PoliticalGround Israel just did a very stupid thing.

7/19/18 4:21 PM
9/4/08
Posts: 12344
DiscipleDojo - 

Israel has chosen ethnocracy over democracy. The two are incompatible in every way, despite Bibi and co.'s hollow rhetoric to the contrary. 

They killed the two state solution via the settlement enterprise, but now they have killed a one-state solution by effectively making non-Jews second-class citizens. 

OP is correct. It is utterly self-defeating.


There should be no "two state solution", as there already was, it's called Jordan. The Pals can return to Jordan, Egypt and the surrounding areas where most came from to begin with.

The pals only goal is to remove Israel from the face of the earth. It's ridiculous to believe they ever wanted a "solution.
7/19/18 4:37 PM
3/14/16
Posts: 17598
Munk -
DiscipleDojo - 

Israel has chosen ethnocracy over democracy. The two are incompatible in every way, despite Bibi and co.'s hollow rhetoric to the contrary. 

They killed the two state solution via the settlement enterprise, but now they have killed a one-state solution by effectively making non-Jews second-class citizens. 

OP is correct. It is utterly self-defeating.


There should be no "two state solution", as there already was, it's called Jordan. The Pals can return to Jordan, Egypt and the surrounding areas where most came from to begin with.

The pals only goal is to remove Israel from the face of the earth. It's ridiculous to believe they ever wanted a "solution.

# he forgot the sig 

# he's right though. 

7/19/18 4:44 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 43732
MattyECB -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. -

i dont see the issue.

i thought all of that was law already. it certainly was in practice, if not codified.

 

That's kind of the entire point. They've just codified the rational for their slowly building apartheid by implying it is the Jewish Israelis and not the Arabs that have a right to national self determination and a homeland in Israel. It is what it is. For how close they came to a two state solution, it's obvious now that Israel is just going to run out the palestinians and build settlements wherever the fuck they want. 

let me know when it happens

in the mean time, non jew citizens have 100% of the same rights as jews

 

7/19/18 4:45 PM
9/4/08
Posts: 12349
GHTT_WagonBurner331 - 
Munk -
DiscipleDojo - 

Israel has chosen ethnocracy over democracy. The two are incompatible in every way, despite Bibi and co.'s hollow rhetoric to the contrary. 

They killed the two state solution via the settlement enterprise, but now they have killed a one-state solution by effectively making non-Jews second-class citizens. 

OP is correct. It is utterly self-defeating.


There should be no "two state solution", as there already was, it's called Jordan. The Pals can return to Jordan, Egypt and the surrounding areas where most came from to begin with.

The pals only goal is to remove Israel from the face of the earth. It's ridiculous to believe they ever wanted a "solution.

# he forgot the sig 

# he's right though. 


Crap

#CRAP

Munk
©

7/19/18 4:47 PM
11/28/08
Posts: 18758

"Arabs make up 20% of the population of Israel. They have the exact same rights as Jews."

They did.

Not anymore.

7/19/18 4:47 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 43733
banco -

Now thst the two state solution is all but impossible Israel is going to become an apartheid state in any case.

are you retarded? serious question

how in the fuck does this stop gaza and the west bank from becoming a pal state?

jews were never giving up Jerusalem. camel fuckers would never let a jew into the city again

 

7/19/18 4:47 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 43734
anthonyMI -

"Arabs make up 20% of the population of Israel. They have the exact same rights as Jews."

They did.

Not anymore.

what rights dont they have?

7/19/18 4:52 PM
11/28/08
Posts: 18759

Most directly, the right to their language. Arabic was an official language. It no longer is.

More broadly, any rights they have as a group no longer exist. It doesn't sound like a big deal in the liberal west, but Israel basically still uses the millet system.

"how in the fuck does this stop gaza and the west bank from becoming a pal state?"

It codifies the idea that Arabs have no Right to Self Determination, meaning just that. It also says that settlements are a national goal.

7/19/18 4:54 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 31587
blood fist - 
Captain CargoCapris: Pitbull Apologist - 

Good for them. 

OP, you are literally Hitler. 


That's kind of a dumb post.

Anybody who has seen my posts knows that I am VERY pro-Israel.


Yeah, you know who else was 'very pro-Israel'...?


--Hitler!
7/19/18 4:58 PM
11/28/08
Posts: 18760

The decision also is time with several others that show that the government thinks that Israel is a country only for the Orthodox National Religious, everyone else be damned.

7/19/18 5:00 PM
2/23/05
Posts: 11754
This conversation. This very same one. This conversation that we're having RIGHT NOW. At this very moment.

Has been going on for over 70 years. Let that sink in for just a minute fraction of that time. Over. 70. YEARS.
7/19/18 5:03 PM
11/28/08
Posts: 18761
holly9000 - This conversation. This very same one. This conversation that we're having RIGHT NOW. At this very moment.

Has been going on for over 70 years. Let that sink in for just a minute fraction of that time. Over. 70. YEARS.

No it hasn't. For starters, Arabic was an official language of Israel for 70 years.

Edited: 7/19/18 5:06 PM
5/10/08
Posts: 36588
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. - 
MattyECB -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. -

i dont see the issue.

i thought all of that was law already. it certainly was in practice, if not codified.

That's kind of the entire point. They've just codified the rational for their slowly building apartheid by implying it is the Jewish Israelis and not the Arabs that have a right to national self determination and a homeland in Israel. It is what it is. For how close they came to a two state solution, it's obvious now that Israel is just going to run out the palestinians and build settlements wherever the fuck they want. 

let me know when it happens

in the mean time, non jew citizens have 100% of the same rights as jews

 

Except if you "bang" an Israeli Jewish girl and don't tell her you are an Israeli Arab:

"Rape by Deception"

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-10717186

Israeli Arab who 'raped' a woman says verdict 'racist'
 
The man convicted of rape is from East Jerusalem
 
An Arab man convicted in Israel of rape because he pretended he was a Jew when he had consensual sex with a Jewish woman has called the verdict racist.
 
Sabbar Kashur, 30, was found guilty of "rape by deception" by the Israeli court and sentenced to 18 months in jail.
 
According to the complaint filed by the woman, the two met in a Jerusalem street in 2008 and had sex that day.
 
When she discovered he was not Jewish, but an Arab, she went to the police.
 
Kashur was arrested and charged with rape and indecent assault, but the charges were later replaced by a different charge of "rape by deception".
 
If I were Jewish they wouldn't have even questioned me
 
But according to Kashur, he did not pretend to be Jewish.
 
He told reporters that he is known by friends and family by the nickname Dudu, which is more commonly used by Jews called David.
 
He has been under house arrest for two years, he said.
 
"If I were Jewish, they wouldn't have even questioned me," the Haaretz newspaper quoted him as saying.
 
"That's not called rape, I didn't rape her in the forest and and throw her away naked. She agreed to everything that happened."
 
'Unbearable price'
In the court's ruling the judge, Zvi Segal, wrote: "If she had not thought the accused was a Jewish bachelor interested in a serious relationship, she would not have co-operated.
 
"The court is obliged to protect the public interest from sophisticated, smooth-tongued criminals who can deceive innocent victims at an unbearable price - the sanctity of their bodies and souls."
 
But Kashur says events were different.
 
"I'd say she set upon me. She was interested in my motorcycle and so we talked. I didn't pretend."
'Problematic'
 
Every time a man tells a woman he loves her, based on which she sleeps with him, he could be convicted of rape.
 
There is a precedent in Israel for criminal charges being brought in such cases.
 
One man who told women he slept with he was a neurosurgeon in order to impress them was convicted of fraud.
 
A lawyer with the Public Defenders' Office said the court had gone too far.
 
"The test the court used is problematic," said Elkana Laist.
 
"Every time a man tells a woman he loves her, based on which she sleeps with him, he could be convicted of rape."
 
Kashur's lawyers say he will appeal against the sentence.  Around 20% of Israel's population are of Arab descent.
7/19/18 5:06 PM
8/19/12
Posts: 7721

They can do what they want. They control the world's banks. Nothing will be said. And carry on. Meanwhile..........Trump

7/19/18 5:08 PM
2/23/05
Posts: 11755
anthonyMI - 
holly9000 - This conversation. This very same one. This conversation that we're having RIGHT NOW. At this very moment.

Has been going on for over 70 years. Let that sink in for just a minute fraction of that time. Over. 70. YEARS.

No it hasn't. For starters, Arabic was an official language of Israel for 70 years.


What are you going on about? Who cares whether or not Arabic was an official language? This conversation's been going on in every language on Earth since the 40's
7/19/18 5:15 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 43735
anthonyMI -

Most directly, the right to their language. Arabic was an official language. It no longer is.

More broadly, any rights they have as a group no longer exist. It doesn't sound like a big deal in the liberal west, but Israel basically still uses the millet system.

"how in the fuck does this stop gaza and the west bank from becoming a pal state?"

It codifies the idea that Arabs have no Right to Self Determination, meaning just that. It also says that settlements are a national goal.

"Most directly, the right to their language. Arabic was an official language. It no longer is."

BWWWAHAAH - fuck off. Its not illegal to speak. they have every right to their language

The new law stipulates that Hebrew is “the state’s language” and demotes Arabic to “special status,” though it is a largely symbolic sleight since a subsequent clause says, “This clause does not harm the status given to the Arabic language before this law came into effect.”
 

"More broadly, any rights they have as a group no longer exist. It doesn't sound like a big deal in the liberal west, but Israel basically still uses the millet system."

Give me specific rights they had as a group they dont have now.

"it codifies the idea that Arabs have no Right to Self Determination, meaning just that."
where does the law say that?

"It also says that settlements are a national goal."
WRONG

the development of Jewish settlement as a national value.. not settlements, not it says nothing of where
 

 

Edited: 7/19/18 5:16 PM
11/28/08
Posts: 18762
holly9000 -
anthonyMI - 
holly9000 - This conversation. This very same one. This conversation that we're having RIGHT NOW. At this very moment.

Has been going on for over 70 years. Let that sink in for just a minute fraction of that time. Over. 70. YEARS.

No it hasn't. For starters, Arabic was an official language of Israel for 70 years.


What are you going on about? Who cares whether or not Arabic was an official language? This conversation's been going on in every language on Earth since the 40's

People in Israel care. Apparently the government cares very much.

7/19/18 5:16 PM
7/28/08
Posts: 731

My opinion is the Jewish people get a free pass for genocide and should just wipe those smelly Desert Rats from existence. 

7/19/18 5:22 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 43736
lionsoul -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. - 
MattyECB -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. -

i dont see the issue.

i thought all of that was law already. it certainly was in practice, if not codified.

That's kind of the entire point. They've just codified the rational for their slowly building apartheid by implying it is the Jewish Israelis and not the Arabs that have a right to national self determination and a homeland in Israel. It is what it is. For how close they came to a two state solution, it's obvious now that Israel is just going to run out the palestinians and build settlements wherever the fuck they want. 

let me know when it happens

in the mean time, non jew citizens have 100% of the same rights as jews

 

Except if you "bang" an Israeli Jewish girl and don't tell her you are an Israeli Arab:

"Rape by Deception"

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-10717186

Israeli Arab who 'raped' a woman says verdict 'racist'
 
The man convicted of rape is from East Jerusalem
 
An Arab man convicted in Israel of rape because he pretended he was a Jew when he had consensual sex with a Jewish woman has called the verdict racist.
 
Sabbar Kashur, 30, was found guilty of "rape by deception" by the Israeli court and sentenced to 18 months in jail.
 
According to the complaint filed by the woman, the two met in a Jerusalem street in 2008 and had sex that day.
 
When she discovered he was not Jewish, but an Arab, she went to the police.
 
Kashur was arrested and charged with rape and indecent assault, but the charges were later replaced by a different charge of "rape by deception".
 
If I were Jewish they wouldn't have even questioned me
 
But according to Kashur, he did not pretend to be Jewish.
 
He told reporters that he is known by friends and family by the nickname Dudu, which is more commonly used by Jews called David.
 
He has been under house arrest for two years, he said.
 
"If I were Jewish, they wouldn't have even questioned me," the Haaretz newspaper quoted him as saying.
 
"That's not called rape, I didn't rape her in the forest and and throw her away naked. She agreed to everything that happened."
 
'Unbearable price'
In the court's ruling the judge, Zvi Segal, wrote: "If she had not thought the accused was a Jewish bachelor interested in a serious relationship, she would not have co-operated.
 
"The court is obliged to protect the public interest from sophisticated, smooth-tongued criminals who can deceive innocent victims at an unbearable price - the sanctity of their bodies and souls."
 
But Kashur says events were different.
 
"I'd say she set upon me. She was interested in my motorcycle and so we talked. I didn't pretend."
'Problematic'
 
Every time a man tells a woman he loves her, based on which she sleeps with him, he could be convicted of rape.
 
There is a precedent in Israel for criminal charges being brought in such cases.
 
One man who told women he slept with he was a neurosurgeon in order to impress them was convicted of fraud.
 
A lawyer with the Public Defenders' Office said the court had gone too far.
 
"The test the court used is problematic," said Elkana Laist.
 
"Every time a man tells a woman he loves her, based on which she sleeps with him, he could be convicted of rape."
 
Kashur's lawyers say he will appeal against the sentence.  Around 20% of Israel's population are of Arab descent.

In Alabama, it’s against the law for a man to seduce “a chaste woman by means of temptation, deception, arts, flattery, or a promise of marriage.’’

 
 

 

Edited: 7/19/18 5:25 PM
11/28/08
Posts: 18763

"BWWWAHAAH - fuck off. Its not illegal to speak. they have every right to their language"

They have less right to it now than they did before, when it was an official language.

"Give me specific rights they had as a group they dont have now."

We will have to wait and see how the government chooses to interpret it. But when it is made explicit that Arabs do not have the same rights and you have people like Shaked and Bennet waiting for Bibi to retire, I don't have high hopes.

"the development of Jewish settlement as a national value.. not settlements, not it says nothing of where"

That is correct, it doesn't. But I don't think Bennet has Dimona at the top of his mind.

The way the law is written, it can be interpreted to mean absolutely nothing changes and Bibi did nothing more than win populist points. It can also be used to mean much more than that.

But my favorite part is that they accidentally got rid of a few holidays.

7/19/18 5:25 PM
5/10/08
Posts: 36589
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. - 
lionsoul -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. - 
MattyECB -
D.I.L.L.I.G.A.F. -

i dont see the issue.

i thought all of that was law already. it certainly was in practice, if not codified.

That's kind of the entire point. They've just codified the rational for their slowly building apartheid by implying it is the Jewish Israelis and not the Arabs that have a right to national self determination and a homeland in Israel. It is what it is. For how close they came to a two state solution, it's obvious now that Israel is just going to run out the palestinians and build settlements wherever the fuck they want. 

let me know when it happens

in the mean time, non jew citizens have 100% of the same rights as jews

 

Except if you "bang" an Israeli Jewish girl and don't tell her you are an Israeli Arab:

"Rape by Deception"

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-10717186

Israeli Arab who 'raped' a woman says verdict 'racist'
 
The man convicted of rape is from East Jerusalem
 
An Arab man convicted in Israel of rape because he pretended he was a Jew when he had consensual sex with a Jewish woman has called the verdict racist.
 
Sabbar Kashur, 30, was found guilty of "rape by deception" by the Israeli court and sentenced to 18 months in jail.
 
According to the complaint filed by the woman, the two met in a Jerusalem street in 2008 and had sex that day.
 
When she discovered he was not Jewish, but an Arab, she went to the police.
 
Kashur was arrested and charged with rape and indecent assault, but the charges were later replaced by a different charge of "rape by deception".
 
If I were Jewish they wouldn't have even questioned me
 
But according to Kashur, he did not pretend to be Jewish.
 
He told reporters that he is known by friends and family by the nickname Dudu, which is more commonly used by Jews called David.
 
He has been under house arrest for two years, he said.
 
"If I were Jewish, they wouldn't have even questioned me," the Haaretz newspaper quoted him as saying.
 
"That's not called rape, I didn't rape her in the forest and and throw her away naked. She agreed to everything that happened."
 
'Unbearable price'
In the court's ruling the judge, Zvi Segal, wrote: "If she had not thought the accused was a Jewish bachelor interested in a serious relationship, she would not have co-operated.
 
"The court is obliged to protect the public interest from sophisticated, smooth-tongued criminals who can deceive innocent victims at an unbearable price - the sanctity of their bodies and souls."
 
But Kashur says events were different.
 
"I'd say she set upon me. She was interested in my motorcycle and so we talked. I didn't pretend."
'Problematic'
 
Every time a man tells a woman he loves her, based on which she sleeps with him, he could be convicted of rape.
 
There is a precedent in Israel for criminal charges being brought in such cases.
 
One man who told women he slept with he was a neurosurgeon in order to impress them was convicted of fraud.
 
A lawyer with the Public Defenders' Office said the court had gone too far.
 
"The test the court used is problematic," said Elkana Laist.
 
"Every time a man tells a woman he loves her, based on which she sleeps with him, he could be convicted of rape."
 
Kashur's lawyers say he will appeal against the sentence.  Around 20% of Israel's population are of Arab descent.

In Alabama, it’s against the law for a man to seduce “a chaste woman by means of temptation, deception, arts, flattery, or a promise of marriage.’’

 
 

 


7/19/18 5:28 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 43737
anthonyMI -

"BWWWAHAAH - fuck off. Its not illegal to speak. they have every right to their language"

They have less right to it now than they did before, when it was an official language.

"Give me specific rights they had as a group they dont have now."

We will have to wait and see how the government chooses to interpret it. But when it is made explicit that Arabs do not have the same rights and you have people like Shaked and Bennet waiting for Bibi to retire, I don't have high hopes.

"the development of Jewish settlement as a national value.. not settlements, not it says nothing of where"

That is correct, it doesn't. But I don't think Bennet has Dimona at the top of his mind.

The way the law is written, it can be interpreted to mean absolutely nothing changes and Bibi did nothing more than win populist points. It can also be used to mean much more than that.

But my favorite part is that they accidentally got rid of a few holidays.

They have less right to it now than they did before, when it was an official language.

WRONG for the 10th time

What right is lost. what is now prevented from happening.

Nothing changed at all. period

"We will have to wait and see how the government chooses to interpret it"

Then STFU and stop saying how they dont have rights anymore

 

Edited: 7/19/18 5:30 PM
11/28/08
Posts: 18764

If nothing changes, why bother passing a Basic Law? There aren't very many of those.

This is the Israeli version of a constitutional amendment. 

7/19/18 5:34 PM
11/28/09
Posts: 37539

In this thread, OP thinks he's smarter than he actually is.

Edited: 7/19/18 5:36 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 33251