OtherGround Forums Trump to NRA: no Universal background checks

28 days ago
10/30/14
Posts: 3075

So what IS Trump going to do?

28 days ago
3/6/06
Posts: 29237
8flat - 

In all seriousness, NRA and Trump are making a mistake by not tackling the gunshow loophole.  Most americans, even NRA members, would get behind that IMO.


Closing it also used to be NRA dogma.

That said, I wish they would just end all background checks of any sort.
Edited: 28 days ago
1/25/07
Posts: 2630
Fake Pie -
dabigchet -
AnthonyWeiner - There is no such thing as a "Gun Show Loophole". Completely made-up bullshit.

its a stupid name, but the concept of universal background check is not complicated. all gun sales, except for transfers within families, should go through the same background checks as one bought at a store.

There's a commerce clause issue with this being done at a federal level IMO. Won't stop anything either IMO. which shooter would have been foiled by such a system? 

see above

 

Adam lanza, parkland shooter and aurora shooter. All three were in the mental health system. In Canada for instance, if you are in the mental health system you are flagged. You could go see a mental health expert for anxiety once and anyone with access to your medical records will be able to see it like a police record. someone seeing a professional for violent tendencies (aurora) or someone who has had contact with professional's by making threats in the school system( parkland) would be flagged in a federal system like Canada's.

 

 

The parkland shooter wasn't allowed to carry backpacks at school but was allowed to buy a gun to put things in perspective. 

28 days ago
6/13/03
Posts: 23782
dabigchet -
Trust -
8flat - 

In all seriousness, NRA and Trump are making a mistake by not tackling the gunshow loophole.  Most americans, even NRA members, would get behind that IMO.


I no longer have any idea what people mean when they refer to a "gun show loophole."  A gun dealer at a gun show must conduct a background check the same as if they were selling the gun from their store.  

If you are referring to private sales between residents of the same state, yes, that can occur at a gun show, or a parking lot, or a driveway, etc.  There is nothing special about gunshows, other than for some reason they seem to scare anti-gun people ("oh my God, people show and sell guns!?").   

States can implement requirements for background checks in private sales, and some have already.  They don't need to have the Federal government do it.   The fact that most states have not done so, though, may reflect the general public's opinion on universal background checks. 

or, it reflects that state level politicals are as influenced by the NRA as federal politicians.

 

this has been polled many times, worded many different ways (never as "gun show loophole"), and always has 85%-90% support.

PPT backround checks are working great in Chicago. 

28 days ago
5/14/10
Posts: 6297
I voted for Trump and one of the reasons was because of his hands-off approach to guns. I must be a part of one of his "special interest" groups. I feel so special.
Edited: 28 days ago
6/13/03
Posts: 23783
Thelonious -
Fake Pie -
dabigchet -
AnthonyWeiner - There is no such thing as a "Gun Show Loophole". Completely made-up bullshit.

its a stupid name, but the concept of universal background check is not complicated. all gun sales, except for transfers within families, should go through the same background checks as one bought at a store.

There's a commerce clause issue with this being done at a federal level IMO. Won't stop anything either IMO. which shooter would have been foiled by such a system? 

see above

 

Adam lanza, parkland shooter and aurora shooter. All three were in the mental health system. In Canada for instance, if you are in the mental health system you are flagged. You could go see a mental health expert for anxiety once and anyone with access to your medical records will be able to see it like a police record. someone seeing a professional for violent tendencies (aurora) or someone who has had contact with professional's by making threats in the school system( parkland) would be flagged in a federal system like Canada's.

 

 

The parkland shooter wasn't allowed to carry backpacks at school but was allowed to buy a gun to put things in perspective. 

That results in a bunch of peple not going to see their doctors and then you also have to overcome HIIPA.

Parkland shooter was flagged numerous times and the local authorities failed to act. Same goes with a considerable number of othher shooters who should not have passed a backround check and did.

Edited: 28 days ago
3/20/15
Posts: 12291
Sogsteel - 
Thelonious -
Fake Pie -
dabigchet -
AnthonyWeiner - There is no such thing as a "Gun Show Loophole". Completely made-up bullshit.

its a stupid name, but the concept of universal background check is not complicated. all gun sales, except for transfers within families, should go through the same background checks as one bought at a store.

There's a commerce clause issue with this being done at a federal level IMO. Won't stop anything either IMO. which shooter would have been foiled by such a system? 

see above

 

Adam lanza, parkland shooter and aurora shooter. All three were in the mental health system. In Canada for instance, if you are in the mental health system you are flagged. You could go see a mental health expert for anxiety once and anyone with access to your medical records will be able to see it like a police record. someone seeing a professional for violent tendencies (aurora) or someone who has had contact with professional's by making threats in the school system( parkland) would be flagged in a federal system like Canada's.

 

 

The parkland shooter wasn't allowed to carry backpacks at school but was allowed to buy a gun to put things in perspective. 

That results in a bunch of peple not going to see their doctors and then you also have to overcome HIIPA.

Parkland shooter was flagged numerous times and the local authorities failed to act. Same goes with a considerable number of othher shooters who should not have passed a backround check and did.

 

I was treated for anxiety disorder for about 9 months, prescribed clonazepam....didn't prevent me from getting my PAL and RPAL.

 

Canada also has a similar loophole. I can sell a non-restricted rifle to anyone with the expectation that I ensured they had a legal PAL, but there is no requirement to prove that you checked the PAL.

28 days ago
11/25/10
Posts: 2332

OK sorry, forget gun show loophole and focus on private sales, require them to run the transaction through an FFL.  

I built my own AR and have an 80% receiver sitting in my closet, I'm not coming at this from a gun grabber stance, haha  just tired of nut jobs shooting up innocent people and getting half the country against us.

Edited: 28 days ago
6/13/03
Posts: 23784

Aurora mass shooter lost his gun license but kept his gun — as have thousands of other Illinoisans. Here's a look at what went wrong.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-aurora-shooting-gary-martin-gun-20190221-story.html%3foutputType=amp

 

FBI Says Background Check Error Let Charleston Shooting Suspect Buy Gun

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/07/10/421789047/fbi-says-background-check-error-let-charleston-shooting-suspect-buy-gun

 

The Texas Church Shooter Should Have Been Legally Barred From Owning Guns

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/11/06/562320017/the-texas-church-shooter-should-have-been-legally-barred-from-owning-guns

 

Parkland Shooting Suspect: A Story Of Red Flags, Ignored

https://www.npr.org/2018/02/28/589502906/a-clearer-picture-of-parkland-shooting-suspect-comes-into-focus

28 days ago
11/25/10
Posts: 2333
Sogsteel -

Aurora mass shooter lost his gun license but kept his gun — as have thousands of other Illinoisans. Here's a look at what went wrong.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-aurora-shooting-gary-martin-gun-20190221-story.html%3foutputType=amp

 

FBI Says Background Check Error Let Charleston Shooting Suspect Buy Gun

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/07/10/421789047/fbi-says-background-check-error-let-charleston-shooting-suspect-buy-gun

 

The Texas Church Shooter Should Have Been Legally Barred From Owning Guns

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/11/06/562320017/the-texas-church-shooter-should-have-been-legally-barred-from-owning-guns

 

Parkland Shooting Suspect: A Story Of Red Flags, Ignored

https://www.npr.org/2018/02/28/589502906/a-clearer-picture-of-parkland-shooting-suspect-comes-into-focus

And we obviously need better enforcement of the laws already in place.  This shit happens a lot.  Including the background checks themselves, the gov't fucks up a lot of those also.

28 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 96487
Thelonious - 
dabigchet -
AnthonyWeiner - There is no such thing as a "Gun Show Loophole". Completely made-up bullshit.

its a stupid name, but the concept of universal background check is not complicated. all gun sales, except for transfers within families, should go through the same background checks as one bought at a store.

I don't understand why anyone would be against this. First time I did it in Canada I thought it was a nuisance and then the first time I bought I used gun I couldn't believe that I had to do it again and now I don't care. It doesn't take that long. I'm not sure but the rifle I bought for my son went through super fast, so if you've gone through the process once before you must be fast tracked.

 

Background checks make sense; they are largely supported by the people, doesn't infringe of the rights of average citizens and might actually stop a mass shooting or two in the next ten years. Seems like such an obvious thing to get done, but it won't because the NRA lobby owns DC and markets ideology to their members.


After the background checks are in place, laws that brutally punish parents whose kids get access to their guns, and use them violently, might create an environment where there is less mass shootings. My son owns a gun, and knows how to use it, but he has no access to it.

 

Adam Lanza is the perfect example imo, he would have failed a background check and if he didn't have access to his mom's guns he would not have had the means to kill so many. The aurora shooter would have failed a background check, and so would the parkland shooter -- so that's at least three people.


Adam Lanza tried to buy a gun.  He was prevented from doing so because of his age. He would not have failed a background check if he had been of age since he had no felony history.  

The Aurora shooter and the Parkland shooter both passed a background check.  

  

28 days ago
5/14/10
Posts: 6299
8flat - 

OK sorry, forget gun show loophole and focus on private sales, require them to run the transaction through an FFL.  

I built my own AR and have an 80% receiver sitting in my closet, I'm not coming at this from a gun grabber stance, haha  just tired of nut jobs shooting up innocent people and getting half the country against us.


IIRC something like 80% of mass shooters bought their guns legally. That number might be slightly off, but it was at least in the 70s. Also, no one gives a shit if you own a gun. Why do gun grabbers always preamble their speech with "Now I am a gun owner, BUT..." or some similar cushion? Give it a rest we get it you want to have a say in who gets to own them. Owning a gun doesn't make your shitty opinion any better.
28 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 14858

Good. 

Edited: 28 days ago
2/2/12
Posts: 584
Rear Naked Bloke -

So what IS Trump going to do?

Cuck to special interests like the stooge he is. Look at all the dummies with answers, the orange cheeto wanted background check a couple days ago and got told. Pretty simple. 

28 days ago
8/7/12
Posts: 11110
Thelonious -
dabigchet -
AnthonyWeiner - There is no such thing as a "Gun Show Loophole". Completely made-up bullshit.

its a stupid name, but the concept of universal background check is not complicated. all gun sales, except for transfers within families, should go through the same background checks as one bought at a store.

I don't understand why anyone would be against this. First time I did it in Canada I thought it was a nuisance and then the first time I bought I used gun I couldn't believe that I had to do it again and now I don't care. It doesn't take that long. I'm not sure but the rifle I bought for my son went through super fast, so if you've gone through the process once before you must be fast tracked.

 

Background checks make sense; they are largely supported by the people, doesn't infringe of the rights of average citizens and might actually stop a mass shooting or two in the next ten years. Seems like such an obvious thing to get done, but it won't because the NRA lobby owns DC and markets ideology to their members.


After the background checks are in place, laws that brutally punish parents whose kids get access to their guns, and use them violently, might create an environment where there is less mass shootings. My son owns a gun, and knows how to use it, but he has no access to it.

 

Adam Lanza is the perfect example imo, he would have failed a background check and if he didn't have access to his mom's guns he would not have had the means to kill so many. The aurora shooter would have failed a background check, and so would the parkland shooter -- so that's at least three people.

You do realize that all 3 of those people had access to weapons and guns and a

28 days ago
6/13/03
Posts: 23785
greasegun -
Rear Naked Bloke -

So what IS Trump going to do?

Cuck to special interests like the stooge he is. Look at all the dummies with answers, the orange cheeto wanted background check a couple days ago and got told. Pretty simple. 

It aint cucking when you're doin the fuckin. How does it feel to watch cheeto man give it deep to your gun grabbing aspirations?

Edited: 28 days ago
12/2/05
Posts: 82830
Thelonious - 
Fake Pie -
dabigchet -
AnthonyWeiner - There is no such thing as a "Gun Show Loophole". Completely made-up bullshit.

its a stupid name, but the concept of universal background check is not complicated. all gun sales, except for transfers within families, should go through the same background checks as one bought at a store.

There's a commerce clause issue with this being done at a federal level IMO. Won't stop anything either IMO. which shooter would have been foiled by such a system? 

see above

 

Adam lanza, parkland shooter and aurora shooter. All three were in the mental health system. In Canada for instance, if you are in the mental health system you are flagged. You could go see a mental health expert for anxiety once and anyone with access to your medical records will be able to see it like a police record. someone seeing a professional for violent tendencies (aurora) or someone who has had contact with professional's by making threats in the school system( parkland) would be flagged in a federal system like Canada's.

 

 

The parkland shooter wasn't allowed to carry backpacks at school but was allowed to buy a gun to put things in perspective. 


Parkland was a failure by law enforcement. He could have been baker acted easily in Florida--an existing FL law meant to address this scenario. In any event, he passed the background check so how would adding more background checks have solved it?
He already was subject to a background check. The premise of universal background checks is shooters are buying guns without one... he passed one. The same one he would pass if there were universal background checks and he tried to use the mythical gunshow loophole--he'd still have passed. So it doesn't solve it.

Adam Lanza's mother was not disqualified from owning firearms. How would Adam being unable to buy a gun (which he already was) have prevented him from stealing his mother's gun?

Aurora--what gun did he buy without a background check?
Edited: 28 days ago
12/2/05
Posts: 82831
8flat - 
Sogsteel -

Aurora mass shooter lost his gun license but kept his gun -- as have thousands of other Illinoisans. Here's a look at what went wrong.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-aurora-shooting-gary-martin-gun-20190221-story.html%3foutputType=amp

 

FBI Says Background Check Error Let Charleston Shooting Suspect Buy Gun

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/07/10/421789047/fbi-says-background-check-error-let-charleston-shooting-suspect-buy-gun

 

The Texas Church Shooter Should Have Been Legally Barred From Owning Guns

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/11/06/562320017/the-texas-church-shooter-should-have-been-legally-barred-from-owning-guns

 

Parkland Shooting Suspect: A Story Of Red Flags, Ignored

https://www.npr.org/2018/02/28/589502906/a-clearer-picture-of-parkland-shooting-suspect-comes-into-focus

And we obviously need better enforcement of the laws already in place.  This shit happens a lot.  Including the background checks themselves, the gov't fucks up a lot of those also.


Agree. There are failures with the existing laws. Let's address those then see if we need more. Just adding more won't help. Then you'll just have a headline about how that one wasn't enforced right or a criminal just sidestepped it and bought illegally.
28 days ago
12/2/05
Posts: 82832
Sogsteel - 

Aurora mass shooter lost his gun license but kept his gun — as have thousands of other Illinoisans. Here's a look at what went wrong.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.chicagotribune.com/news/breaking/ct-aurora-shooting-gary-martin-gun-20190221-story.html%3foutputType=amp

 

FBI Says Background Check Error Let Charleston Shooting Suspect Buy Gun

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2015/07/10/421789047/fbi-says-background-check-error-let-charleston-shooting-suspect-buy-gun

 

The Texas Church Shooter Should Have Been Legally Barred From Owning Guns

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/11/06/562320017/the-texas-church-shooter-should-have-been-legally-barred-from-owning-guns

 

Parkland Shooting Suspect: A Story Of Red Flags, Ignored

https://www.npr.org/2018/02/28/589502906/a-clearer-picture-of-parkland-shooting-suspect-comes-into-focus


Also which one of these is solved by the universal BC proposal?
28 days ago
11/25/10
Posts: 2334
Freaky_Hibiki -
8flat - 

OK sorry, forget gun show loophole and focus on private sales, require them to run the transaction through an FFL.  

I built my own AR and have an 80% receiver sitting in my closet, I'm not coming at this from a gun grabber stance, haha  just tired of nut jobs shooting up innocent people and getting half the country against us.


IIRC something like 80% of mass shooters bought their guns legally. That number might be slightly off, but it was at least in the 70s. Also, no one gives a shit if you own a gun. Why do gun grabbers always preamble their speech with "Now I am a gun owner, BUT..." or some similar cushion? Give it a rest we get it you want to have a say in who gets to own them. Owning a gun doesn't make your shitty opinion any better.

Settle down francis, nobody is saying better more thorough background checks are going to eliminate mass shootings.  

We're seeing a slow shift in the general public's sentiment away from 2A support because of active shooter psychos.  This is the biggest threat to oru gun rights.  Once a big majority of the nation is against 2A, it's doomed.

How do you think it's a "shitty opinion" to believe someone who fails a background check shouldn't be able to own a gun?

 

28 days ago
11/25/10
Posts: 2335
Pura Vida -
8flat - 

In all seriousness, NRA and Trump are making a mistake by not tackling the gunshow loophole.  Most americans, even NRA members, would get behind that IMO.


Closing it also used to be NRA dogma.

That said, I wish they would just end all background checks of any sort.

Not good.  When a mentally deranged person buys a gun and makes headlines, it just pushes the general public's perception further to the left, and someday they're going to get enough votes to repeal 2A.

28 days ago
11/20/13
Posts: 8660
8flat -
Pura Vida -
8flat - 

In all seriousness, NRA and Trump are making a mistake by not tackling the gunshow loophole.  Most americans, even NRA members, would get behind that IMO.


Closing it also used to be NRA dogma.

That said, I wish they would just end all background checks of any sort.

Not good.  When a mentally deranged person buys a gun and makes headlines, it just pushes the general public's perception further to the left, and someday they're going to get enough votes to repeal 2A.

Shit, when you put it that way, we might actually need to do something about these mass killings. It's going to scare people into repealing 2A.

28 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 46395
8flat -

In all seriousness, NRA and Trump are making a mistake by not tackling the gunshow loophole.  Most americans, even NRA members, would get behind that IMO.

there is no such thing as a gun show loop hole. congress literally voted to allow private party transfers.  its gonna be really hard for me to make it to a FFL after I'm dead in order to transfer my guns to my kids

28 days ago
1/1/01
Posts: 46396
8flat -
Freaky_Hibiki -
8flat - 

OK sorry, forget gun show loophole and focus on private sales, require them to run the transaction through an FFL.  

I built my own AR and have an 80% receiver sitting in my closet, I'm not coming at this from a gun grabber stance, haha  just tired of nut jobs shooting up innocent people and getting half the country against us.


IIRC something like 80% of mass shooters bought their guns legally. That number might be slightly off, but it was at least in the 70s. Also, no one gives a shit if you own a gun. Why do gun grabbers always preamble their speech with "Now I am a gun owner, BUT..." or some similar cushion? Give it a rest we get it you want to have a say in who gets to own them. Owning a gun doesn't make your shitty opinion any better.

Settle down francis, nobody is saying better more thorough background checks are going to eliminate mass shootings.  

We're seeing a slow shift in the general public's sentiment away from 2A support because of active shooter psychos.  This is the biggest threat to oru gun rights.  Once a big majority of the nation is against 2A, it's doomed.

How do you think it's a "shitty opinion" to believe someone who fails a background check shouldn't be able to own a gun?

 

and that shift, if any is 100% due to lies and propaganda from the left.

funny,  full auto weapons have been around since the 20s, and other than in the 20s gangland shit, there werent any mass killings. i wonder what changed.

28 days ago
7/12/03
Posts: 10782
8flat - 

In all seriousness, NRA and Trump are making a mistake by not tackling the gunshow loophole.  Most americans, even NRA members, would get behind that IMO.


Is this a joke? There is no "gun show loophole"...never was.