UnderGround Forums The culture of extreme weight cutting is insane

2/18/20 11:48 AM
1/1/01
Posts: 62796

In what other sport do you reduce yourself to the point you cannot walk, just one day before you have to reach the highest performance level imaginable? And in MMA is a hurting game, where you are trying to traumatize your opponent's brain, and weight cutting causes the brain to shrink, so it no longer sits snugly inside the cranium, and is thus subject to more trauma.

2/18/20 11:48 AM
1/1/01
Posts: 62797

2/18/20 1:22 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 11514

Boxing and wrestling also have cultures of extreme weight cutting. There is a relatively simple way to end it. It won’t work on most regional shows, but the bigger promotions can definitely do it. I’ve posted it here before:

 

7 days out, no more than 5% over weight class. 5 days out, no more than 3% over. Day before make weight. Day of fight, no more than 5% over weight class. 
 

itll look like this:

 

7 days out for Lightweight: 162.75

5 days out for Lightweight: 159.65

Day of weigh ins: 155

Day of fight: 162.75

 

7 days out for welterweight: 178.5

5 days out for Welterweight: 175.1

Day of weigh Ins: 170

Day of Fight: 178.5

 

7 days out for HWT: 278.25

5 days out for HWT: 272.95

day I’d weigh ins: 265

day of fight: 278.25

 

The issue with weight cuttinging at present is that you only have to make weight and then you can rehydrate. This leads to drastic drops and massive gains after weigh ins. Neither are good for you as a Competitor or as a human being. My plan forces a person to be within a reasonable distance of their desired weight class for extended periods. Those cutting massive weight simply cannot sustain the cut for that amount of time which will force them to move up.

2/18/20 1:25 PM
4/24/18
Posts: 56
I did weight cutting for high school and college wrestling and it was no where near what they do today and I hated it. For High school I was thinking I would still grow and losing 10 pounds each meet
2/18/20 3:18 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 11516

I cut a lot of weight. In Hs, it was an average of 15lbs per meet. In college, it was more until they changed the rules due to deaths around the country. 

2/18/20 4:27 PM
4/21/12
Posts: 9313

Ohio has taken a step in the right direction, although I doubt they actually have second weigh-ins, since they're discretionary and not required.

 Ohio Adminstrative Code 3773-7-03 Weigh-in Procedures:

(E) When a weigh-in is conducted the day prior to the event, with the exception of the heavyweight and super heavyweight class, all other contestants may be required to weigh-in at a second weigh-in the next day scheduled by the commission within eight hours of the starting time of the event. Contestants weighing one hundred fifty-five pounds and lower will not be permitted to exceed the weight of the previous weigh-in by more than ten pounds. A contestant weighing more than one hundred fifty-five pounds will not be permitted to gain more than thirteen pounds, from their recorded weight from the day prior. The random second day weigh-in will be at the discretion of the executive director.

.

At UFC 241, held in California, Manny Bermudez weighed in at 140 pounds for a catchweight fight with Casey Kenney. On the night of the fight he weighed 164.8 pounds, a gain of almost 25 pounds.

On the same card, Sodiq Yusuff went from 145 at the weigh-in to 169.2 on fight day.

They weren't really exceptions. A number of fighters gained more than 10% of their weigh-in weight. Story here. A lot of the fighters on the card might have had a problem if the Ohio rules were applied.

2/18/20 5:18 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 47532
Kirik -

In what other sport do you reduce yourself to the point you cannot walk, just one day before you have to reach the highest performance level imaginable? And in MMA is a hurting game, where you are trying to traumatize your opponent's brain, and weight cutting causes the brain to shrink, so it no longer sits snugly inside the cranium, and is thus subject to more trauma.

wrestling, boxing, pretty much any sport with weight limits

2/18/20 8:51 PM
7/28/09
Posts: 423

I agree extreme weight cutting is insane. I’m a purist tho. I look at the fight as a personal test to basically see whose ass I could kick and whom I could not. Unfortunately it was not so much in my case :) I feel if u want to be a great fighter, the weight cut/size advantage should not be a factor in ur thought process. Just fight.  JUST BLEED!!!

2/18/20 8:58 PM
9/19/13
Posts: 7830
GuttyProfessor -

Boxing and wrestling also have cultures of extreme weight cutting. There is a relatively simple way to end it. It won’t work on most regional shows, but the bigger promotions can definitely do it. I’ve posted it here before:

 

7 days out, no more than 5% over weight class. 5 days out, no more than 3% over. Day before make weight. Day of fight, no more than 5% over weight class. 
 

itll look like this:

 

7 days out for Lightweight: 162.75

5 days out for Lightweight: 159.65

Day of weigh ins: 155

Day of fight: 162.75

 

7 days out for welterweight: 178.5

5 days out for Welterweight: 175.1

Day of weigh Ins: 170

Day of Fight: 178.5

 

7 days out for HWT: 278.25

5 days out for HWT: 272.95

day I’d weigh ins: 265

day of fight: 278.25

 

The issue with weight cuttinging at present is that you only have to make weight and then you can rehydrate. This leads to drastic drops and massive gains after weigh ins. Neither are good for you as a Competitor or as a human being. My plan forces a person to be within a reasonable distance of their desired weight class for extended periods. Those cutting massive weight simply cannot sustain the cut for that amount of time which will force them to move up.

Yes. All this.

2/18/20 9:52 PM
10/27/03
Posts: 25463

DC wasn't exactly shredded at 205.
2/19/20 5:02 PM
12/28/14
Posts: 6376

Of course a liberal wouldn’t know anything about doing whatever it takes to win

2/19/20 7:32 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 4786

How to Prevent Death

2/19/20 11:32 PM
1/28/19
Posts: 28

This is a uniquely American phenomenon.  Doing whatever it takes to fight the smallest man possible.

Edited: 2/21/20 12:39 AM
9/8/02
Posts: 24481

Just fight at your weight, stop gaming the system. the Diaz bothers are big as fuck, they walk around at 180-200 but fight in a midget twink weight McGregor has a small frame, but he makes himself look like a concentration camp victim when in reality, he too probably walks around at 170-180...He at least went up and down, but some of these guys are just gaming the system and want a massive fight night size advantage.

The one who cuts the most weight should get to fight, but they have to have a temporary tattoo of a vagina on their forehead. 

2/21/20 12:40 AM
9/8/02
Posts: 24482
Stray Dog - 

This is a uniquely American phenomenon.  Doing whatever it takes to fight the smallest man possible.


ding ding ding

2/21/20 2:16 PM
12/28/14
Posts: 6378
jcblass -
Stray Dog - 

This is a uniquely American phenomenon.  Doing whatever it takes to fight the smallest man possible.


ding ding ding

Doing everything you can to win is an American Phenomenon. However the Brazilians and Russians are also pretty good at cutting weight. 
 

Khabib is an enormous LW, moraes and aldo are very large BW.

So who in your opinion is honorable enough to not cut weight?

2/21/20 2:27 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 15376
in NC for HS wrestling you can only lose a certain percentage between official weigh ins. At the beginning of the season you need to do a hydration test to determine how much you can lose overall.
2/21/20 3:42 PM
12/28/14
Posts: 1762

They are grown men. If they wanna put themselves through that. Its on them.

 

 

2/21/20 9:23 PM
7/10/02
Posts: 22644
GuttyProfessor - 

Boxing and wrestling also have cultures of extreme weight cutting. There is a relatively simple way to end it. It won’t work on most regional shows, but the bigger promotions can definitely do it. I’ve posted it here before:

 

7 days out, no more than 5% over weight class. 5 days out, no more than 3% over. Day before make weight. Day of fight, no more than 5% over weight class. 
 

itll look like this:

 

7 days out for Lightweight: 162.75

5 days out for Lightweight: 159.65

Day of weigh ins: 155

Day of fight: 162.75

 

7 days out for welterweight: 178.5

5 days out for Welterweight: 175.1

Day of weigh Ins: 170

Day of Fight: 178.5

 

7 days out for HWT: 278.25

5 days out for HWT: 272.95

day I’d weigh ins: 265

day of fight: 278.25

 

The issue with weight cuttinging at present is that you only have to make weight and then you can rehydrate. This leads to drastic drops and massive gains after weigh ins. Neither are good for you as a Competitor or as a human being. My plan forces a person to be within a reasonable distance of their desired weight class for extended periods. Those cutting massive weight simply cannot sustain the cut for that amount of time which will force them to move up.


Way too complex AND you don't want more bouts cancelled.


Instead have drastic paycuts if you are 10-15-20-25+ pounds over the limit come fight time - of course the more you are over the limit, the harsher the fines. That's it.


2/22/20 2:53 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 11520
Sprawl'n'Stall -
GuttyProfessor - 

Boxing and wrestling also have cultures of extreme weight cutting. There is a relatively simple way to end it. It won’t work on most regional shows, but the bigger promotions can definitely do it. I’ve posted it here before:

 

7 days out, no more than 5% over weight class. 5 days out, no more than 3% over. Day before make weight. Day of fight, no more than 5% over weight class. 
 

itll look like this:

 

7 days out for Lightweight: 162.75

5 days out for Lightweight: 159.65

Day of weigh ins: 155

Day of fight: 162.75

 

7 days out for welterweight: 178.5

5 days out for Welterweight: 175.1

Day of weigh Ins: 170

Day of Fight: 178.5

 

7 days out for HWT: 278.25

5 days out for HWT: 272.95

day I’d weigh ins: 265

day of fight: 278.25

 

The issue with weight cuttinging at present is that you only have to make weight and then you can rehydrate. This leads to drastic drops and massive gains after weigh ins. Neither are good for you as a Competitor or as a human being. My plan forces a person to be within a reasonable distance of their desired weight class for extended periods. Those cutting massive weight simply cannot sustain the cut for that amount of time which will force them to move up.


Way too complex AND you don't want more bouts cancelled.


Instead have drastic paycuts if you are 10-15-20-25+ pounds over the limit come fight time - of course the more you are over the limit, the harsher the fines. That's it.


Respectfully, I disagree. Fighters want to fight. When they’ve completed a fight camp and done their job, they are very likely to fight even if their opponent lacks the professionalism to do the same and make weight properly. Fines mean little. Depriving the fighter of the chance to fight is what it will take. Ultimately, we won’t see many more bouts cancelled. Instead, we will see people who are truly living right enter the rich/cage. Quality of fights will improve. Less injuries is also a likely outcome. All of these things ultimately favor the fighter in the long term. That should be the goal. Fighters will fight, often to their own detriment. Preventing that is where it’s at, IMO. Fighter safety first.

2/22/20 3:06 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 47699
cruedi - in NC for HS wrestling you can only lose a certain percentage between official weigh ins. At the beginning of the season you need to do a hydration test to determine how much you can lose overall.

so does ny and most states.Ive actually seen kids naturally too skinny and needed to gain But its the right concept .

2/22/20 3:28 PM
10/27/18
Posts: 38
GuttyProfessor -

Boxing and wrestling also have cultures of extreme weight cutting. There is a relatively simple way to end it. It won’t work on most regional shows, but the bigger promotions can definitely do it. I’ve posted it here before:

 

7 days out, no more than 5% over weight class. 5 days out, no more than 3% over. Day before make weight. Day of fight, no more than 5% over weight class. 
 

itll look like this:

 

7 days out for Lightweight: 162.75

5 days out for Lightweight: 159.65

Day of weigh ins: 155

Day of fight: 162.75

 

7 days out for welterweight: 178.5

5 days out for Welterweight: 175.1

Day of weigh Ins: 170

Day of Fight: 178.5

 

7 days out for HWT: 278.25

5 days out for HWT: 272.95

day I’d weigh ins: 265

day of fight: 278.25

 

The issue with weight cuttinging at present is that you only have to make weight and then you can rehydrate. This leads to drastic drops and massive gains after weigh ins. Neither are good for you as a Competitor or as a human being. My plan forces a person to be within a reasonable distance of their desired weight class for extended periods. Those cutting massive weight simply cannot sustain the cut for that amount of time which will force them to move up.

I like the multiple requirements leading up to the fight. Butnif you’re doing that there’s no need for day of requirements.  That would be counterproductive to the whole point of being at your healthiest on fight day 

2/22/20 3:32 PM
10/27/18
Posts: 39
Kirik -

To be fair DC could have easily lost another 5-8 lbs of fight going into his light heavy training camps. 

2/22/20 3:38 PM
10/27/18
Posts: 40

It’s funny, people have been talking forever about how it’s an unhealthy practice, but it wasn’t until conor moves up in weight and started losing to guys that walk around ten lbs heavier than him, that people started acting like being big for a weight is dishonorable or Cheating. 

2/22/20 4:17 PM
1/1/01
Posts: 47700

cutting a lot of weight backfires as much as it helps ..Its probly best to be close to your weight but name of the game is to compete at your best at the lowest weight were you are physically well enough to compete after ehydrating and eating .Any sport with wieight is a tough sport