboy mentality, but to be fair it's been pointed out that there is no visibility requirements under special vfr so he didnt really break any laws and in aviation legal=safe


Yeah its crazy how quickly you get a vertigo like feeling going into clouds or fog, and unless you are flying instrument all the time even a rated pilot can get confused. and trying to go ifr instantly almost never works out, a person can start to not believe their instruments and end up in a dive instantly. I have flown in Ak for most of my life and been pilot for 20 years recreationally and have lost 10-12 good friends and honestly I cant think of a single one that was mechanical. They were all pilot error.
It happens we all make mistakes some are just not recoverable, the last friend of mine that got killed was a guy and his wife who had been flying up here since the late 50s he was scudrunning and got caught in a canyon and tried to turn out of it but ended up pancaking near the top of the mountain killing him and his wife. He had at least 30,000 hours flying up here (he was in his 70s when this happened).

you guys had a rough season last year.  ketchikan got beat hard last summer.  here's to a better season.  


yeah unfortunatley most of those were weather related coupled with the tour companies hiring out of state low time pilots.. up here the majority of plane crashes happen from tour operators , or in the end of summer right before hunting season. Thats when everyone who hasn't been flying all year decides its time to go scouting for moose or sheep. Then start circling one at low altitude and get into a moose stall aka stall/spin. no recovery from that at low altitude = pilot error.
Sure mechanical failures happen but we are flying 70+ year old planes with pretty much non existent FAA oversight and they rarely have issues, So I can't imagine what the upkeep and oversight would be like in such a high profile area.
23 days ago
9/3/18
Posts: 1240

Studies show on average you have 178 seconds to live flying into clouds and not going to instruments . It sounds weird, but your body can't tell when you are in a serious bank with no outside references (in cloud). Its hard to describe unless youve felt it, but it's 100% real. This absolutely sounds like spatial disorientation. 

23 days ago
10/27/03
Posts: 25348
Middleman747 -

Studies show on average you have 178 seconds to live flying into clouds and not going to instruments . It sounds weird, but your body can't tell when you are in a serious bank with no outside references (in cloud). Its hard to describe unless youve felt it, but it's 100% real. This absolutely sounds like spatial disorientation. 

That's what happened to JFK Jr right?

Flying at night over water with no way to tell the difference between sky and sea.

23 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 8064

i am surprised the ball playing rapist didnt have a little escape pod like a bond villian.

Edited: 23 days ago
2/22/11
Posts: 20017
pfsjkd -

The pilot almost certainly fucked up but people are making too much hay about the fact that the Sheriff's had 'grounded' their helicopters due to the weather. 
 

Special VFR is not all that special.  Pilots use it all the time in marginal weather conditions with no adverse issues. The Sheriff's Office has a different mission that is generally done at a lower altitude and thus, requires a little more safety margin than general or commercial aviation. 
 

Where the pilot probably fucked up is not realizing that he had actually lost sight of the ground and immediately transitioning to instrument flight. The S-76 is almost certainly rated for it as was the pilot. He most likely suffered spatial disorientation and inadvertently allowed the aircraft to begin an unrecoverable rate of descent. I think that the investigation will show that in the last seconds of the flight he made some corrective action (pulled the nose up, increased power, etc.) after passing through a height that allowed him to see the ground again, but didn't have the altitude to recover. 
 

And it's highly doubtful that he would have asked Kobe's permission to go back. If he felt it was too dangerous to continue, as the pilot in command he most likely would have made a unilateral decision to turn back. You don't poll the passengers on a safety issue. 

The disorientation makes sense. Don't know shit about aviation, but my friends who are in the AF said the same exact thing as you. Didn't realize this was a common occurrence.

Edited: 23 days ago
12/2/05
Posts: 86506

None of these are new details not to be a dick. 

23 days ago
11/14/16
Posts: 2700
Cuckoldberry Finn -
pfsjkd -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. -
pfsjkd -
thedogofdogs -
Erik Apple -
grenade whistle - Conditions were not suitable for flying, according to Los Angeles police who grounded their own choppers. But Kobe Bryant's pilot wanted to fly anyway and requested to abandon IFR (instrument flight rules) in favor of flying under visual flight rules (VFR), and ascended, or climbed to more than 2,000 feet, in what appeared to be an attempt to put some space between helicopter and terrain, and then crashed. He needed to climb to see what's below him BUT INSTEAD OF REVERTING TO IFR, HE CONTINUED FLYING UNDER VFR and this is why he crashed.

In addition to this, Kobe's helicopter was NOT equipped with TAWS (Terrain Avoidance Warning System). For years the NTSB has been recommending it on large passenger helicopters, but the FAA has not yet ordered it to be mandatory. The chopper did also not have black boxes, a cockpit voice or flight data recorder that could have provided critical information about why the pilot crashed. Kobe's helicopter was built in 1991 and his pilot had over 8,200 flying hours as of July 2019.

Flightradar24 visual map and last air traffic control


About TAWS technology

None of that explains why they dropped 1500 or 2000 feet in a minute or less....

Main rotor failure is the only reason.

 

If it was 'main rotor failure' at the altitude where it started to descend, the debris would be scattered over a much wider area. The rotors would have come down away from the main wreckage. Nobody has said this is a possibility. 

a dude that experienced would autorotate that fucker and land on a cunt hair

100% wrong. Autorotations that precise take constant practice. Guaranteed he's not taking an S-76 down to the ground on multiple autos per day. Most likely the only touchdown autos that pilot had done in the aircraft were in the simulator.  

I've been working around 76s for the past 8 years and I've never seen them attempt a simulated auto where I'm at

No way they practice a dangerous emergency procedure like that on an aging helicopter. It would be in a trainer if at all. In this case it would not likely have made a difference unless the info trickling out of the investigation is completely wrong. 

Edited: 23 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 43566
HTMNDN -
pfsjkd - 
Cuckoldberry Finn -

that being said a guy who operates a smaller machine like an a-star or a Hughes 500 might actually be able to pull it off.  those guys do train that shit all the time because of the environments they operate in. 

A big chunk of my time is MD500 and Astar. The only time I can practice autos is about twice per year. And only on one of those occasions can I do full touchdowns. 
 

The only pilots who can auto a helicopter on a cunt hair are flight instructors who are doing them every day, day in and day out. And they're not doing them in $14 million dollar machines generating huge revenues. 


I was a ch-46 crew chief in the usmc we did tons of autos. had to always strap down everything in the back. fucking pilots would do them over and over again.


we also flew at night in rain, fog, lighting storms, snow storms ect ect. lights out on nvg googles.
we landed on oil rigs at night full lights out with cables swaying everywhere dropping recon and seals. did zodiac boat drops with the back end in the water.

You didn't do full touchdown autos. Power recovery autos (also called termination to a hover in the civilian world) were the only ones allowed. Full touchdowns are prohibited in the Navy outside of the Training Command. Power recoveries only go so far as a training tool. But they're less dangerous than full touchdowns. 
 

And at one time the Army even stopped doing power recovery autos because of the risk involved. They were only allowed to do autos in the simulator. That rule may stil be in effect.