UnderGround Forums Potential conflict of interest found for Joe Soliz

2/18/20 11:43 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 62812

MMA centers on highlights, but every highlight has the other side. UFC 247 may prove to be a pivotal moment in the sport - longstanding issues around officiating may be aggressively addressed. But if it does, the impetus will have come from the other side of a highlight.

Judge Joe Soliz scored the Jon Jones vs. Dominick Reyes fight 4-1 for Jones, something commentator Joe Rogan correctly characterized as “insane.” Soliz scored every round of Jonathan Martinez vs. Andre Ewell for Ewell, who ended up winning a Split Decision; that one Rogan called “ridiculous.” And Soliz gave Trevin Giles Round 1 vs. James Krause, despite Giles spending a significant portion of the round defending a rear-naked choke.

Now TSN’s Aaron Bronsteter reports that sitting in Giles corner was Elite MMA gym founder Eric Williams, who awarded Soliz his black belt. Soliz taught at Williams' gym as early as 2002 and started training there in the early 1990s.

Bronsteter asked Soliz if he should have disclosed the relationship to the Texas Combative Sports Program.

“I haven’t been in contact or associated with [Elite MMA ] in over eight years,” said Soliz. “Under Eric Williams of Elite MMA, I received my black belt in 2008. I left Elite in 2010, and received my first-, second-, and third-degree under Octavio Couto.” 

Bronsteter also spoke with Williams. 

“I’ve known Joe for years,” said the coach. “I haven’t talked to him in probably a year and a half or two years. The problem is it's kind of a small world, so you get people crossing paths and I think that you're going to have stuff like that happen. Whenever you can prevent it, I would. But again, I don't worry about it. If you finish the fight, you don't have to worry about those kinds of things. I really don't concern myself with it."

Bronsteter asked Williams if Soliz should have disclosed the potential conflict of interest to the Texas commission.

“I’m assuming they all know,” replied Williams. “We’ve all been around for years. I would be highly surprised if the boxing commission doesn’t know.”

The term “MMA journalist” has become something of a joke to the hardcore MMA fanbase, but Bronsteter is a real journalist, and spoke as well with Texas Combative Sports Program spokesperson Tela Mange.

“When [a judge is] approached to be part of the event, they are supposed to tell the commission, ‘I can't judge a particular bout because I know somebody,’ or if it's something that there are a number of conflicts, then they need to tell the commission,” said Mange. “We have a number of judges that we can rely on. We get input from the UFC or any other promoter that we’re doing events with for people that they would prefer and we just go from there.”

And if you have a question about MMA officiating, there is no one more qualified to speak with than the Dean of MMA Referees, “Big” John McCarthy, who offered a straight answer.

“The judge should have approached the athletic commission, depending on if the executive director is there or a lead inspector, the person that’s in charge of regulating that event at that venue that night,” said McCarthy. “If they found out while they’re there that this person is cornering someone and they see that they’re assigned to that fight, they should go to the executive director and tell them, ‘I have trained with that person, I have received my black belt from them and I want to recuse myself from this fight.’ Then it’s up to the commission on whether or not they can judge. Most will never allow you to judge a fight when you have that sort of background with a cornerman or fighter.”

Krause’s management plans to appeal the decision.

Edited: 2/18/20 11:46 PM
1/6/10
Posts: 16155

Anyone else not score the first round for Krause?

2/19/20 12:08 AM
1/6/13
Posts: 6553
Letibleu -

Anyone else not score the first round for Krause?

What did Giles to win that round ? I am genuinely curious to see what somebody else’s opinion is. I am little biased towards Krause but man I don’t see how he didn’t easily win that first round. 

2/19/20 12:33 AM
3/10/15
Posts: 79

First round was Krause without question 

2/19/20 8:13 AM
8/4/10
Posts: 35225

Sketchy shit... he'll never admit to playing favoritism though...but it looks like that's exactly what happened

2/19/20 9:24 AM
1/1/01
Posts: 62818

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If this isn’t the most frustrating shit for me in the world I don’t know what... how is this not a conflict of interest? Training at someone’s gym for 10+ years and receiving a black belt from the coach corner my opponent. I no way am I mad I lost the fight, it was close. 1 was mine, 2 was his, and 3 was a toss up. But round 3 was given to me on 2/3 cards. It was round 1 they scored for him. After a take down and almost 4 minutes of back control, not to mention almost finishing the RNC, I don’t know how they would give that round to him. This sport has been around for too long to not start making changes. I know the Texas State Athletic Commission wont do a damn thing about my fight. They never do but I hope the @ufc, @danawhite, and the state commissions can come together to actually make the judging for OUR sport, not boxing and hold the people doing these jobs accountable. This is a disgrace to our sport. Not just my fight but multiple examples of incompetence from the same judge. So frustrated to even read this shit... and remember I lost half my purse because of this guy.

A post shared by James Krause (@thejameskrause) on

2/19/20 9:56 AM
6/14/12
Posts: 4963

Fuck soliz pretending that doesnt matter. 

Let him explain on his own words how and why he scored the first rd for giles.  Should be good for lolz.

2/19/20 10:27 AM
3/15/10
Posts: 329

This is corruption or negligent ignorance. The commission should know of potential conflicts of interest and not assign any official to a fight there is a hint of conflict of interest. There are (or should be) enough officials in this day and age where conflicts can be avoided. Some years ago when our sport was a small community it was hard to avoid, but not now. 

The fight should now be looked at by an independent body (if such a body exists) and the result re examined. To not give James Krause the first round is either gross incompetence or blatant conflict of interest. Either way the final result should be recalculated. The win portion of the purse should be held (if it’s not too late) until an impartial body examines this mess and decides a fair and just course of action. 

Are State Commissions accountable to any other authority or are they the law unto themselves?  Who can a wronged fighter appeal to with any hope of a fair investigation?  Who has power to correct results occurring from improper actions by Commissions and/or their appointed officials?  Maybe the State Attorney General, a State Ethics Board?

2/19/20 10:36 AM
2/24/11
Posts: 7128

And that's exactly why ex fighters can't be judges.

2/19/20 11:19 AM
12/10/09
Posts: 193
GrindOnLine -

And that's exactly why ex fighters can't be judges.

Isn’t Ricardo almeida a judge?

2/19/20 12:53 PM
2/11/20
Posts: 4
GrindOnLine -

And that's exactly why ex fighters can't be judges.

How do you get competent judging wo judges who have trained and fought I'm the past?

2/19/20 4:00 PM
12/26/13
Posts: 924
Frederick Ettish -

This is corruption or negligent ignorance. The commission should know of potential conflicts of interest and not assign any official to a fight there is a hint of conflict of interest. There are (or should be) enough officials in this day and age where conflicts can be avoided. Some years ago when our sport was a small community it was hard to avoid, but not now. 

The fight should now be looked at by an independent body (if such a body exists) and the result re examined. To not give James Krause the first round is either gross incompetence or blatant conflict of interest. Either way the final result should be recalculated. The win portion of the purse should be held (if it’s not too late) until an impartial body examines this mess and decides a fair and just course of action. 

Are State Commissions accountable to any other authority or are they the law unto themselves?  Who can a wronged fighter appeal to with any hope of a fair investigation?  Who has power to correct results occurring from improper actions by Commissions and/or their appointed officials?  Maybe the State Attorney General, a State Ethics Board?

You're the man. Preach on. 

Edited: 2/19/20 4:09 PM
12/3/19
Posts: 12

There was no favouritism. The guy just doesn't know how to judge and wasnt watching the fights.

2/19/20 7:53 PM
12/29/18
Posts: 2637

100% conflict of interest. That judge should have disclosed his ties. He should be banned from judging

2/19/20 7:57 PM
11/28/03
Posts: 109439

this part was hard to believe 

 

 

Who is Joe Soliz?
Based in Texas, Soliz is a 60-year-old MMA instructor and coach who has been officiating MMA events since the early 2000s. Prior to his judging career, Soliz supposedly trained in numerous traditional mixed martial arts and became a black belt in five of them.

Per the TX 3rd Coast MMA gym website, Soliz’s achievements within martial arts include “Black Belt and Professor in Jiu Jitsu, Full Instructor in Jeet Kune Do, Black Belt in Judo, Black Belt in Tai Kwon Do, Golden Gloves Champion, Professional and Amateur Boxing Coach, Professional and Amateur MMA Coach, and Certified Referee.”

[?IMG]

Following his career as a martial artist, Soliz moved into coaching, founding the TX 3rd Coast MMA gym with his family, and most recently has made the transition into MMA judging. In order to do this, Soliz trained under former UFC judge Doc Hamilton, who also gained notoriety for several poor decisions including his involvement in Lyoto Machida’s victory over Shogun Rua at UFC 104.

2/20/20 11:49 AM
2/6/11
Posts: 387

 

2/20/20 12:02 PM
4/8/07
Posts: 40758
https://imgur.com/a/8zYr1wh#lzhO0AY

he is facebook friends with the guy he said won all 3 rounds against Krause
2/20/20 2:08 PM
11/28/03
Posts: 109447

Edited: 2/20/20 7:26 PM
11/24/13
Posts: 1764

oops, wrong thread. Delete.

 

 

 

2/20/20 8:16 PM
3/2/11
Posts: 46928

Judges not watching fights, judges with links to with fighters... oh commissions, you so shady

2/20/20 8:52 PM
6/14/12
Posts: 4976
ranier wolfcastle -

Lol.

 

Has he explained yet, in any amount of detail how he scored the 1st rd for giles ? And if so, has he explained how such a conclusion fell within the judging criteria/ parameters?

2/22/20 12:02 AM
9/24/18
Posts: 3219
Michael De Santa - 

Who cares?


Not sure how the concept of this thread is flying over your head tbh. 

Fight should 100% be ruled a no contest and the judge should be suspended. 

2/22/20 12:08 AM
5/13/05
Posts: 5321

He was the worst judge of the night. If his experience is as extensive as listed on his profile then he must be blind.

2/22/20 10:22 AM
6/14/12
Posts: 4988
cyberc92 -

He was the worst judge of the night. If his experience is as extensive as listed on his profile then he must be blind.

Or corrupt

3/4/20 1:34 PM
1/6/13
Posts: 6558

Did anything come of this ?